Opinions wanted on Lee-Enfield No4 Mk1 bolt with file/grinding marks behind lugs

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stickhunter

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Hi all,

I purchased what appeared to be a very nice Long Branch Lee-Enfield No4 Mk1* rifle from an out-of-province dealership. The rifle arrived today, and upon inspection, I have some concerns and would like to get some advice/opinions.

First off, understanding that the rifle is a ####-on-close, I still found the action noticeably difficult to close and with a gritty/rough feel on the final rotation. I've owned Lee Enfields in the past and I don't recall feeling the action was that difficult to ####-and-lock.

When I took the bolt out to inspect, I noticed some obvious file or grinder marks at the rear lugs. There are undercuts behind the lugs, and I'm pretty sure the bearing surfaces have been touched, which I think you can see quite well in the second picture of the right lug.

The bolt is matching to the receiver and has a No. 1 head. My thoughts are that someone replaced the head, found the action hard to close, so relieved the lugs rather than finding another head.

That being said, I'm not that familiar with Lee Enfields, although I've not seen anything like this in pictures of other No. 4 bolts.

Does this look abnormal to you? If so, I think there's reasonable grounds to return the rifle and ask for a full refund.

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I just noticed, too, that the right lug is not bearing at all on the locking surface. Again, I'm not sure if this is normal, but even if the right lug is a safety lug, there seems to be a significant gap.

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Addenum: After reading about the procedure for fitting a Lee Enfield bolt (https://enfield-rifles.com/lee-enfield-bolt_topic10006_post109412.html?KW=bolt+fitting#109412), I'm pretty sure this is an unsafe rifle. From what I understand, there should be roughly equal bearing on both the lugs, and this rifle clearly has 0% contact on the right/top lug. Looking at the second picture, the base of the right lug shows you how much has been removed. Why, oh why, would someone do this?
 
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Don't shoot it!
Can you return it for a refund? Or do you want to try to repair it?
Someone pooched the bolt. You need to replace the body, and perhaps the head, if necessary to set the headspace.
Have a good look to make sure the bubbidiot didn't work on the receiver too. Heaven only knows what else might be wrong, or what he was trying to "fix".
 
Ouch. Someone didn’t know what they were doing. Definitely screwed the lugs up. This should have been disclosed by the seller. Needs a new bolt minimum. I wouldn’t even attempt to fire it. Depends how bad you want the rifle but me I would be wanting money back including shipping as you where sold a defective and possibly dangerous rifle.
If you decide to keep it ,it can be fixed. Another bolt and head to match for proper headspace.
 
tiriaq said:
Don't shoot it!
Can you return it for a refund? Or do you want to try to repair it?
Someone pooched the bolt. You need to replace the body, and perhaps the head, if necessary to set the headspace.
Have a good look to make sure the bubbidiot didn't work on the receiver too. Heaven only knows what else might be wrong, or what he was trying to "fix".
Click to expand...

The store has a 30 day return policy w/ a 10% restocking fee and no shipping refund. In this case, I will be asking for a full refund and reimbursement of shipping both ways as the rifle should not have been sold in this condition. I'm pretty sure the store will agree (I've dealt with them many times, so will be surprised otherwise).

I took a good look at the receiver yesterday and couldn't see any signs of bubba around the recoil lug recesses or other areas, so I think with a bolt replacement/refitting, it could be put back into service (the bore is excellent, stocks are great, all parts I could see are LB marked). Unfortunately, I have enough projects on the go and from the collector standpoint, I'd want a matching bolt, so definitely not a keeper for me.
 
Good on you for catching those details and looking up the specs. Pretty pointed lesson how much a "matching" serial number on bolt to receiver amounts to, after the rifle has been out of military hands, possibly 65 years. "Matching number" means about nothing - "inspecting for fit" is about everything, if you plan to shoot it.

I would be concerned that something also was done on that right side seat in the receiver - was almost the definition of a receiver needed to be discarded and replaced. If the receiver is sound and untouched, it might be possible to fit a replacement bolt - was why they made "spares", but you may not want to go through that commotion. That reference that you found, and others on-line, goes through the entire process - from fitting a bare bolt body to receiver, then fitting guts into the bolt body, then fitting a head that clocks properly, then verifying head space to military spec.
 
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Thanks for the feedback and confirmation!

The store has agreed to take back the rifle for a full refund, including my return shipping. I would have preferred to have had the store catch this issue from the get-go, but this is the second best outcome. I'll keep an eye on the store's listings once I make the return, but I'm not expecting this rifle to show up again without either a replacement/fitted bolt or a disclaimer that it is a "gunsmith special".
 
Just a heads up that my returned rifle arrived back at the dealer just before Christmas, so it may get relisted (hopefully with a repaired or replaced bolt). So if you see a 1950's dated Long Branch No4 Mk1* for sale soon, please make sure to give it a good look over.
 
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Also, a not-too-uncommon failing for the Long Branch or Savage No. 4 Mk.1* is the bolt removal slot - was a known "weakness", I think - with use, that slot's edges would chip or wear away - to the extent that the bolt head often "jumped out" when trying to cycle the rifle. Is not shown in your pictures above - you had enough issues with the bolt's fit as it was - but is also another place to inspect carefully, if you want a "shooter" Mk.1*.

I think the Mk.1* was only made by Long Branch or Savage - I do not think any of the British makers adopted those changes from the Mk.1.
 
The file marks around the bolt body would be good enough for me not to want to shoot it...will it separate( blow the bolt in two pieces)...or will it not! File marks around the bolt body weeken the body and make for a prefect place for the crack to form, around the body...and eventually blowing in at least two piece! I have two or three no4 bolt ( with out the the bolt heads) in my drawer , if you need one ...or the EE will probably have a bunch.
Cheers
B
 
I suspect the bolt was not matched to the rifle and this was an attempt to ''fix'' the headspace.

On second look, that bolt should be trashed.

One lug has been ground way to far to even make contact. The other is questionable as well.

I doubt the bolt would break but it's very possible that the bolt would slip back far enough during firing to cause the case to rupture, blow out the magazine and release bits of shrapnel/gasses back into the shooter's face, maybe destroying the rifle at the same time.
 
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