Original Soviet SKS ammo load out?
- Thread starter Steiner
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gewehr76
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Soviet doctrine for SKS is guard duty. So very rarely full loadout needed. In most cases its unfolded bayo was the only thing for deployment that's required. 30 rounds on stripper clips fit in sks pouches plus 10 in the mag. so 40 rds probably.
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I put 40 rounds into pouches, and I can comfortably carry two pouches. I am sure they wood have been capable of carrying 80 rounds + 10 in rifle.
WW2 soviet loadout before an operation
So at a guess for post-war it would be expected for a Soviet soldier to carry at least 120 rounds on them if they follow their planned post-war infantry doctrine of SKS=rifleman and AK47=Submachine gunners.
So at a guess for post-war it would be expected for a Soviet soldier to carry at least 120 rounds on them if they follow their planned post-war infantry doctrine of SKS=rifleman and AK47=Submachine gunners.
gewehr76
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Well its misconception, SKS was never envisioned to be infantry issued weapon. It was adopted at the same year as AK. And issued to special troops that typically had other things to do than fight with their rifles. So ammo load out for those troops was minimal as I said they had other things to do, like fuel rockets, guard trains or drive what ever heavy equipment they were assigned to. So too much ammo on them is a hinderance.
AK and RPD were issued for fighting not SKS in soviet doctrine.
The SKS was envisioned as a direct replacement for the M44 carbine rifleman while the AK-47 was a replacement for the several SMG's the Red army had
When they actually compared the SKS and AK side by side, they realized that they could go all AK's instead as they were very similar in performance in the field.
EDIT: That loadout I posted is also the WW2 loadout when they were equipped with Mosin-nagant rifles, I suspect they might have doctrinally issued more ammo than 120 rounds because as you said the x39 round is lighter and smaller than x54r. It does give you a good starting point at what the Soviet army would consider as minimally armed in terms of ammo.
When they actually compared the SKS and AK side by side, they realized that they could go all AK's instead as they were very similar in performance in the field.
EDIT: That loadout I posted is also the WW2 loadout when they were equipped with Mosin-nagant rifles, I suspect they might have doctrinally issued more ammo than 120 rounds because as you said the x39 round is lighter and smaller than x54r. It does give you a good starting point at what the Soviet army would consider as minimally armed in terms of ammo.
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I wonder how often real-world conditions allowed for the issuance of the doctrinally required amount of ammunition to each soldier during WW2?
I would wager anybody on guard duty would be provided minimal extra ammunition, 2 clips of 10rds or 1 spare magazine depending on the firearm.
I would wager anybody on guard duty would be provided minimal extra ammunition, 2 clips of 10rds or 1 spare magazine depending on the firearm.
Out in the field? Probably depends on time period. Pre war/very early war pictures/videos show soldiers wear full load-outs including canvas y-straps similar to those Germans had, spike bayonet scabbards, gas mask bags, bread bags, double ammo pouches/loose ammo pouches, various grenade pouches etc. So they probably did have full load-outs of ammo. Speaking about "SMG gunner load-out" posted above, it indicates 3 drums, 2 in pouches 1 in the gun. Well, Im not sure about PPD but from what I've read I understand that PPSh came out of the factory with 2 drums. Those 2 drums were tested at the factory and assigned to that particular weapon because PPSh was known to have fitting issues with other drums. Things got pretty hairy during/after 1941 and stayed like that up until Kursk which was in the summer of 1943, things like Stalingrad, Rzhev, Kharkov etc were one big clusterduck for both sides, by the looks of it amount of equipment seen in pictures from that mid period started shrinking. Y-straps went almost 100% MIA, soviet soldiers usually had less equipment compared to Germans. 1-2 rifle ammo pouches, 1 SMG pouch, loose grenades, canteen, spade and a backpack. Plus things like a poncho and greatcoat or padded jacket/pants. I suspect things like gear/ammo got issued at the depot but as person was participating in combat gear would get ruined/lost and that was that, things became "get resupplied with whatever is available" kind of thing because it was a logistical nightmare for the first half of the war, especially during fall/spring. I was kind of difficult to maintain steady supply runs when roads are a mess, entire armies are encircled and enemy has air superiority. Plus early on soviets were loosing a lot of ground and supply depots along with it. Just to give you an idea Germans managed to get their hands on something like 1.5 million SVT’s early in the war.
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jmichelin84
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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I heard that the normal load out was 200 rounds of ammo on stripper clips, a knife, mess kit and the standard tools each shoulder was required to carry
chillyrabbit, 2/3 out of that 120 rounds probably had to be packed away or stuffed in pockets. Good thing soviet breeches have really deep pockets 
fully loaded Mosin pouch only holds 20 rounds. It's 2 cell compared to German 3 cell K98 pouch. SVT pouch holds 2 mags - 20 rounds or 6 clips. Loose ammo pouch can hold probably 30-40 rounds if that. Dont have mine on hand now. So person would have 45 to 60 rounds in pouches/rifle. I guess rest was still in paper, sitting in the backpack or gas mask bag. Ammo bandoleers were a thing and got issued but rarely seen after Finish war/early WW2.
fully loaded Mosin pouch only holds 20 rounds. It's 2 cell compared to German 3 cell K98 pouch. SVT pouch holds 2 mags - 20 rounds or 6 clips. Loose ammo pouch can hold probably 30-40 rounds if that. Dont have mine on hand now. So person would have 45 to 60 rounds in pouches/rifle. I guess rest was still in paper, sitting in the backpack or gas mask bag. Ammo bandoleers were a thing and got issued but rarely seen after Finish war/early WW2.
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They were not issued duty knives, at least nothing standard issue I'm aware of, there is something called reconnaissance knife but that was not issued to everybody. German army was different. K98 bayonets had no factory edge so troops had kampfmesser - fighting knife issued to them. But yea, soviets were known to go into combat very light. Tons of pictures show spade, canteen, grenades and ammo pouches. Well, also rag-tag things like ammo belts crossed on the chest to be used as bandoleers, German bayonets/grenades etc. there are pictures of "home made" bandoleers made using cloth MG belts. Red army had issued bandoleers but that was almost never seen during mid/late war. Like I already said if you count ammo average soldier would have in fully loaded pouches it'll be 40-60 rounds, depending on pouches person had on. Rest would be in pockets/backpack/gas mask bag. Germans had 60 in pouches +5 in the gun. They didn't even have "loose ammo pouch" like soviets did.
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Here's a picture of "ideal" pre war/early war gear, enough room to hold 120 rounds but I dont know if I've even seen actual war photo showing something like that being worn. Maybe pre war/early war/khalkhin gol. SVT pouch, Mosin pouch, loose ammo pouch and bandoleer are shown. There is one original bandoleer from 1943 shown so they were being produced but beats me why they were not issued en mass. https://forum.ww2.ru/index.php?showtopic=4613576
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easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Greater Vancouver, BC
Just a bit of information. The Viet Cong used a 9 pouch bandoleer. 2 clips per pouch for a total of 180 rds, plus of course 10 in the rifle.
Yea, China supplied them and North Koreans with tons of PLA equipment/gear, including those canvas bandoleers. I have PLA 3 single mag cell AK one made from same material. I also have original soviet "belt A". That one also has 3 cells but holds 6 AK mags.
