One powder for both .38 Spl. & .357 Mag.?

HOWDY , my turn ! KISS for newbes is good . So HP 38 with 357 cases and lead 158 grain bullets will cover most all your needs .
Note HP 38 and winchester 231 are the same stuff they tell me but do not mix one can with the other due to different batch lots . (each batch of a powder may vary slightly from each other ) Use 357 cases as they are more costly to purchase but will last a long time with mild reloads .
Buy a Lyman reloading book and read the chapters at the front of the book and follow what they say .
 
Here is a recommendation especially for beginning loaders. Trail Boss, it is faster than WW231 but slower than Tightgroup. It's main advantage is it is designed to be a very bulky powder and is much easier to see if there is a double charge, a big advantage for a new handloader ESPECIALLY when using deep 357 mag cases. I tend to stress safety for new handloaders, and it gives THEM greater confidence.

If you are loading light loads, it is very difficult to see a double charge of a fast powder like Tightgroup in a 357 mag case.

With Trail Boss you won't get top velocities in 357, but then again, since it is designed for lighter loads and you won't have to worry about detonation if you download a 357 mag case to slow 38 spl velocities.
 
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Thanks, everyone. H4227 looks like it could work for both, but on balance, I think I'm going to recommend that my friend just buy two powders and be done with it. The usual caution applies: only have one powder on the bench at a time. And if he cleans the gun after each range session (or gives the cylinder a quick scrub when switching from .38 to .357) there should be no problem with fouling buildup from the .38 Spl. rounds.

:) Stuart
 
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Titegroup is probably the most economical and versatile of the works. I use it in everything from 32acp up to 44mag. If you want the thunder and lightning associated with the magnum, then you need a powder like W296 or H110 but u will also be using 2x+ the powder.
You wont be disappointed with Titegroup.
dB
 
I agree with the recommendation of Tightgroup and W296/H110 (W296/H110 are the same powder). Note that with W296/H110 you must NOT download this powder. The same warnings also apply to other powders like 2400.

I would still recommend Trail Boss as the "faster" powder for light 38 spl loads. As mentioned, it is VERY difficult to see a couple grains of Tightgroup at the bottom of a 38 spl case and easy to miss a double charge. A pound of Trail Boss also goes just a far as Tightgroup.
 
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The slow burning powders (2400,4227) that have been mentioned are only beneficial in long barrels.

Check your reloading manual for the test barrel length - accuracy suffers and muzzle blast gets silly with anything slower than Longshot in a six inch barrel, and gets worse as you load it heavier.

If you need more smack than a fast powder can give you, ( Tite,Bull,Red,HP38,etc) then you likely should get a larger caliber.

Checking cases for double charges is all very nice, but if you have to check, your process needs refining - use two blocks and stop chatting.

One last vote for Tite in .357 cases loaded up or down.

Later, Longshot would satisfy a thirst for power.
 
SandRoad said, "I agree with the recommendation of Tightgroup and W296/H110 (W296/H110 are the same powder). Note that with W296/H110 you must NOT download this powder. The same warnings also apply to other powders like 2400."

I have stated on here before that 2400 is one of the oldest smokeless powders in existance. For a hundred years plus, it has been used extensively and one of its major uses has been for light loads in nearly every calibre that shoots a bullet out the barrel.
So why do you come out with a statement like "you must NOT download this powder (or similar powders?)
If there is one loading book that is considered the bible of loading cast bullets, it is Lymans Handbook of Cast Bullets. Take a look at how they say to load 2400 powder.
In a 30-06 with 150 grain bullets, 16 grains of 2400----1685
26 grains of 2400----2180

This is an example of what is shown for most of the rifle loadings. For example,
30-40 Crag---- 15 grains of 2400, or 25 grains.

Or, go to the 44 magnum, with 250 grain bullet,
14 grains of 2400------1015
20 grains of 2400------1450.

Is this examples of downloading, or what?
In a century of using this powder for light loads by most of the shooters in North America, at least, how many cartridges do you suppose have been so loaded?
If you are going to stick to your claim of not loading such powders light, then come up with proof that something drastic happened when 2400 was loaded light.
 
.38/.357

For a long number of years I stopped using any other powder than WW231 it works quite well in all my reloads from .32 up to .44mag and is a breeze to feed in my Lee auto- prime, reasonably clean and reliable even with some higher power hollow points, lots of my shooting buds switched to this and all like it as well. Good luck we are all trying to help, evertone welcome.
 
anchor3593 said:
The slow burning powders (2400,4227) that have been mentioned are only beneficial in long barrels....
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Interesting that 4227 appears near and at the top of Hodgdon's list for both .38 Spl. & .357 Mag., and 2400 is also listed in the Lee Manual for both (IIRC- I don't have it in front of me), although it's higher up the list for the .357 Mag. I had wondered if the fact that my friend's S&W has a 6" barrel might be beneficial with these powders. 6" is only moderately long, of course.

Anyway, I'm still going to recommend using two powders.

:) Stuart
 
Sure - go for it - that's the fun of it - and there are so many variables that allow us each to be right in our own opinion. : )

I just checked my numbers and found that Universal gave me the lowest SD in .357, but does not do as well at low pressures. I bought it for .45 acp, but it wasn't consistent until loaded to higher pressure. In .38 spl, it still didn't do well.

Make noise - have fun!
 
H4831, there has been some evidence that light loads of 2400 have lead to detonation when light charges were used in relatively large cases. I am referring to say target velocity 38 spl loads. Although there have also been many disputes on this topic.

However, light loads in large cases is the main reason that Hodgdons made Trail Boss powder. A very high volume powder for light loads.

As far as downloading W296, it is specifically noted on the Hodgdon/Winchester website.

For those loads listed where a starting load is not shown, start 10% below the suggested maximum load and then approach maximums carefully, watching for any sign of pressure (difficult extraction, cratered and flattened or blown primers, and unusual recoil). H110 and Winchester 296 loads should not be reduced more than 3%.

Reduce H110 and Winchester 296 loads 3% and work up from there. H110 and Winchester 296 if reduced too much will cause inconsistent ignition. In some cases it will lodge a bullet in the barrel, causing a hazardous situation (Barrel Obstruction). This may cause severe personal injury or death to users or bystanders. DO NOT REDUCE H110 LOADS BY MORE THAN 3%.
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SandRoad said:
H4831, there has been some evidence that light loads of 2400 have lead to detonation when light charges were used in relatively large cases. I am referring to say target velocity 38 spl loads. Although there have also been many disputes on this topic.

However, light loads in large cases is the main reason that Hodgdons made Trail Boss powder. A very high volume powder for light loads.

As far as downloading W296, it is specifically noted on the Hodgdon/Winchester website.
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and round and round we go again- 4831 and i discussed this 2 pages back
 
Bobby Ironsights said:
Well then, RCBS is making a killing off of newb's like me.

I bought both of them as a package deal, used, in the EE.
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a little research on your part would have prevented this- now, go sell off your 357s to make a little extra money , turn your seater up by whatever, and remember it when you graduate to 44- buy special dies- in each case( pardon the pun) the case length between a special and a magnum is only 1/8th of an inch and is there mainly to prevent chambering magnum loads in special chambered guns- that's the same reason as you'll often see 38/357 listed together, ( and by all rights, 44spl/44 mag should be) but 44 spls are kind of rare -most everybody buys the mag unless they want a small frame like a bulldog or something
 
t-star said:
and round and round we go again- 4831 and i discussed this 2 pages back
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I know, my point was never really about detonations. It was about about starting off a new reloader using a bulky, fast burning powder instead of a dense, low volume powder, especially in a case like 38spl/357mag. Whether it is a detonation or double charge, the results are the same.......
 
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