New x95 Micro Tavor

[cadgo]

Brother, that is the point of the most current threats from the authorities against the SA and the Kriss Vector and all the others on their hit list! Its like Firearms terror, if they can make you fearful then they win, one more gun that you don't buy is a win for them. If they can get you to modify your life and not pick up that shiny new black rifle then they win!

Its High time Law Abiding Citizens become the Wolf instead of the sheep or maybe the deer!

More like a snail.

 

[GTOVR4]

Well ok it's mechanically possible
But what's the benefit doing so? Just prove its possible?

that's why we didn't see any famous bullpup design like that
Both the RFB and F2000 which using forward ejection are not shorter than 26" even FS2000 with 17.4" barrel

so my point is. If the barrel is 18.5" long already. The overall wont be less than 26" in most case
in fact there isn't any bullpup available in the market are like that

Have you convinced yourself yet?

 

[GTOVR4]

I think you misunderstand my question
I am saying you can't find a bullpup with less than 7.5" length after the barrel
Mean after putting a 18.5" barrel and still can be shorter than 26"

Not mean the bolt carrier cover the eject port

But just like you said. It's not particularly practical and wont worth the extra mechanical complexity

I shouldn't said its not possible and should said you won't find any thing like that in the market instead

Well for one, the bolt doesn't actually have to close the ejection port for the rifle to function, it just helps keep crap out of the action. Additionally, it does not need to be the bolt that closes the ejection port, I believe that the VEPRs in 7.62x54R use a small dust cover attached to the bolt and recoil spring in such a manner that it "telescopes" over the larger ejection port. Another solution would be to use a forward ejection system a la RFB or F2000. Also, pistol caliber carbines can cycle in much less space than rifle calibers. And finally, a blow-forward action (yes that is a thing that exists) were the barrel cycles forwards instead of the bolt cycling backwards, would allow the barrel to seat almost all the way into the stock of the weapon. And, as others have mentioned, the recoil spring need not be placed behind the bolt, one example of such a design being the M14.

None if this is particularly practical, and no-one in a position to buy or sell large quantities of such things considers it worth the extra mechanical complexity in order to fit a couple more inches of barrel into such a small rifle.

 

[Paladin308]

I think you misunderstand my question
I am saying you can't find a bullpup with less than 7.5" length after the barrel
Mean after putting a 18.5" barrel and still can be shorter than 26"

Not mean the bolt carrier cover the eject port

My point was that it's possible to have a BCG shorter than the round's OAL without leaving a giant opening in the ejection port, as you claimed would happen.

It is entirely possible to have an 18.5" BBL in a sub 26" semi-automatic if that were a priority. The only reason there are no popular rifles doing so is because there's no demand for them. Most users are fine with standard layout rifles which are considerably less size efficient than any bull-pup. In cases where concealment or close quarters use are a priority long barrels are simply not necessary. Furthermore there is a fairly well established dogma of rifle design in the market, nearly every combat rifle in the world is hammer fired and gas-operated, locks with a rotating bolt, feeds from below with double-stack double-feed box magazines, ejects to the side etc...

Are other configurations possible? Certainly. Many such designs do in fact exist, the FAMAS and G3 for example are both delayed blowback rather than gas operated, the VZ58 is striker fired instead of hammer fired, the PP90 M1 feeds from a helical magazine, the P90 feeds from above and ejects to the bottom, but such designs are the exception rather than the rule.

The firearms industry is notoriously conservative with it's designs, largely because the military establishment is notoriously conservative in it's weapon choices. Nobody wants to go into battle with an unproven design, horror stories of "teething problems" abound, and most people decide it's simply not worth it to push the envelope.

I think this should adequately resolve your question. Yes it's possible, but no one has done it because there isn't enough demand for such a beast.

Also, "Not mean the bolt carrier cover the eject port" makes you sound like a caveman.

 

[GTOVR4]

Well ok you prove I am wrong It's physically possible

But you have to admit that we cant find any bullpup with 18.5" barrel and still shorter than 26"
at least for now and most likely in the near future

and your 3 examples FAMAS RFB and F2000 none of them are shorter than 26" with even shorter than 18.5" barrel

And yes. Maybe I am sounds like a caveman because English isn't my first language lol

 

[Paladin308]

Well ok you prove I am wrong It's physically possible

But you have to admit that we cant find any bullpup with 18.5" barrel and still shorter than 26"
at least for now and most likely in the near future

and your 3 examples FAMAS RFB and F2000 none of them are shorter than 26" with even shorter than 18.5" barrel

And yes. Maybe I am sounds like a caveman because English isn't my first language lol

Here you go, the Korobov TKB-022PM, a Soviet bullpup, OAL is 525mm or 20.7", the barrel is 415mm or 16.3", meaning the complete length of the action from breech to butt-plate is 110mm or about 4.3". With an 18.5" barrel, this rifle would measure up at about 580mm or 22.9".

The rifle was not accepted into military service as it was deemed too radical of a design.

Happy now?

 

[GTOVR4]

Well. Ok. Whats the point to find a failed project that mean to be short but also mean nothing in the end ?
Like you said it's not particularly practical design anyway

So You just want to prove that I am wrong ?? You are the master of firearms and know everything ?? Happy now??

Like i said now i admit its physically possible But I bet we won't see anything like this for LE military adpotion or
anything commercially avaliable in near future

So we Canadian won't need to worry about 26" overall if its the 18.5" NR version
that's my point lol

 

[Zeroed-In]

^ Your point seems to change every time your previous point is proven incorrect, accept your wrong and don't sweat it as there are many on this forum with a vast knowledge of firearms that can and will prove you or anyone else wrong if given the chance. Just enjoy the opportunity to learn from the expertise offered for free from these knowledgeable individuals and accept when your wrong and learn from it, at least that's what I do.

 

[Paladin308]

^ Your point seems to change every time your previous point is proven incorrect, accept your wrong and don't sweat it as there are many on this forum with a vast knowledge of firearms that can and will prove you or anyone else wrong if given the chance. Just enjoy the opportunity to learn from the expertise offered for free from these knowledgeable individuals and accept when your wrong and learn from it, at least that's what I do.

Did someone just call me an knowledgeable individual? Wow, I'm honoured

 

[mmattockx]

Well ok it's mechanically possible
But what's the benefit doing so? Just prove its possible?

I think you misunderstand my question
I am saying you can't find a bullpup with less than 7.5" length after the barrel

No one said it was a good idea, or necessary. You said it couldn't happen and it has been shown that it easily could be done. The benefit would be a very short rifle with a fairly long barrel, which is a pretty specific niche to fill that has extremely low demand. If anyone was going to do this commercially it would either be to suit a particular set of laws in a target sales market (the same as we need 18.5" barrels on our semi's to stay non-restricted), or to fill a request from a military unit for a specific purpose rifle.


Mark

 

[Shooter1of38]

Brother, that is the point of the most current threats from the authorities against the SA and the Kriss Vector and all the others on their hit list! Its like Firearms terror, if they can make you fearful then they win, one more gun that you don't buy is a win for them. If they can get you to modify your life and not pick up that shiny new black rifle then they win!

Its High time Law Abiding Citizens become the Wolf instead of the sheep or maybe the deer!

This.

Nothing in the news will change my shopping or buying habits.

In fact, if "suspect" rifles pop up in the EE on a fire sale, I'll be snapping them up......and very quickly selling them to Mike in Canmore....he's the guy that bought my Tavor, Swiss, 858 and Kris.....

 

[X-man]

Not trying to be a kill joy here, but after the recent crap with the possibility of losing a number of firearms, I'll be waiting until that is taken care of and no longer a threat before I start buying expensive firearms again. Many of us are already looking at the possibility of losing a number of our cool black rifles. Who's to say the Tavor and all "variants" aren't on the chopping block a few years later? We need to get this crap taken care of first. Then yes the X95 has been a firearm I've been interested in since I bought my Tavor. Just thought I'd bring this up. As right now it's rough times for black rifle owners. Get the reclassification stopped first!!

That was the whole intent of the Liberal's C-68 gun control regime...that Canadian gun owners would essentially "self-regulate" and eventually give up firearms ownership all together. How many tens of thousands of gun owners sold off or gave away their entire gun collections in the wake of C-68?

Today, the MORE modern sporting rilfes and carbines that are imported and purchased by Canadian gun owners the better. It makes them all the more difficult to try and take away later. Right now the RCMP has been targetting the proverbial "low-hanging fruit."

Hi-Standard Model 10B...less than two dozen in Canada.

Norinco Type 97A....three dozen or so.

SSD BD-38...less than 75

See the pattern? There is strength in numbers. The more of there are, the stronger we become.

 

[PurpleCrow]

Well this got derailed fairly quickly. Lol

 

[Barthom]

Well this got derailed fairly quickly. Lol

Completely!