Newfoundland Coyotes

davemccarthy707 said:
Monkstown road just past Terrenceville is full of them. Anywhere down around Dunn's river.
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Cape Breton is full of them also if you want to come over here. Watched a guy hit one with his truck friday night and kept going leaving it on the side of the road. I was behind him and kept going also to see a guy in my mirror in a small red car stop and jump out and toss it in the trunk.
I took to the laughing but then remembered the bounty and then figured out quickly who was the idiot for driving by it DAAAAAAAA.
 
CV32 said:
Its fairly typical. Most folks with little experience in coyotes will tend to overestimate their size and weight. As I stated in another thread, of the about 1,500 coyotes turned in to the NL Dept of Environment & Conservation since they instituted the $25 reward for carcasses, only two animals have exceeded 52 lbs.
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judging by all of the ridiculous weight estimates i've seen recently, i almost want to make this my new signature. 60, 70, and 80lb yotes? gimmie a break :rolleyes: then you'll hear the usual BS about yotes being so much bigger in "my" part of the country:rolleyes:

it's funny hearing about all of these massive yotes, but i have yet to see any pics of these huge yotes on scales as proof. i'm guessing these guys are also fishermen that often catch limits of 3lb perch, 10lb smallies, 25lb walleye and 6ft long pike :D
 
Eastern coyotes are part wolf and that is why they are bigger than coyotes out west. As coyotes migrated east they inter-bred with the Red Wolf.
 
canadian hunter312 said:
judging by all of the ridiculous weight estimates i've seen recently, i almost want to make this my new signature. 60, 70, and 80lb yotes? gimmie a break :rolleyes: then you'll hear the usual BS about yotes being so much bigger in "my" part of the country:rolleyes: it's funny hearing about all of these massive yotes, but i have yet to see any pics of these huge yotes on scales as proof. i'm guessing these guys are also fishermen that often catch limits of 3lb perch, 10lb smallies, 25lb walleye and 6ft long pike :D
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Yup, its exactly the same principle at work. :agree:

I have two days of meetings with gov't biologists later this week. I will ask if they have turned up any yotezillas lately. :)
 
canadian hunter312 said:
judging by all of the ridiculous weight estimates i've seen recently, i almost want to make this my new signature. 60, 70, and 80lb yotes? gimmie a break :rolleyes: then you'll hear the usual BS about yotes being so much bigger in "my" part of the country:rolleyes:

it's funny hearing about all of these massive yotes, but i have yet to see any pics of these huge yotes on scales as proof. i'm guessing these guys are also fishermen that often catch limits of 3lb perch, 10lb smallies, 25lb walleye and 6ft long pike :D
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How much hunting have you done in Cape breton or Newfoundland?? If you have hunted here in the past 10 years you would see for your self they are not the little western coyotes.
I have spent a lot of time hunting in Ontario, with family from the french river and brockville area, etc seen your wild dogs and actually shot a couple.
The simplest way to do a apple to apple comparision is to say what you call your brush wolves up there is our eastern coyote.Brush wolves according to your DNR in Ontario run 45-80 pounds for males with a 60 pound average and females 35-60 pounds with a 50 pound average.
That is what we see now here. The largest I have seen so far weighed on a scale was 72 pounds and it is currently being mounted. A 50 pound dog is big enough when it is not scared of man and has taken a life here. When you live in the middle of town and your family is scared to go out for a walk after dark or take the dog out for a piss due to encounters they have had with coyotes it is time to do something.Try to tell our DNR that however. I see more in town than I have ever seen in the woods when hunting.
 
3macs1 said:
How much hunting have you done in Cape breton or Newfoundland?? If you have hunted here in the past 10 years you would see for your self they are not the little western coyotes.
I have spent a lot of time hunting in Ontario, with family from the french river and brockville area, etc seen your wild dogs and actually shot a couple.
The simplest way to do a apple to apple comparision is to say what you call your brush wolves up there is our eastern coyote.Brush wolves according to your DNR in Ontario run 45-80 pounds for males with a 60 pound average and females 35-60 pounds with a 50 pound average.
That is what we see now here. The largest I have seen so far weighed on a scale was 72 pounds and it is currently being mounted. A 50 pound dog is big enough when it is not scared of man and has taken a life here. When you live in the middle of town and your family is scared to go out for a walk after dark or take the dog out for a piss due to encounters they have had with coyotes it is time to do something.Try to tell our DNR that however. I see more in town than I have ever seen in the woods when hunting.
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i've been to nfld twice (burnt islands, lark harbour, port aux basques) and the 2 yotes i saw looked to be the exact same size as a "baby" ontario yote. all of the tracks that we saw would also suggest they're the same size.

are you calling CV32 and/or the NL dept of environment liars? with all of the monster yotes living around you there should have been more than TWO out of 1,500 animals above 50lbs. i'll believe your 72lbs when i see some pictures of it on a scale. until then, you're in the group of guys claiming to be shooting monster yotes, but conveniently don't have any proof ;)


come to think of it, i have yet to see a 50lb+ yote on a scale on any hunting forum i visit. i wonder why...

EDIT: LOL....even the newspaper article doesn't supply proof of this "huge" yotes weight. notice how they say "close on to" and "estimated" at 60lbs and not "the scale says it weighed"? ;)
 
I don't think anyone would deny that the eastern coyotes (and yes, 'eastern' generally includes Ontario, but there is no demarcation line) do tend to be generally larger than the western coyotes. And there are exceptions to both general rules.

But the average weight of an eastern coyote is not 60 lbs, and its not even 50 lbs. Even the two coyotes blamed for taking Taylor Mitchell's life were not really big coyotes. IIRC, yearlings? There are exceptional animals out there, for sure, in the 50-60 lb range, but I have yet to see any evidence of numerous 70-80 lb coyotes rampaging around the countryside.

The average weight of a Newfoundland coyote (if you believe the statistics that have been gathered by the Wildlife Division of the Dept of Environment and Conservation in recent years) is 38 lbs, and anyone who knows coyotes will agree that a 38 lb animal is a decent coyote. (Especially when the young animals and yearlings that tend to fall victim to cars, traps and bullets skew the statistics). But that's still a far cry from 70 or 80 lbs.

Folks do tend to overestimate their size and weight, for reasons that have already been stated in this thread, but for some odd reason there is never any solid evidence (photos, photos with scale readings, carcasses never turned into Wildlife, etc) of the monsters. Maybe there is a 60+ lb dog taken every now and then, probably cuz he just ate a belly full of caribou, but they are not the norm by any stretch.
 
When I hiked the North Rim / Long Range a couple of years ago we heard 70 lbs yotes. :p :rolleyes:

Down on the hwy by Rocky Harbour I saw the ~30 lb yote scoot across the road in front of us. :)
 
canadian hunter312 said:
i've been to nfld twice (burnt islands, lark harbour, port aux basques) and the 2 yotes i saw looked to be the exact same size as a "baby" ontario yote. all of the tracks that we saw would also suggest they're the same size.

are you calling CV32 and/or the NL dept of environment liars? with all of the monster yotes living around you there should have been more than TWO out of 1,500 animals above 50lbs. i'll believe your 72lbs when i see some pictures of it on a scale. until then, you're in the group of guys claiming to be shooting monster yotes, but conveniently don't have any proof ;)


come to think of it, i have yet to see a 50lb+ yote on a scale on any hunting forum i visit. i wonder why...

EDIT: LOL....even the newspaper article doesn't supply proof of this "huge" yotes weight. notice how they say "close on to" and "estimated" at 60lbs and not "the scale says it weighed"? ;)
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I'm sorry I forgot you are living in Ontario. I will tell the taxidermist that lied to me that the large coyote he is mounting for the DNR and one of their displays can only be 30 pounds since they don't see 50 pounders yet in Ontario.
Still my all time favorite 30 pounder pic of a dna tested eastern
coyote1.jpg
 
I shot a 500 lb deer once never had a scale just guessed he was 500 lb,was a nice spike buck!!!Do heavier than normal coyotes exists I am sure, 60 lb to 70 lb not the norm around our area don't live long enough!
 
CV32 said:
I don't think anyone would deny that the eastern coyotes (and yes, 'eastern' generally includes Ontario, but there is no demarcation line) do tend to be generally larger than the western coyotes. And there are exceptions to both general rules.

But the average weight of an eastern coyote is not 60 lbs, and its not even 50 lbs. Even the two coyotes blamed for taking Taylor Mitchell's life were not really big coyotes. IIRC, yearlings? There are exceptional animals out there, for sure, in the 50-60 lb range, but I have yet to see any evidence of numerous 70-80 lb coyotes rampaging around the countryside.

The average weight of a Newfoundland coyote (if you believe the statistics that have been gathered by the Wildlife Division of the Dept of Environment and Conservation in recent years) is 38 lbs, and anyone who knows coyotes will agree that a 38 lb animal is a decent coyote. (Especially when the young animals and yearlings that tend to fall victim to cars, traps and bullets skew the statistics). But that's still a far cry from 70 or 80 lbs.

Folks do tend to overestimate their size and weight, for reasons that have already been stated in this thread, but for some odd reason there is never any solid evidence (photos, photos with scale readings, carcasses never turned into Wildlife, etc) of the monsters. Maybe there is a 60+ lb dog taken every now and then, probably cuz he just ate a belly full of caribou, but they are not the norm by any stretch.
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If you guys are averaging 38 lbs. for coyote,and I do believe your info to be correct, they are definitely a fair bit heavier than our western ones.
I've shot and weighed many coyotes and wolves here. A really big male coyote will run right around 45 lbs, maybe close to 50. A local trapper had a weighed 62 lb. coyote about 15 years ago, which is huge here. Keep in mind he caught dozens every year but decided this one needed to be weighed, so that tells you how out of the ordinary it was.
Of the Timber wolves I've weighed, young males go around 100 lbs. or so, younger females 80-90 lbs. Biggest one I've shot was about 12 years ago, a male that weighed 165 lbs. in mid winter(January). He was lean, as they usually are that time of year, and had no belly full of meat.
99% of people tend to overestimate weights, no matter what species of animal. Bear tends to be the most grossly overestimated.

That said, our coyotes have nicer fur !!! :D
 
3macs1 said:
Just a pic I seen a few years back and saved in my folder. They called it a crywolf back then which is the same cross we have here.
More liars
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Neither of the pics you've posted are new to me. However, neither the pic from Ontario nor the pic from Missouri constitute convincing evidence that Eastern or Atlantic Canada is overrun by seriously huge coyotes. I've seen a few that were probably 50+, but I have yet to see any monsters in the 70+ range. Got any credible evidence of a prevalence of 70, 80, 90, or 100+ lb coyotes in Atlantic Canada?
 
CV32 said:
Neither of the pics you've posted are new to me. However, neither the pic from Ontario nor the pic from Missouri constitute convincing evidence that Eastern or Atlantic Canada is overrun by seriously huge coyotes. I've seen a few that were probably 50+, but I have yet to see any monsters in the 70+ range. Got any credible evidence of a prevalence of 70, 80, 90, or 100+ lb coyotes in Atlantic Canada?
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All I said in my post was from seeing the so called Ontario brush wolves our coyotes are closer to that size than a normal coyote you would see out west and the largest I have ever seen here was being mounted and when I asked him he said it was 72 pounds.I never said that is impossible it cannot be more than 50 since 38 pounds is the average..It was huge and I believed him especially when he said he was doing it for a dnr display.
The average 5 foot 10" man here is 185 pounds so I guess I don't exist either at 275.
Especially knowing our coyotes are indeed a wolf/ coyote mix That has been documented to death and god knows what else they are breeding with since they have moved into the towns. I don't think seeing some mostly black coyotes is the norm is it?? so what are thry breeding with
Over run part most definately, what size, bigger than normal. Have they increased in size here in the past 10 years most definately, are they bolder and being seen more often YES. Cannot go a week with out seeing one or having the lid ripped off the composter, cannot let your pets out alone in the yards etc.I am hoping it is just a cycle but it doesn't seem to be so..What is the most frustrating is being in town, I cannot trap, shoot ( bow or gun)or even poison them.
We put three from cape breton on the ferry over to the rock and just look what they have done over there to the existing wildlife in a few years..
 
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3macs1 said:
Over run part most definately, what size, bigger than normal. Have they increased in size here in the past 10 years most definately, are they bolder and being seen more often YES.
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I don't disagree with most of that, other than perhaps what is 'bigger than normal' or that the size increase is something that has only happened recently. There haven't been any wolves in the Atlantic provinces (excluding Labrador) for many years now, so what you're seeing now is not some new coyote-wolf hybrid. But as we seem to agree that the DNA mix in the eastern coyote is not the same as in the original western coyote, I would say there is a 'new normal'.

As for increasing populations, well, that has also been happening in northeastern North America for some decades now, so it is only to be expected that they would be seen in places they were not before. Are they bolder? Maybe, or perhaps this is a function of human interaction with something they are not historically familiar. Or a function of the fact that eastern coyotes have a propensity for larger prey species and (because of that) sometimes have family units that tend to stay together longer than is typical. Or both.

What I do take issue with, and this is not directed at you personally, is the often repeated mythology that the woods are full of monster coyotes, lurking about, seeking whom they may devour. Are eastern coyotes typically (statistically) bigger than their western cousins? Yes. Are there big 50+ lb coyotes out there? Yes.

These are eastern coyotes doing what they do. And what they're doing is expanding their range (at the same time that we as humans expand our own range, I should add) and impacting new prey species (for example, woodland caribou in insular Newfoundland). Its about biology, and should not be about hysteria.
 
There haven't been any wolves in the Atlantic provinces (excluding Labrador) for many years now, so what you're seeing now is not some new coyote-wolf hybrid. But as we seem to agree that the DNA mix in the eastern coyote is not the same as in the original western coyote, I would say there is a 'new normal'.

No Sir. They are indeed a wolf/coyote hybrid .That has been proven in many studies.

http://www.pc.gc.ca/eng/pn-np/ns/cbreton/natcul/natcul1/c/i/a.aspx
 
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