Norinco M305 horribly innacurate... Basic low budget accurizing? Suggestions?

joe.danay

joe.danay

Regular
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
4   0   0
Location
Alberta
So my relatively new M305 has about 400 rounds through it, plinking etc, not abusing it with heat.
It's the long barrel version (22in?) and I'm running Norc 7.62 cheap ammo. I don't expect this combination to be a tack driver, but my groupings at the range saturday were dismal.
I can shoot 2-3 inch groups @ 100 yards with my iron sight 30-30 so it's not operator error...
It was grouping about 2 moa height and about 10 moa on the width.
Any one know why the side to side dispersion would be so awful ?
Any basic accurizing I can do without breaking the bank?
 
If you have a loose op-rod guide it is a very low buck fix. Assuming you have access to a bench mounted vise. The only other things you need are a hammer, pin punch, center punch and red Loctite. If you have a also have a loose gas system it would need to be fixed first though. The materials are cheap, $5 for shims, but the stuff you need to get the flash hider off will be more expensive. Bedding your stock is also a low cost way to accurize. Maybe that is the cause of the lateral change from shot to shot.
 
My DA Socom 18 accuracy is horrendous, lucky to get 8 moa out of it with Federal AE 150gr. It is what it is I guess and I'd rather tweak my bolt guns. I imagine if scoped and benched it would shoot about 4 moa (the sights cover about 14" @ 100yds), but after scope mount, scope, rings, cheekriser, I would have a 12 pound $1000 4 moa rifle?? Then all the internal mods to maybe(?) get another inch or 2 out of it. Not worth it and don't use it as a benchrest rifle. It's a bush gun. *shrug*

I love it as it is though and has been 100% reliable and build quality (alignment of everything etc) was exceptional.
 
Last edited:
Joe I'm not going to say it's 100% operator error, but the most thing I had to overcome with the M-14 platform in general and the M-14 pistol grip/trigger in particular, was good strong hand control, and ensuring I was pressing straight through into the center line of the stock.

My groups always had more windage in them than vertical stringing, and whenever I'm away from the rifle, like now for 5 months or so, it will show up again when I go out to the range. With consistent practice I closed up the windage up tremendously. It was me. Familiarity with a Model 70 trigger or a Remington 700 trigger or a No4 Mk1 trigger, Win 94, Rem 7400 and on.. was no comparison here to the M-14 trigger group.
You may have a bedding issue, but the size and type of your groups are telling me there can be improvement with the stronghand control and trigger press straight through the stock, Try pressing between your first three lower fingers, while pressing forward with your thumb in the centerline of the pistol grip and touching the heel of the receiver, and pressing with the tip of your trigger finger gently through to the centerline of the rifle. If you are new to aperture sights, although accomplished with patridge type of irons, there is a small learning curve to peep sights, if trained on the other first.

This works for me, and it may tighten your groups up a bit, but like you said you don't expect MOA with the setup and ball ammo. Good luck and good shooting. Hang in there, you came to the right place for ideas, it will iron itself out.
 
Buckshot70 said:
My DA Socom 18 accuracy is horrendous, lucky to get 8 moa out of it with Federal AE 150gr. It is what it is I guess and I'd rather tweak my bolt guns. I imagine if scoped and benched it would shoot about 4 moa (the sights cover about 14" @ 100yds), but after scope mount, scope, rings, cheekriser, I would have a 12 pound $1000 4 moa rifle?? Then all the internal mods to maybe(?) get another inch or 2 out of it. Not worth it and don't use it as a benchrest rifle. It's a bush gun. *shrug*

I love it as it is though and has been 100% reliable and build quality (alignment of everything etc) was exceptional.
Click to expand...

If you are just firing it prone unsupported and not really familiar with the platform and aperture sights as well, 8MOA sounds about right. The rifle itself will do probably 3-4MOA I'm guessing with good marksmanship and bench rested.
 
I'd bring your rifle to someone with M14 experience and have them dissasemble and check it all; 10 MOA is something critically wrong.

Same with the 8 MOA another person posted; either something critically wrong or operator error in both cases.

I've had "more than one" M14 and they seemed to shoot generally just a tad over 2", scoped off the bench, if I did my part, with ammo that they did not hate.

Ammo can be a major factor with the M14 however. I have one that will shoot about 1.75" consistently with plain based 165 - 180 grain bullets, but sprays 147-150 grain boat tails into 4" - 5". Easy fix - don't do that...
 
TacticalTeacher said:
Y'all gotta come to my clinic. Ha ha ha ha I got yer backs.

Cheers, Barney
Click to expand...

That's what I was truly hoping for! I posted a thread inquiring about the next clinics in Southern Alberta, or hell anywhere in Western Canada, but never heard about any upcoming clinics.

When & where is the next clinic?!? Have gun, will travel!

I'll certainly check that the rear sight isn't rattling around, but I'm sure the guide rod is super loose. As for the stickies, talk about TMI, tough to know where to start! Clinic would be ideal, picture is worth a thousand words, but fellow gun nuts with knowledge and experience are priceless.

Thanks for the feedback, a few goood basic things to check like rear sight stability and plain old different bullet weights. I own a lot of rifles/pistols but I'm fairly new to the M14 platform. Thanks again for the help... One more thing;

Clinic! Clinic! Clinic!
 
peening the barrel to tighten up the op rod guide

To tighten up the op rod guide remove the roll pin in the guide and remove the guide.
Take a hammer and a punch and make a lot of dimples in the barrel where the op rod guide sits .
Put some red Loctite on the barrel and tap the guide back into position .Replace the roll pin and let sit overnight .
You can see where there metal is raised where I peened the barrel.
Does your gas locking ring get nice and tight before the 6:00 position , did you replace the op rod spring guide yet with a good after market one?
Thanks again goes to Tactical Teacher for spreading the word and helping drain my bank account ...lol

 
Last edited:
I have not modified my rifle. It is exactly as the factory made it. I wanted to get some feedback before I started tinkering to do the right things in the right order. If you do a bunch of work without a plan or a clue, it could be a lot of work with no result if I missed something simple like a loose rear sight! Didn't even think of that, so I'm glad I asked. As is ,LOL, my compound bow is more accurate than my Norc "M14"! My friendly local gunsmith said he rebuilt a M14 for a guy that shot 1moa at 1000 yards, but it cost about $3000! Looks like it needs the LRB national match upgrade, because those are only $3000 as well. I'd like my current one to shoot decent but I don't want to spend thousands on "only shoots decent".
 
Last edited:
I'd get a battle sight zero target for 25 meters. You can download them on the net. This zeros the rifle for 250 yards, which is only slightly off zero at one hundred. Then I'd put 50 rounds through it, and re-zero to see if it is the sights.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom