new way to get an antique status letter wtf?

burnt_servo said:
and have them sue you for infringement of their trademark logo ????
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Sounds more like that would be tantamount to forgery. I'm not trying to do that, I just want some printed material stating my guns qualify as antiques under the law without going through the CFC BS.
 
41 Colt said:
Sounds more like that would be tantamount to forgery. I'm not trying to do that, I just want some printed material stating my guns qualify as antiques under the law without going through the CFC BS.
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what you printed out is very much what i was thinking about , basicly , it would educate the person you are showing the letter to , and it looks professional .

there was some very intesting wording father just below the antique status part in the law that i would be tempted to add .... i just can't remember it off hand ( if i can find it i'll edit this post and add it in )

something that looks professional or official will carry much more weight than a few notes scribbled on a crumpled piece of paper , even if they say the same exact thing .

i might be tempted to add this wording onto a second page ;

" Under the current legislation, "any antique firearm" (including, apparently, a loaded one) is not a "firearm" for the following purposes:

◦1. Firearms Act: None of the provisions of the Firearms Act, including those requiring registration, licences, ATTs and/or ATCs, apply to any "antique firearm."
◦2. CC s. 91 and 92: Possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal.
3. CC s. 93: Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location is legal.

◦4. CC s. 94: Being in a motor vehicle with any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.
◦6. CC s. 99: Transferring or offering to transfer any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦7. CC s. 100: Dealing in any type of any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦8. CC s. 101: Transferring any "antique firearm" is legal if the transfer apparently violates the Firearms Act.
◦9. CC s. 103 and 104: Importing or exporting any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦10. CC s. 105: Not reporting the loss or finding of any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦11. CC s. 106 and 107: Not reporting the destruction of any "antique firearm" is legal, and knowingly making a false report of that type to a firearms official or the police is legal.
◦12. CC s. 117.03: A peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is not authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, and/or ATC. "

i found this at http://www.nfa.ca/node/130
copy of the criminal code can be found here ;
http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/laws/stat/rsc-1985-c-c-46/latest/rsc-1985-c-c-46.html
 
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Look forward to the RCMP "magically" redefining what "antiques" are, with CPC blessing of course.

Assuming that the firearm isn't being imported, you'll have to prove that in court. Because after all the onus is on YOU to prove that the firearm is an antique.
 
RobSmith said:
Look forward to the RCMP "magically" redefining what "antiques" are, with CPC blessing of course.
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Yeah you never know. I certainly won't be standing in line to register mine if they are suddenly restricted class.

Burntservo, that's some good info you found, I may work some of it into my letter.
 
burnt_servo said:
◦2. CC s. 91 and 92: Possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal.
3. CC s. 93: Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location is legal.

◦4. CC s. 94: Being in a motor vehicle with any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦5. CC s. 95: Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" (which is also a "restricted firearm" or a "prohibited firearm"), or one with readily accessible ammunition is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.
◦6. CC s. 99: Transferring or offering to transfer any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦7. CC s. 100: Dealing in any type of any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦8. CC s. 101: Transferring any "antique firearm" is legal if the transfer apparently violates the Firearms Act.
◦9. CC s. 103 and 104: Importing or exporting any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦10. CC s. 105: Not reporting the loss or finding of any "antique firearm" is legal.
◦11. CC s. 106 and 107: Not reporting the destruction of any "antique firearm" is legal, and knowingly making a false report of that type to a firearms official or the police is legal.
◦12. CC s. 117.03: A peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is not authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, and/or ATC. "
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I can't find in the CC where is says this. EDIT: Nevermind, I found it, this legal stuff is hard to read.
 
41 Colt said:
I can't find in the CC where is says this. EDIT: Nevermind, I found it, this legal stuff is hard to read.
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under section 84 of the criminal code , subsection 3 , it states in part ;

----------------

" (3) For the purposes of sections 91 to 95, 99 to 101, 103 to 107 and 117.03 of this Act and the provisions of the Firearms Act, the following weapons are deemed not to be firearms:

(a) any antique firearm; "

----------------------


..... it goes on to list a few more things .......



one of the links i made in a previous post was to the " nfa " which reworded sections 91 to 95, 99 to 101, 103 to 107 and 117.03 to say what IS legal in reference to a antique firearm .

it took me awhile to get my head wrapped around it too.
but i really like how the nfa has worded it and would be really tempted to put that on a " antique letter " .
 
I think if a letter is written by joe schmoe without a letterhead it looks sketchy and would not help with any police encounter; I think it would be better to just carry a printout of the relevant regulations and a copy of any proof of the date of manufacture if you have it.
 
How about this?

ANTIQUE FIREARM STATUS​


This firearm meets the definition of an "antique firearm" as set out in the Criminal Code of Canada under subsection 84(1). Pursuant to subsection 84(3)(a) of the Criminal Code of Canada "antique firearms" are deemed not to be a firearm.

For the purposes of sections 91 - 95 of the Criminal Code of Canada possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal. Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location including being in a motor vehicle is legal. Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" or one with ammunition that is readily accessible is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

Under section 117.03 of the Criminal Code of Canada no peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.


Rifles:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges (whether with a smooth or rifled bore), have a bore diameter of 8.3 mm or greater, measured from land to land in the case of a rifled bore, with the exception of a repeating firearm fed by any type of cartridge magazine

Shotguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than 10, 12, 16, 20, 28, or 410 gauge cartridges

Handguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson; 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges


Make:

Model:

Serial Number:

Caliber:
 
41 Colt said:
How about this?

ANTIQUE FIREARM STATUS​


This firearm meets the definition of an "antique firearm" as set out in the Criminal Code of Canada under subsection 84(1). Pursuant to subsection 84(3)(a) of the Criminal Code of Canada "antique firearms" are deemed not to be a firearm.

For the purposes of sections 91 - 95 of the Criminal Code of Canada possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal. Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location including being in a motor vehicle is legal. Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" or one with ammunition that is readily accessible is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

Under section 117.03 of the Criminal Code of Canada no peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.


Rifles:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges (whether with a smooth or rifled bore), have a bore diameter of 8.3 mm or greater, measured from land to land in the case of a rifled bore, with the exception of a repeating firearm fed by any type of cartridge magazine

Shotguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than 10, 12, 16, 20, 28, or 410 gauge cartridges

Handguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson; 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges


Make:

Model:

Serial Number:

Caliber:
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good job
i don't know if you can get much closer to perfect :)

anyone know of a lawyer who very experienced and specialises in firearms law ?
the idea would be to run this by him , from the point of view what can a officer do to a person found carrying a antique revolver after he is presented with the " letter " stating the legal staus of the revovler .

meaning is there something we might be missing , and how would we head it off at the pass so to speak , and preventing it from turning into a court case and complaints filed against the officer involved .
 
41 Colt said:
How about this?

ANTIQUE FIREARM STATUS​


This firearm meets the definition of an "antique firearm" as set out in the Criminal Code of Canada under subsection 84(1). Pursuant to subsection 84(3)(a) of the Criminal Code of Canada "antique firearms" are deemed not to be a firearm.

For the purposes of sections 91 - 95 of the Criminal Code of Canada possession of any "antique firearm" without a licence or registration certificate is legal. Possession of any "antique firearm" at any location including being in a motor vehicle is legal. Being in possession of a loaded "antique firearm" or one with ammunition that is readily accessible is legal even if the person is not the holder of any licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.

Under section 117.03 of the Criminal Code of Canada no peace officer who finds a person in possession of any "antique firearm" is authorized to demand that the person present a licence, registration certificate, ATT, or ATC.


Rifles:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges (whether with a smooth or rifled bore), have a bore diameter of 8.3 mm or greater, measured from land to land in the case of a rifled bore, with the exception of a repeating firearm fed by any type of cartridge magazine

Shotguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than 10, 12, 16, 20, 28, or 410 gauge cartridges

Handguns:
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge only rim-fire cartridges, other than 22 Calibre Short, 22 Calibre Long or 22 Calibre Long Rifle cartridges;
  • manufactured before 1898 that can discharge centre-fire cartridges, other than a handgun designed or adapted to discharge 32 Short Colt, 32 Long Colt, 32 Smith and Wesson, 32 Smith and Wesson Long, 32-20 Winchester, 38 Smith and Wesson; 38 Short Colt, 38 Long Colt, 38-40 Winchester, 44-40 Winchester, or 45 Colt cartridges


Make:

Model:

Serial Number:

Caliber:
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Looks pretty good to me.
 
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from the point of view what can a officer do to a person found carrying a antique revolver after he is presented with the " letter " stating the legal staus of the revovler .

meaning is there something we might be missing , and how would we head it off at the pass so to speak , and preventing it from turning into a court case and complaints filed against the officer involved .
Click to expand...

Your optimistic if you think your always going to be 'presenting' the letter. More likley it will be fished out of your pocket while you get familiar with how terra firma looks up close or how nice and warm a car hood feels on your slightly ill feeling belly.

What your missing is that the officer is likely to err on the side of caution and that no piece of paper from your comp is going to alter thier actions. i.e proceeding with siezing/arresting etc. Threatening 'complaint' procedures is certainly not going to get you very far. I do not believe that the measure of 'signifigant public outcry' is going to be met because a cautious officer took your toy and passed the decision making up the COC.

IMHO if you can end the encounter with only your revolver going to the detachment you are as far ahead as you are going to get.

I am not saying that there are not alot of very smart and experienced officers who would be able to handle this sort of thing in the field but there are definelty some 20 year old city kids in service who are gonna hit the 'panic/stupid' button the second some bird watcher reports a hairy man with a handgun in the bush.

Do your self a favor and in addition to the letter prepare yourself to be very cooperative. You may also wish to commit the appropriate URLs/CC section #s to memory as yor letters are not going to be available to you when you need to convince duty council that your not a quack.
 
Well said David... I agree 100% with your views on this.
Thats why its important to be carefull and responsible to avoid that belly on the pavement. even tho your in the right.

I will still be carrying my antique revolvers to remoat locations to target shoot but im not gona strut around like Angle eyes off the good bad and the ugly doing it.
more like Tuco :D cept i have a flap holster with a shoulder strap not a piece of string around my neck and thru the laynard ring.

haveing some antique laws & info that shows my gun is a perscribed antique in my jeep will be about as far as i go.
 
Kinda wish I'd gotten my antique letters earlier. I'm not too concerned. I carry a print out from the RCMP website with the regulations for antiques. If I do get harrassed my first phone call will be to a senior OPP officer who is a good friend and well aware of the law. Of course none of us should have to pull strings when we're not breaking the law....
 
As this home made letter is informational only and not a permit etc... might be a good idea to put the ph no. of the RCMP firearm center / verifier / techs etc... so any curious cops could give them a call etc...
 
Here's my new version, I like the way this one fills out the page better.

PS, does anyone know if you can print a fancy border in Wordpad, or do you just buy paper with a printed border?

wloi6v.jpg
 
BrotherRockeye said:
I suspect that the person who wrote the letter has English as a second language...



I stopped getting RCMP letters long ago and prefer a letter of authentication from a certified antique arms dealer.
The RCMP letter is given based on information YOU provide and that can be called into question by anyone in authority.
A cert of authenticity is closer to being proof positive that your iron is indeed antique.

JMO ;)
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I did this with a long gun which is an antique. I contacted a collector association in the US on this kind of rifle. Even got them to confirm that my model had last been made a few years before 1898.
 
41Colt, that letter looks pretty good .... it has the info you need. It doesn't really matter who wrote up the letter, it is what the letter says, including references to the appropriate sections, that matter. Still, when all is said and done, discretion is a good idea.
 
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