I’ve been using 59gr H4831 at 3050fps for several years now in my 270W. With 130gr SST Hornady. At .030 off the lands. Love that round. It’s starting to push the pressure signs as the primers are just starting to flatten. I only shoot it during hunting season which in my neck of the woods is always cold out.
O'Connor loads?
- Thread starter Philthy1
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I find this story about Jacks reloading scale a lot like the news on covid, the ukraine, the economy, etc...Extremely hard to believe and far fetched...Jack wrote hunting and ammo articles and books for a living for many decades...To think that he only had one reloading scale and did not check the accuracy of his scales in all those years is seriously a BS stretch.
The other thing about Jacks load data is I have found it to be real world true and if anything a bit on the conservative side of being hot...In my rifles any way.
You are correct. I blew the dust off my Lyman 50th Ed., checked it, and sure enough it lists .270 Win max load for IMR 4064 at 49.5gr, with a pressure of 50,600 CUP. (I think SAAMI's max pressure for .270 Win is 52,000 CUP?).
That is a 2.0 gr difference between max loads from the two published sources (Hodgdon/Lee vs Lyman). That is quite alot, which surprises me.
So I stand corrected, based on published manual differences that are both recent. While there is no way I would trust powder energy density to be the exact same over several decades of manufacture, these two published sources are apparently recent, so it just goes to show there are variables in testing labs and publishing that are not consistent.
Start low and work up carefully, as always.
Terry Wieland has an excellent article in Handloader from October 2018 on this exact load discussion. Worked up to 49.5gr of IMR 4064 with 130gr bullets in 5 different rifles and had no pressure signs/issues. Excellent article if you can access it.
Thanks R, yes it always seemed a bit unlikely to me too!
If I was just starting today, I'd certainly pickup some the 4831 (both), but being well stocked in a bunch of other powders, I really need to use them
270W fan here. I just discovered that 6.5 Staball works really well in a 270W. And I’ve seen it on the buy n sell a few times recently, and a few $ less than most of the popular powders. My son in law has a Vanguard that doesn’t shoot well. I was using H4831 and 130SST and was only getting 1.5 - 1.75” groups with it. Best it would do with 55.5gr of H4831. And that’s always worked really well in my Savage. Got it down to 1” with 55.5gr (coincidentally) of 6.5Staball. Was at my wits end with that gun. Put on a nice wood stock, the ones that look like they’re made of plywood. Glass bedded it. Shot a cow elk at 405 yds a few days ago, broke the front shoulder and went into the lungs, game over.
I have had a 270 for a long time, it was my second hunting rifle (first being an old LE1-3)
I used to read all I could on the 270 in the gun rags. I learned to respect some writers over others. in fact, I had a list or them rated.
one thing I have noticed over the years is the reduction of load weights from years prior. the usual excuse is, "new pressure equipment is available to provide accurate pressure data, and old loads are too high"
the only problem with this logic is, the SAAMI PMax numbers are always lower then what modern rifles can easily handle.
IIRC, it was Layne Simpson, a gun rag writer, who stated JOC's original load was indeed 62g/H4831/130gr-C&C-FB. JOC later reduced it at the editors/publishers request (most likely due to lawyers doing the reading)
Mr. Simpson also stated that he has found 62g/H4831/130gr-C&C-FB was safe and accurate in every sound modern rifle he has ever shot. He did state 60gr was the max listed by many companies now and that load was excellent for accuracy AND brass life, so it was the one he now recommended to new handloaders.
I used to read all I could on the 270 in the gun rags. I learned to respect some writers over others. in fact, I had a list or them rated.
one thing I have noticed over the years is the reduction of load weights from years prior. the usual excuse is, "new pressure equipment is available to provide accurate pressure data, and old loads are too high"
the only problem with this logic is, the SAAMI PMax numbers are always lower then what modern rifles can easily handle.
IIRC, it was Layne Simpson, a gun rag writer, who stated JOC's original load was indeed 62g/H4831/130gr-C&C-FB. JOC later reduced it at the editors/publishers request (most likely due to lawyers doing the reading)
Mr. Simpson also stated that he has found 62g/H4831/130gr-C&C-FB was safe and accurate in every sound modern rifle he has ever shot. He did state 60gr was the max listed by many companies now and that load was excellent for accuracy AND brass life, so it was the one he now recommended to new handloaders.
This is sort of a crazy co-incidence but when I was a somewhat younger dawg people seemed to be divided between not even having heard of hand-loading and those thinking it was an incredibly dangerous activity best keep confined to gun nuts with a death wish. Growing up in the bush wasn't all bad, but it wasn't exactly the information super highway.
So anyways, I got a copy of JOCs Complete book of the rifle and shotgun from the Outdoor Life book club and read the snot out of it until the covers fell off when I probably should have been just playing with blocks. About the only people I knew that actually had heard of a 270 pronounced it as a two hundred and seventy, and knew a guy that knew a guy that said it shot flatter than piss on a platter and killed better than a 30-06. Or so they heard.On the other hand my hero said it was great and light recoiling and killed like lightning and I'd already decided that a 30-30 was a piece of #### just by observation.
In that book JOC mentioned a few other calibers and more than one load for a 270; but did mention that the most consistently accurate load he had ever found for light sporters was 49.5 grains of 4064 with a 130. Naturally the first thing I did when my parents weren't looking was buy a Parker Hale in 270 and ordered a press and dies from the guy at the hardware store 35 miles away. He was sort of hesitant, but cleansed his concious by giving me the number of a guy he knew that had actually loaded a shell before. Like I was going to call him, that was long distance and cost money, which the one thing I knew I didn't have any of.
So, with nobody home and a press that wasn't bolted to anything I loaded 1 shell at what the Lee scoops swore was 47.5 grains of 4064 and stuck the gun out the door with the door between me and potential disaster and pulled the trigger. It made a pretty good bang sound, but when I ejected the casing it was all black and smoky. I thought that that meant I was a c*** hair away from blowing up stuff, but there was nothing else to do on
the farm and since the next possible increment I could move up with the scoops was Jacks 49.5 grains I went to that. Naturaly being the sane and cautious person that I am I held it in my left hand because a logical right handed person would rather lose his left hand than his right hand. It made a pretty good bang sound and nothing blew up. Crazy thing at the time is the case wasn't smokey this time. These days people would call my process "working up a load".
Want to hear something funny? I shot 3 barrels out with that load. If you got something to say to Jack; say it to me first
like you i read a lot about Jack Oconnor but we had the 7x64 in europe and the 30-06 was prohibited for us in hunting ground...
when i discovered that Jack got a 280 from ruger i knew he did not like the 270 ... despite him really got a 280 the first part is a joke lol ...
While it’s fun and interesting to get the different perspectives of the various personalities on here, your best intel will come from published data, either in a book or online. If you Google Nosler reloading data is very good as well as Hodgdon reloading. And they are free and most people carry them in their pocket
