Norinco M305 Trigger Pack Issue (Update)

Ah, well that’s a different kettle of fish. Either your trigger and hammer are FUBAR or the trigger pack is out of spec.

You either need a new trigger group or some parts.

I’ll bet that if you set the safety and pull hard on the trigger it won’t fire, but it will if you release the safety....

John

Great. First the bolt is garbage right out of the box on this rifle. Now the trigger pack might be faulty. I did go ahead and removed some material from the stock where the back of the trigger pack sits and one major thing I've noticed is the trigger pack is now super easy to reinstall. Before it took a lot of effort to get that trigger pack back in. I'm going to disassemble the trigger pack and inspect each part. I might post pictures if I have further questions.
 
I almost always put garand triggers and hammers in the m305. A generally solid improvement in every way.

Do you have gi parts or another trigger pack to try in the rifle?
 
I almost always put garand triggers and hammers in the m305. A generally solid improvement in every way.

Do you have gi parts or another trigger pack to try in the rifle?

This is great advice. The Garand internals (other than the clip spring which needs to be trimmed) are drop-in parts. A certain ex-site sponsor has many Garand parts in stock..... after parting out 200ish rifles...

Wolverine Supplies is the best bang-for-your-buck price on a trigger upgrade.... they are parting out some of their IDF kits. I’d reccomend picking up a GI trigger pack.

John
 
I almost always put garand triggers and hammers in the m305. A generally solid improvement in every way.

Do you have gi parts or another trigger pack to try in the rifle?

I'll need to get some. I think I'll replace the trigger, hammer, and safety spring if not both the safety and spring. Or I guess I could replace it with a full GI pack is anyone knows how much one of those costs.
 
I'll need to get some. I think I'll replace the trigger, hammer, and safety spring if not both the safety and spring. Or I guess I could replace it with a full GI pack is anyone knows how much one of those costs.

You don't need a safety spring. Probably not a safety either, but that would not hurt.

The spring has no bearing on how well the safety works, it is either springy, or not.
 
The gun is 110% fixed now. After a few unsuccessful attempts at fixing the trigger pack, as well as shaving the stock with no success, the gun now has a USGI trigger and hammer. It completely made the problem go away. The trigger now has a nice pull to it where it stops just before the trigger is about to break. Next I think I will changed the front and rear sight. Or just the rear sight and grind down the front with my dermal. I can't get the rifle sighted in at 100 meters the way it is now. Shoots super low.
 
The gun is 110% fixed now. After a few unsuccessful attempts at fixing the trigger pack, as well as shaving the stock with no success, the gun now has a USGI trigger and hammer. It completely made the problem go away. The trigger now has a nice pull to it where it stops just before the trigger is about to break. Next I think I will changed the front and rear sight. Or just the rear sight and grind down the front with my dermal. I can't get the rifle sighted in at 100 meters the way it is now. Shoots super low.

good to hear that you got your trigger functioning properly, how can you be shooting super low if the rear sight is adjustable?
 
Just found this thread again. To the OP: Now you know why I typically drop in GI hammer and trigger when asked to upgrade people's 305's for them. I'm betting your safety proved to be OK also.

Ususally the 305's will shoot too high and require a taller front sight. This is especially true of the 18.5" and 16" barrelled norincos.

If the gun is shooting too low, you don't "need" a new set of sights, you need to lern how to adjust your rear sight aperture height at the "1" setting to shoot to POA. Lots of youtube videos on how to do this. On most guns it's between 2 and 12 clicks up from the bottom-most setting.

That said, GI sights are tighter, crisper, and more reliable. A M14 or M1 rear sight (USGI) is a solid upgrade if you plan to shoot with irons. If you just use a scope, it's a waste of money to upgrade.

Honestly, when I used to go help at the various M14 clinics, I would bring a bag of GI hammers and triggers to sell to people at my cost (I don't have extras to sell any more, but several vendors in Canada do). It's amazing how many Norinco guns had hammer follow and sear engagement issues that were completely fixed with a simple parts swap.

Primary things I'd advise people to do, in no particular order:

1) hammer/trigger replacement
2) re-index barrel, don't use the flat on whatever FS you are using to hold your parallel. The Chinese cast FS's are usually not square, but you want your sights to move in the same plane as the rear sight when adjusting windage. It's more important that the top dovetail on the FS is parallel to the rear sight ledge than for the barrel to appear straight to the eye.
3) Tighten op rod guide. I prefer knurling.
4) install a decent after-market round profile (or fluted) op rod connector (i.e. an op rod spring guide)
5) install a GI connector lock pin after machining it to fit. I used to make them on the lathe for people, not a difficult job. The Norinco pins are a few thou smaller in diameter than GI pins. the popsicle mod is for people who don't have the right machine tools available to them and is an inferior method, more prone to failure.
6) Check bolt lug contact with Prussian blue, lap until both lugs make at least 30% contact on the left lug, or 70%+ contact if you also plan to use a match barrel and do some NM mods.
7) peening gas cylinder and FS splines.
8) shimming gas systems. Barney used to bring punches to make cheap shims, in my case, I had bought a large volume from Brownells. Whatever works, they are just spacers. Most people don't need a unitized gas system. I would always tell ppl not to expend any money or effort on unitizing unless you were doing a full NM spec bedding job. One won't improve anything without the other in my experience. - IMPORTANT! - use a feeler gauge (like a #48, .076" drill bit or drill rod) through the port in the bottom of the gas cylinder to ensure the barrel gas port is centered in the opening for the gas cylinder after install. If not, add or subtract shims until the cylinder lock indexes and the holes are aligned.
9) Put USGI internals in your Norinco bolt. Almost as important as using GI hammers and triggers. Moreso if you plan to use a scope mount like a Sadlak, ARMS, SEI or Brookfield. The norinco bolt springs are garbage, and too long. The ejector bevels are all wrong and will cause stovepipes against a scope mount.
10) If you have a black plastic chinese stock, you need to remove and set back the ferrule. These stocks are ALL molded too long (or at least I've never worked on one that was not too long) and put forward pressure on the gas system & ferule. This is a recipe for vertical stringing. They aren't a bad stock once you set back the ferule and bed it, they are at least the equal of the current SAI crappy plastic M1A stocks once fixed. I never see this referred to on the forums, but it's a real issue.
11) remove that stupid set screw in the receiver ring and either throw it as far as you can.... or shorten it and re-install it so it plugs the hole but doesn't contact barrel threads.
12) Take apart the gas spindle assembly, clean out the blasting media and other junk, then re-assemble. I've never seen one that did not need serious cleaning out of the box.
13) I like USGI recoil springs. I don't like chinese, wolf or brownells springs. I hate + springs, which most Chinese, wolf or brownells springs are - unless you only shoot 168gn loads, they cause short-stroking with normal ball ammo in the 150gn range.
14) If you own one of these rifles, I consider it essential to own castle nut pliers and tools for cleaning the interior of the gas piston and gas plug.
15) Chinese receivers have a different rear right receiver profile than US commercial or USGI stocks. An M305 receiver is NOT a drop-in to a USGI stock. You either have to mill the receiver or inlet the stock to get the proper receiver seat in a USA-made stock. They will fit without modification and will lock up, but they won't shoot optimally unless you fix the geometry on either the stock or the receiver. Builders like Vulcan or M14Medic know this and offer receiver milling as an option. It's cheaper to mod the stock, but receiver milling is more elegant.
16) Don't over-tighten a FS castle nut. The nut is not meant to hold the FS tight on the barrel, it's to prevent the FS from shooting off the front. Spline fit is what keeps a FS from moving around, the nut is just a shoulder to prevent the FS from moving forward. Tighten the castle nut by hand until it's snug, then back it up to the first place the set screw will enter a castellation. Do NOT crank the castle nut tight with pliers until the set screw will just engage a castellation. You will risk warping the flash suppressor, and this is the reason why brownells now sells a FS alignment gauge. Warped flash suppressors that were over-torqued. If the splines are fitted correctly and the castle nut is hand-tight, that's all you need for accurate shooting.

Those are the big things off the top of my head :)

Cheers.
 
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I had two 22 inch M305's shortened to 18.5 inches. In both cases, I had to lower the front sight or the rear sight aperture was way too high and was asking for a bump...something like 19 clicks up from the bottom.

I found a small flat file, like one face on a fine cut triangular file, to be the best for removing metal from the front sight blade. You are going to want to measure the existing front blade height, and know how low you are shooting low at 50/100 yards. Then you can calculate how high your front sight needs to be dropped.

Keep the same forward slant on the blade for a sharp sight picture

You might want to wrap a number of layers of PVC around the front sight ears to keep from scratching the finish, as rough as it is.
 
Check out your hammer spring shroud in your trigger group. If it is worn the weapon will discharge uncontrollably. A new one is cheap like Borsch.
The Chinese steel used for this part is soft and it can wear with just a few rounds through the rifle. Be sure to get the G.I. part.
 
[h=1]ipscgraz,
I don't disagree that in your case the front sights needed to be shortened, but normally the shorter the barrel the taller the front sight needs to be. Your front sights with the long barrels must have been very tall. Here is an explanation from M14 doctor:[/h]
No worries man it stumps most guys at first and I've scratched my own head over the issue more times than one hehehehe

If you put it on paper, it goes like this.
Draw a straight line representing the bore center of a 22" barrel. The line must be the length of the distance between rear sight aperture and front sight blade at it's highest point.
Next take the height of the center of the bottomed out rear aperture and make a mark.
Now go to front sight location, measure up from the line, the distance from bore center to top of standard sight blade.
Connect the two marks with a straight line.

This will show you why a higher sight is needed as the two lines before you will not be parallel. The top (sight) line angles down, towards the bore. So as you move the sight back, the blade height must increase to compensate.


This is magnified when shortening the barrel as you now must also account for the change in tragectory that 3 1/2 less inches of barrel gives the .308 cartridge. Again, an increase in blade height in necessary.
 
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