Norinco M14 excessive headspace ?

S

S1nnerman

Regular
Super GunNutz
Rating - 100%
103   0   0
Location
Quebec
[h=2]Hey guys,[/h]

I've had my M14 for about 3 months now and only fired factory .308 ammo, around 1000. Never had an issue what so ever.

The other day, a friend of mine brought his .308 go, no go and field gauges. My M14 bolt closed on all of them ( I did not disassemble the action, extractor and all that) . Now I am very well aware that those Norinco chambers are made for Nato rounds but is it normal that it even closed on the .308 field gauge ? And what's the possible danger of shooting bullets in a rifle with excessive headspace ?

I appreciate your feedback

Cheers
Mario​
 
This topic is well discussed on this forum. Your best bet is to do a search using the key words "head space" and "headspace". Look for posts from the board experts. Good luck.
 
Last edited:
Generally speaking, don't worry about it really. There is lots of reading in this forum about it. It seems to be fairly common for these norcs to have a lot of headspace. It's hard on brass obviously, especially if you reload, so pay attention to signs of case separation.
PM tactical teacher (hungry) ask him if he you can send him 3 pieces of once fired brass to measure. (He used to offer this service, don't know if he still does or not) He will give you your actual headspace dimensions, and if there is a serious problem I'm sure he will let you know.
 
CanuckR said:
PM tactical teacher (hungry) ask him if he you can send him 3 pieces of once fired brass to measure. (He used to offer this service, don't know if he still does or not) He will give you your actual headspace dimensions, and if there is a serious problem I'm sure he will let you know.
Click to expand...

This is a good plan. Make sure your gas system is off when collecting brass for measurement.
 
Gauges for .308 and 7.62x51 are a bit different as well. No-go for .308 is 1.634 vs 1.640 for 7.62, field is 1.638 vs 1.646.
Most, like 99% of the NIB Norks would probably swallow .308 field gauge no problem. After some firing they would swallow the NATO gauge as well. They all have exccessive headspace, but they will likely not have case seperation if you only use factory ammo, or be very cautious reloading.
 
My original headspace was 14 thou over go gauge. I reload so I dropped in a new TRW bolt and sit at 1.361.

Seen lots of rifles in the 14-17 though over go gauge.

You could also send me three cases if you wish.
 
I had a M14 that was 12 thou over .308 field... and it blew up with a case separation, if I didn't have a scope mount on it I would have likely lost an eye... as it was it ####ing hurt pulling bits of brass outta my hand. I sold the gun for parts. My second one was in the same boat and it was cracking cases at the head.... so I removed and chopped the barrel and bolt up and put in a CRITERION barrel and LRB bolt... fixed that problem.

lots of people will tell you "its no problem" but the manufactures use those specs for a reason. when it chambers a field gauge... its done its not safe.
Its like torquing on a tire... sure you don't have to use the manufactures torque specs... but if don't and you end up in the ditch because your tire came off, or your studs broke off... whos to blame... you are.
Your the one playing with a explosion 5 inches from your face..... maybe abiding by industry specs might be a good move in your play book.
 
If it isn't overly complicated can someone please explain how you can tell from spent casings that you will have excessive headspace ? Do you measure the neck expansion or just look for signs of stress ???

Despite the fact I am a little slow, I have calipers and somewhat mechanically semi-savvy
 
Last edited:
SmokeyBonez said:
If it isn't overly complicated can someone please explain how you can tell from spent casings that you will have excessive headspace ? Do you measure the neck expansion or just look for signs of stress ???

Despite the fact I am a little slow, I have calipers and somewhat mechanically semi-savvy
Click to expand...

Shooting a brass cased load , with the gas shut off, and allowing the case to cool for a couple seconds before extracting, allows it to fully expand in the chamber.
It is then able to be measured with a precision mic to get an "approximate" headspace. This method is close enough to let you know if yer safe or not
 
SmokeyBonez said:
If it isn't overly complicated can someone please explain how you can tell from spent casings that you will have excessive headspace ? Do you measure the neck expansion or just look for signs of stress ???

Despite the fact I am a little slow, I have calipers and somewhat mechanically semi-savvy
Click to expand...

RCBS precision mic....
http://www.brownells.com/reloading/...n-mic-cartridge-headspace-tool-prod33476.aspx

On the topic, what's the better deal to correct headspace..... Get a used GI or new Fulton bolt for $300 and hope it works out, or buy a new short chambered barrel for about the same price and have it headspaced to your Nork bolt?
 
That's kind of a trick question but I'll take a stab.
First I would skip right on by the new fulton, LRB or virgin USGI bolt.

If the bolt lug/ receiver fit is decent and not too roomy, maybe a short chambered pipe is a better choice and ream to suit. If lug recess is sloppy and a probable cause for the headspace issue in the first place, maybe a bolt AND barrel should be considered.

If the factory barrel shoots well but headspace is undesireable, then I would opt for the used usgi bolt.
Less lapping required to seat lugs and achieve decent headspace.
I've installed dozens and dozens of usgi bolts and the gently used ones always gave excellent results with minimal lapping in. (2005 and newer rifles)
 
I got good lug engagement, barrel is over timed a bit and brass measured 1.645 with gas system on. That's almost failing NATO field. I figure I'll check it again at 1000 and 2000 rounds but at some point its going to grow and need to be corrected.
 
Has he shot the rifle yet?
If it worked fine I'd say.....why stress over it?

It's a sloppy battle rifle man, not some dainty swiss .22 LR olympic target rifle.
If it chambers a round with no issues it's probably going to be fine.......
 
Hitzy said:
I got good lug engagement, barrel is over timed a bit and brass measured 1.645 with gas system on. That's almost failing NATO field. I figure I'll check it again at 1000 and 2000 rounds but at some point its going to grow and need to be corrected.
Click to expand...

Like 45ACPKING said, with the good bolt engagement, get yourself a new barrel when the time comes. I got my medium weight SS LRB match barrel imported and it cost $400 to my door. A new bolt will come close to that, or higher depending where you get it.
Of course the barrel will need installing and reaming, but the product in the end for the same money spent will be much more worth it.
 
That's what I figured.... A new bolt will correct headspace, a new barrel will do that and potentially shoot better too.
 
thats the message you had sent me.....

our cases measure 0.015 over .308 go gauge.

Your chamber sits at 1.645 +/- .001

Regards

(Little on the large size but not uncommon for a Norc)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom