origin of "mauser" military cartridges?

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MiG25

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quite a few cartridges have "mauser" tagged onto the end of their name. how many actually originated in the mauser shop?

in what i think is chronological order:

11x60, i think paul mauser designed this one in 1870 or so.

9.5x60, another mauser product?

10.15mm for serbia?

8x57 was designed by a commission at spandau in 1887 or 88.

7.65x53 belgian/argentine, i have read that this one did come from mauser in '88 or 89 or did the belgians design it?

7x57, who designed this one? mauser or maybe another commission? from around 1892.

6.5x55 was designed by a swedish/norwegian commission in about 1893.

7.63mm for the mauser broomhandle, where did this on come from?

6.5x58, where did this one come from? mauser or did the portugese develop it in the late 1890?

8x50 for siam, is this an original cartridge or a copy of the 8x50r from austria?

9mm mauser export, did this one come out of the mauser shop?

any others that were actually adopted by somebody somewhere?
 
BTT

What an interesting thread! :)

I know it can be debated on hundreds of pages.
I always liked these threads...



If I'm allowed to add, where is "13mm Mauser"?
(you know, in ww1 for anti-armour purposes...)
 
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Siam(Thailand) used them in .45-70. Plus .30-06 and I think .308. Israel and a bunch of South American countries as I recall.
 
The Siamese Mausers in 45-70 are commercial conversions done after the rifles were sold surplus; originally 8mm. rifles made in Tokyo.
 
7.63 ctg for the C96 pistol was copied from the round for the Borchardt pistol but with a heavier loading.
It appears that the 7.9 ctg was developed by the same commission that adopted the G88. The commission was impressed by the rimless Rubin ctg over a proposed 11mm case necked to 8mm.
 
tiriaq said:
The Siamese Mausers in 45-70 are commercial conversions done after the rifles were sold surplus; originally 8mm. rifles made in Tokyo.
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No, the Siamese Mausers shoot a rimmed cartridge, the only Mauser to do so, hence the popularity in converting them to 45-70.

7x57 was used in the Spanish Mausers, so of Spanish origin?
 
Hey, hey, rock’n’roll, wait a second:)

I’m not a moderator, but the thread was about the cartridges, not the rifles:D
A little hi-jacking is ok by me, as long as it doesn’t create confusion.
So, my 2c about the cartridges (but feel free to flame me):

7x57 was designed in Germany, by commission or not, and it was sold to few south American countries.
It was used by the Mexicans in the Spanish-American war. The Americans who fired captured mausers were impressed by the accuracy and precision of that cartridge and rifle compared to that horribility issued to the American troops at the time. After the war, they wanted to copy it, but the they were too proud to make an exact copy. So they made it bigger, larger bore, etc, you probably remember the drill because they called it 30-06. Not even american arms historians deny it. But if you do, put a x57 cartridge ass in ass with a 30-06 and see for yourself.


No, the Siamese Mausers shoot a rimmed cartridge, the only Mauser to do so
Click to expand...
11mm Mauser is a rimmed cartridge as well.


It would be interesting to hear which of these cartridges were designed for black powder and which for smokeless, because people might reload today 11mm (just an example) after one recipe or another for smokeless, but originally it was designed for black.
 
Subtle irony is the fact that the Brazilian Mauser's have the star of David logo on the butt stocks...A Jewish family was making the Mausers, damn good ones at that...oh we are talking about cartridges. :p :D
 
Calum said:
Subtle irony is the fact that the Brazilian Mauser's have the star of David logo on the butt stocks...A Jewish family was making the Mausers, damn good ones at that...oh we are talking about cartridges. :p :D
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that is no more ironic than remington making rifles for russia. the brazilian mausers came from imperial germany where there was little or no institutional anti-semitism other than jews being bared from the officer corp of the prussian army on the basis that prussia was a christian kingdom. i don't think that the other component armies of the german empire had these restrictions, ie the army corps from the kingdoms of saxony, bavaria, wurttemburg or the duchy of baden. aside from restricting jews from the officer corp, historically prussia was probably the most tolerant state in europe.

but, back to the topic. i think it is well established that the 7.9x57, 6.5x55, and the 7.63x25 did not originate with the mauser company.

mauser is typically credited with the 11x60 and 7.65x53. i would also guess that the 9.5x60 came from mauser as well.

what about the 6.5x58 portugese, did the portugese basically say they like the 7x57 but want their own cartridge and just gave mauser a spec or did mauser design it and then pitch it?

also, the 11x60, 10.15x??, and the 9.5x60 were originally black powder. all the later were for smokeless.

here is another question, how many broomhandles did mauser sell in 9mm mauser export, where did they go, and where are they now?
 
From Gotz the 11.15 ctg was derived from the 11x50r Werder ctg by the Prussian commission.
In the late 1880s the German commission was working on a 7mm ctg as well as the 7.9. This could be the forerunner of the 7x57.
 
You guys are also forgetting the non-military rounds that were developped by Mauser for African game hunting like the various 9.3mm hunting rounds.
 
Calum said:
Subtle irony is the fact that the Brazilian Mauser's have the star of David logo on the butt stocks...A Jewish family was making the Mausers, damn good ones at that...oh we are talking about cartridges. :p :D
Click to expand...

How about some Israeli 7.92x57mm ammunition? (1951 vintage, on the left)

442051998_24230dee2b_o.jpg
 
Claven2 said:
The Siamese rimmed cartridge was 8mm. Just not 8x57. It was 8x52R.
Click to expand...


the siamese mausers purchased from mauser were originally in 8x50R or were they in 7x57 (i don't have my copy of MMROTW handy)? weren't the mausers ordered from japan originally in 8x50R and then upgraded to 8x52R in the 1920's?
 
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There isn't any proof for this, but some people believe that 8x57 and 7x57 were designed at the same time but released at different dates.
Cartridge designers often work on more than one bore diam.


Un-related question: where is, and most important what is 6.5x57???? Sometimes the words "German Mauser" or "German" are added to its name when reffered to it in English speaking countries. I can find only few data (in Edelbrunner mostly) who basically says that it's not a wildcat made by joe blow, but a hope of the German govt. It won a couple of popular German rifle competitions in the 30's before they raised the min. allowed bore to 7mm and after that to 8mm. It was forgotten before the ww2.
Does anybody know anything more about that cartridge?
 
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