No such thing as "Overkill"?
- Thread starter TimC
- Start date
Season is always open here! At least for something. I was waiting to take the wife out for our 17th anniversarry and thought to myself how much reaction would this get. I use old calibres, and new and consider meat damage to be my guide. I wont select a round unless it will do the job from my rifles and then consider how much food I will have left! I have used 223 and 12 g slugs on rabbits, experimentation and boredom but I hadnt intended to eat either. I was suitably impressed with the level of response. I must zip off now as I have 30lb of venison to turn into sausages and prep my new rifle for a trip out on the farm tomorrow!
- Location
- Ft. Mac. Alberta
The shoulder of a white tail will lokk pretty ugly if you shoot him with an '06 also using the wrong bullet.
let's not get off track here, the topic is wether or not to hunt with magnums, not where to hit them with a magnum.
FWIW, I agree with you , a friend of mine who used had to drop a moose that was running away after being hit bad with a .375.
His rifle?
A remongton mountain in ------ 30-06!!
Hit 'em bad with anything and they are GONZO!!
This is where I do not advocate big cartridges, but i am not about to tell someone not to hunt with one.
Cat
let's not get off track here, the topic is wether or not to hunt with magnums, not where to hit them with a magnum.
FWIW, I agree with you , a friend of mine who used had to drop a moose that was running away after being hit bad with a .375.
His rifle?
A remongton mountain in ------ 30-06!!
Hit 'em bad with anything and they are GONZO!!
This is where I do not advocate big cartridges, but i am not about to tell someone not to hunt with one.
Cat
- Location
- Hillbilly shack in the boonies
Dead is dead, and if you wanna blood up a bunch a meat , thats your mistake. Cause game meat is good!
Frank
Frank
It's either killed or it isn't. So in absolute terms "overkill" isn't possible.
However in practical terms it can happen. A few years ago I was hunting preserve pheasant with a buddy. A #### bird came up and flew directly over us. Instinctively, I raised the gun and drilled the bird about ten feet off the end of the barrels with 1-1/4 ounces of #6 shot from a modified choke. The bird exploded and we were covered with feathers, guts, assorted bird parts and pheasant s**t.
That might qualify for overkill.
However in practical terms it can happen. A few years ago I was hunting preserve pheasant with a buddy. A #### bird came up and flew directly over us. Instinctively, I raised the gun and drilled the bird about ten feet off the end of the barrels with 1-1/4 ounces of #6 shot from a modified choke. The bird exploded and we were covered with feathers, guts, assorted bird parts and pheasant s**t.
That might qualify for overkill.
[QUOTE='Boo]BTW The pic above is of a mule deer buck shot with a 308 Winchester shooting a 165 grain Interbond @ 2600 fps. Not exactly a screaming missle eh?[/QUOTE]
Is there something wrong with this picture
I thought the Interbond was a Bonded Bullet designed to avoid this type of bullet blowup?
bigbull
Is there something wrong with this picture
I thought the Interbond was a Bonded Bullet designed to avoid this type of bullet blowup?
bigbull
bigbull said:Is there something wrong with this picture
I thought the Interbond was a Bonded Bullet designed to avoid this type of bullet blowup?
bigbull
The Interbond opens quickly and presents a very wide face, All the damage on the buck above was caused by secondary shrapnel caused by bone shards blowing off the near side ribs and causing massive trauma. No bone other than ribs was hit on the entry or exit.
A deer my daughter shot with the same 165 Interbond but out of a 30-06 showed a similar amount of bloodshot even though no heavy bone was hit.
Claybuster said:It's either killed or it isn't. So in absolute terms "overkill" isn't possible.
However in practical terms it can happen. A few years ago I was hunting preserve pheasant with a buddy. A #### bird came up and flew directly over us. Instinctively, I raised the gun and drilled the bird about ten feet off the end of the barrels with 1-1/4 ounces of #6 shot from a modified choke. The bird exploded and we were covered with feathers, guts, assorted bird parts and pheasant s**t.
That might qualify for overkill.
That in my book would same as when I turned a rabbit inside out with a Brenneke bullet in 12g. We all have ahem accidents like the too close bird! fun eh? Would that ruin your bird limit?
All I'm saying - on track I think - is that if that is all the gun one has, placement becomes pretty important. Of course an '06 will do a lot of damage on a shoulder, never said it wouldn't. If you need to drop an animal right away, then a shoulder shot is good, just be prepared for plenty o' damage. I know a guy who uses a 35 Whelen - that's it. Lung shot a young mule deer and it dropped in its tracks - little damage. Imagine hitting it in the shoulder. Now with an '06, I'd shoot a moose in the shoulder - there will be some damage, but no as bad as a smaller animal. Need to consider range, shot presentation, type of bullet construction, cartridge, shooting ability, is the moose near a swamp (i.e. drop it quick), etc., before deciding where to hit the animal.catnthehatt said:The shoulder of a white tail will lokk pretty ugly if you shoot him with an '06 also using the wrong bullet.
let's not get off track here, the topic is wether or not to hunt with magnums, not where to hit them with a magnum.
FWIW, I agree with you , a friend of mine who used had to drop a moose that was running away after being hit bad with a .375.
His rifle?
A remongton mountain in ------ 30-06!!
Hit 'em bad with anything and they are GONZO!!
This is where I do not advocate big cartridges, but i am not about to tell someone not to hunt with one.Cat
BIGREDD said:
Just as the word "magnum" is, really.
But those two words sure account for a lot of interesting discussion, now, don't they?
There are a so many variables in hunting I'm not quite sure how anyone can come up with the perfect caliber for every situation. So we take our best guess at what conditions will present themselves to us and take the rifle that we deem the most appropriate for the occasion. But what if the conditions are not what was expected when that trophy buck materializes?
We hear guys say "I know my limitations, that buck is too far away for me to take cleanly" , but do we ever hear "Gosh, that buck is way too close, I'll overkill it for sure"?
Nope. If there is a bit of bloodshot meat, well, thats all part of the program unless you plan on carrying 2 or 3 guns on your back to cover every situation you may encounter.
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joe-nwt said:Just as the word "magnum" is, really.
But those two words sure account for a lot of interesting discussion, now, don't they?
There are a so many variables in hunting I'm not quite sure how anyone can come up with the perfect caliber for every situation. So we take our best guess at what conditions will present themselves to us and take the rifle that we deem the most appropriate for the occasion. But what if the conditions are not what was expected when that trophy buck materializes?
We hear guys say "I know my limitations, that buck is too far away for me to take cleanly" , but do we ever hear "Gosh, that buck is way too close, I'll overkill it for sure"?
Nope. If there is a bit of bloodshot meat, well, thats all part of the program unless you plan on carrying 2 or 3 guns on your back to cover every situation you may encounter.
Well said Joe... Magnum is just a name, it is the interpretation/definition that causes the controversy.
LMAO that is phuny"Gosh, that buck is way too close, I'll overkill it for sure"?
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
If every animal you shoot will stand broadside, and present the perfect shot, then you could safely use the minimum cartridge, even a 22 for many animals. However, those shots, at least in my hunting, are a rarety. So, I compensate, by using cartridges/bullets that penetrate so i can reach the vitals from odd angles.
If a critter is hiding behind bush or small trees, a big heavy bullet will blast thru and drop the animal if it's close enough to the timber so the change of course the bullet takes won't be critical. Could be a ##### if you see your trophy of a lifetime in this situation and all you have is a wee gun with cheap ammo.
- Location
- Surrey, BC
"Overkill" is 100% subjective, as a word and as a concept. I agree with Bigredd and others on this, words are words, and dead is dead.
So, speaking subjectively, I do think there's such a think as "too much bullet" for any given application. 165gr 30-06 Winchester Supreme's for groundhogs? Probably fun as hell, but a bit of a waste, ie; too much bullet. 400gr 45-70 loaded to the nuts for 110lb sitka blacktail deer? Probably too much bullet. The thing with "too much" is that it's always better than not enough. Ethically, I believe it's better to make a clean kill and ruin an entire quarter of meat than wound the animal and be forced to follow the blood trail for 5 km through the bush, while the animal suffers with every step. Just my 2 cents
So, speaking subjectively, I do think there's such a think as "too much bullet" for any given application. 165gr 30-06 Winchester Supreme's for groundhogs? Probably fun as hell, but a bit of a waste, ie; too much bullet. 400gr 45-70 loaded to the nuts for 110lb sitka blacktail deer? Probably too much bullet. The thing with "too much" is that it's always better than not enough. Ethically, I believe it's better to make a clean kill and ruin an entire quarter of meat than wound the animal and be forced to follow the blood trail for 5 km through the bush, while the animal suffers with every step. Just my 2 cents
