OK, You asked for it ... What are the most overrated RIFLE cartridges?

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Overrated - the 223, 6.5 Creedmoor, and 30'06. Give me the 243, 7mm-08, and 308 any day. Might put the 35 Whelen in there too as an over 30 cal. This is so entertaining lol...
 
It's obvious who the guys are that are vested in the shorty 308 that doesn't handle nearly as well as the Winchester 94 and has similar ballistics to the SKS.
 
Code: 
Cartridge          : [B]7.62 x 39[/B] (M43) Russ.
Bullet             : .310, [B]123, PrviPartizan PSP[/B] B-210
Useable Case Capaci: 31.195 grain H2O = 2.025 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.205 inch = 56.01 mm
Barrel Length      : [B]18.5 inch[/B] = 469.9 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 52000 psi, or 358 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 104 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

79 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 80%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon H335                       103.3     32.4     2.10    2514    91.5    52000    6192   0.918  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4198                           104.0     26.8     1.74    2476    97.8    50726    5579   0.931  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-7                   99.2     27.6     1.79    2472    97.6    52000    5671   0.941  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-10x                104.0     28.2     1.83    2462    96.2    48109    5929   0.955  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                            93.5     24.6     1.59    2437    99.1    52000    5220   0.941  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4198                      100.1     27.0     1.75    2420    93.0    52000    5420   0.942  ! Near Maximum !

Code: 
Cartridge          : [B].308 Win. [/B](SAAMI)
Bullet             : .308, [B]150, Nosler BalTip [/B]30150
Useable Case Capaci: 46.998 grain H2O = 3.051 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.800 inch = 71.12 mm
Barrel Length      : [B]16.1 inch [/B]= 408.9 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 62000 psi, or 427 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 104 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

86 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 80%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
IMR 3031                           104.0     42.1     2.73    2662   100.0    61974   11121   0.838  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon CFE223                      97.9     47.3     3.06    2662    96.4    62000   11873   0.832  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 748                      95.8     44.7     2.89    2651    98.3    62000   11490   0.836  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4895                           103.0     44.6     2.89    2646    96.1    62000   11865   0.843  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon BL-C2                       98.2     46.4     3.01    2641    97.3    62000   11701   0.843  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant AR-Comp                     99.0     41.5     2.69    2639   100.0    62000   10219   0.840  ! Near Maximum !


7.62x39 123gr PSP @ 2464 fps
BC .275
100y +2" , 2180 fps, 1296 ft lbs energy
200y -1.6" , 1913 fps, 999 ft lbs
300y -15", 1670 fps, 761 ft lbs
400y -41" , 1451 fps, 575 ft lbs
500y -83" , 1267 fps, 438 ft lbs

308 Win 150gr NBT @ 2650 fps
BC .435
100y +2" , 2460 fps, 2015 ft lbs
200y 0.0" , 2277 fps, 1727 ft lbs
300y -9" , 2103 fps, 1472 ft lbs
400y -25" , 1936 fps, 1250 ft lbs
500y -51" , 1778 fps, 1052 ft lbs


similar ballistic sLaugh2Laugh2
 
todbartell said:
Code: 
Cartridge          : [B]7.62 x 39[/B] (M43) Russ.
Bullet             : .310, [B]123, PrviPartizan PSP[/B] B-210
Useable Case Capaci: 31.195 grain H2O = 2.025 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.205 inch = 56.01 mm
Barrel Length      : [B]18.5 inch[/B] = 469.9 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 52000 psi, or 358 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 104 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

79 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 80%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hodgdon H335                       103.3     32.4     2.10    2514    91.5    52000    6192   0.918  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4198                           104.0     26.8     1.74    2476    97.8    50726    5579   0.931  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-7                   99.2     27.6     1.79    2472    97.6    52000    5671   0.941  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-10x                104.0     28.2     1.83    2462    96.2    48109    5929   0.955  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4227                            93.5     24.6     1.59    2437    99.1    52000    5220   0.941  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4198                      100.1     27.0     1.75    2420    93.0    52000    5420   0.942  ! Near Maximum !

Code: 
Cartridge          : [B].308 Win. [/B](SAAMI)
Bullet             : .308, [B]150, Nosler BalTip [/B]30150
Useable Case Capaci: 46.998 grain H2O = 3.051 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.800 inch = 71.12 mm
Barrel Length      : [B]16.1 inch [/B]= 408.9 mm

Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 62000 psi, or 427 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 104 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !

86 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 80%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type          Filling/Loading Ratio  Charge    Charge   Vel. Prop.Burnt P max  P muzz  B_Time
                                      %     Grains    Gramm   fps     %       psi     psi    ms
---------------------------------  -----------------------------------------------------------------
IMR 3031                           104.0     42.1     2.73    2662   100.0    61974   11121   0.838  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon CFE223                      97.9     47.3     3.06    2662    96.4    62000   11873   0.832  ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 748                      95.8     44.7     2.89    2651    98.3    62000   11490   0.836  ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4895                           103.0     44.6     2.89    2646    96.1    62000   11865   0.843  ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon BL-C2                       98.2     46.4     3.01    2641    97.3    62000   11701   0.843  ! Near Maximum !
Alliant AR-Comp                     99.0     41.5     2.69    2639   100.0    62000   10219   0.840  ! Near Maximum !


7.62x39 123gr PSP @ 2464 fps
BC .275
100y +2" , 2180 fps, 1296 ft lbs energy
200y -1.6" , 1913 fps, 999 ft lbs
300y -15", 1670 fps, 761 ft lbs
400y -41" , 1451 fps, 575 ft lbs
500y -83" , 1267 fps, 438 ft lbs

308 Win 150gr NBT @ 2650 fps
BC .435
100y +2" , 2460 fps, 2015 ft lbs
200y 0.0" , 2277 fps, 1727 ft lbs
300y -9" , 2103 fps, 1472 ft lbs
400y -25" , 1936 fps, 1250 ft lbs
500y -51" , 1778 fps, 1052 ft lbs


similar ballistic sLaugh2Laugh2
Click to expand...

There was a guy on CGN that posted test results from a 16.1" Ruger and got SKS speeds. (And remember I got 2521fps from a 17.5" barrel and 2770fps from the same ammo in a 22" gun)

"308 Win, Remington CoreLokt 150gr PSP ~ 2820 fps#claimed
16.1" Ruger m77 ~ 2496 fps

308 Win, Nosler TG 150gr Accubond ~ 2875 fps#claimed
16.1" Ruger ~ 2446 fps"

Here's the thread something about reality:
https://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php/1781422-Factory-ammo-speed-the-reality
 
Last edited:
MiG25 said:
There was a guy on CGN that posted test results from a 16.1" Ruger and got SKS speeds. (And remember I got 2521fps from a 17.5" barrel and 2770fps from the same ammo in a 22" gun)
Click to expand...


Laugh2

SKS speed for 150 grain bullet is 2100 FPS. Maybe less, you can't trust them darn ammo companies. :)
 
Last edited:
Best to use software to model ammo potential loaded to SAAMI max pressures rather than cherry pick a few factory load results if we are going to have an honest discussion on the capabilities of cartridges
 
You know a cartridge is overrated when computer models need to be relied on rather than actual data.

Lots of excuses as if 25 grains more bullet weight puts the Shorty 308 in a different league than the SKS.

Actual measurements of a wide cross section of loads from Remington, Nosler, Hirtenburger and IMI loads all say the Shorty 308 punches like an SKS.
 
7.62x39 123gr PSP @ 2464 fps
BC .275
100y +2" , 2180 fps, 1296 ft lbs energy
200y -1.6" , 1913 fps, 999 ft lbs
300y -15", 1670 fps, 761 ft lbs
400y -41" , 1451 fps, 575 ft lbs
500y -83" , 1267 fps, 438 ft lbs

308 Win 150gr NBT @ 2470 fps
BC .435
100y +2" , 2290 fps, 1745 ft lbs
200y -1" , 2112 fps, 1486 ft lbs
300y -12" , 1945 fps, 1260 ft lbs
400y -32" , 1790 fps, 1063 ft lbs
500y -62" , 1640 fps, 895 ft lbs


Even dropping down to factory ammo velocity, similar ballistics? Laugh2Laugh2
 
Last edited:
todbartell said:
7.62x39 123gr PSP @ 2464 fps
BC .275
100y +2" , 2180 fps, 1296 ft lbs energy
200y -1.6" , 1913 fps, 999 ft lbs
300y -15", 1670 fps, 761 ft lbs
400y -41" , 1451 fps, 575 ft lbs
500y -83" , 1267 fps, 438 ft lbs

308 Win 150gr NBT @ 2470 fps
BC .435
100y +2" , 2290 fps, 1745 ft lbs
200y -1" , 2112 fps, 1486 ft lbs
300y -12" , 1945 fps, 1260 ft lbs
400y -32" , 1790 fps, 1063 ft lbs
500y -62" , 1640 fps, 895 ft lbs


Even dropping down to factory ammo velocity, similar ballistics? Laugh2Laugh2
Click to expand...

Do the SKS bullets bounce off?
 
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