Out of the closet - Switchin Teams,,, well sort of!

[cigar_man]

I have been a die hard Remington 870 Fanboy for over 50 years now!

Back in the early 90's I was working with and building licensed versions of Scattergun Technologies shotguns here in Canada until they more or less merged with Wilson Combat.

The U.S Border Patrol was a big seller and highly sought after in those days.



Fast forward, many US agencies and police forces have switched over to carrying patrol carbines, but I will never forget a chance meeting that I had with Massad Ayoob at Camp Perry, U.S.A. mid 80's.

(For the younger generation, Massad Ayoob is a high profile U.S. firearms - self-defense instructor and Security advisor)

I can still see him standing there with the group of us all huddled around him with his 870 and saying, there is nothing better than getting someones attention when you rack the slide of a pump action shotgun.

That noise will put the fear of God into anyone!

I still own my version of a modified Scatgun Tech shottie and a shorty Dominion Arms 870 and I'm almost convinced the Dominion Arms version is a better made gun,,,,,,,,,,,, almost.

Also back in the 80's I was introduced to the Mossberg 88 - 500 - 590 - 590A1 series and I will say, I was very impressed with the whole line of shotguns right down to the mighty Maverick 88.

My buddies all owned various Mossberg versions, but mostly 590A1's and we put them through their paces on the military ranges.

I have spoken with many U.S. military personal over the years that carried and used both the 870 and 590A1 in every conflict under the sun and most had a favourable liking to the 590A1's including the armourers (armorer U.S. Forces) and techs.

The armourers and techs that I spoke with seem to prefer the Mossberg lineup rather than Remington when it came to complete maintenance due to not needing any special tools as in reference to the Rem 870 ejector that is staked in with a rivets.

Mossberg's flagship of the word "TOUGH" seems to be the 590A1 line and thats were my "Switchin Teams" phrase has come into play.

I was so impressed in the past with the Mossberg 590A1 Class III that I took advantage of the New Years sale at Bullseye North.

Don't get me wrong, I luv the 870 Team, but my one and only real hangup has always been that staked in ejector, which is no problem for me as I have the tools.

Field repairs?

Hmmmm

My only Mossberg hangup was always the aluminum receiver, but let's just say, I'm over that one now.

In the end, the Mossberg series can be up and running in minutes with spare parts by anyone technically inclined to do so.

Why in the hell didn't Remington straighten out that ejector issue years ago is beyond me!!!

For now I will hang onto my Rem 870's and I will never part with the Dominion Arms shorty, but you never know what the future will bring.

Happy New Year GunNutzer's and welcome to 2024!

 

[Pete04]

DA shorty, 870s and 590s are all winners in mho.

Happy New Year to All

 

[misterplinker1]

Got the same deal at Bullseye... just waiting on shipping. Can get the barrel threaded for chokes if you want to shoot clays with it too.

 

[lerch641]

I started with a short DA Grizzly, before grabbing a 20" 870 and later a 20" 590A1. I've had a 14" 590A1 for a few years now and it's dead nuts reliable.

I definitely suggest the extended action release from Shoten Armory if you add a pistol grip.

 

[supernova]

Been rocking one for years. The finish is worn and it has quite a few mods but I trust my life to it.

 

[Suther]

I am a Mossberg fan over the 870, prefer the action release location on the Mossberg. And the tang safety over the crossbolt.

Don't have a 590, just a regular 500, but I would trust my life to it even if its not the fancy "milspec" whatever whatever model. I'd love a 14" 590, but I already have an 18" barrel on my 500 and I can't justify the cost to knock a few inches off right now. One day maybe...

 

[I Dont Care About You]

My first 12ga was a Mossberg 500 Persuader. Sold that many years ago and have had several 870's over the years but the one 870 Express I have had for about 35 years now is still an awesome shotgun and I'd bet my life on it.

I've considered a 590 but honestly there is just not that much difference between the Rem and Moss. They are both excellent shotguns that have been made by the tens of millions.

I have recently been considering a Beretta semi-auto, either the 1301 or the A300. Talk about coming out.

 

[bdb.hunting]

I have no comments about shotguns just here to say you had an awesome title!

Cheers,
B

 

[bunny]

I have about seven 870’s and four mossy’s. For clay shooting the old 870’s are hard to beat, but I love my 14” 590A1. Currently been shooting a Maverick 88 at the sporting clays range, and I gotta say for $325 I am impressed!! Love outshooting guys with $7000 + over unders with my 88 and the mod choke it came with never gets changed.

 

[ReverendX]

Mossbergs are great. I’ve had many..

Mossberg 500, a 590A1, and a 590 Retro. All nice.

 

[Painkillers]

My love affair with 12 gauge shotguns began with my Dad's Mossberg 195, a bolt action, mag fed, shotgun with an adjustable choke muzzle and porting gills. From there I evolved into pumps via the venerable Wingmasters. I still have a few, my trap gun is a Wingmaster and I have an 18 or 20 inch police riot control slug gun.

Then came the 590A1 retrograde late in '22. I had to have it and love it. I've kitted with 1 1/2" swivels and leather repro, brass clasp military sling from Hunter Company. This 590A1 is not a fowler, it's a trench gun, with a bayonet mount...very front heavy, particularly with a full magazine tube, but I took it to the traps nonetheless. The results were anticipated. I hit clays but the cylinder bore, short barrel (18 or 20") doesn't make for a trap gun.

Recently I found a bead sited 14" parkerized barrel for a 590A1 here on the EE and made a deal, but what to put it on? It wasn't going on an 8 shot mag tube...I need another shotgun! Or so I convinced myself.

While lurking around, I found a very little used, wood furniture Mossberg 838 (2 3/4", 3", 3 1/2" shells) with a choked 30" ported barrel, and the 14" 590A1 barrel will fit I bought it.

I started a thread about who cuts chokes into the 590A1 barrels and got great advise and direction there. I intend on porting and Vang Comping the 14" 590A1 barrel and having it cut to accept 3.5" shells. It will reside on the 835. I'm really looking forward to learning what 3.5" buck shot can do out of a 14" Vang Comp barrel!

The OEM retrograde, I'll have cut for choke tubes. While I understand cylinder bore, it serves no purpose for me. I don't plan on sweeping enemy trenches any time soon.

One of the funnest shotguns I ever had was a single shot Cooey in .410. Neither me or my kids could miss with that thing, awesome fun.

 

[enefgee]

The DEA uses 14 inch Vang Comped 590's, very slick indeed.

 

[cigar_man]

The DEA uses 14 inch Vang Comped 590's, very slick indeed.

Most of all the Scatgun Techie 870's I built ended up being Vang Comped style ported by thier owners.

My buddy still has a 14" Border Patrol and that puppy just seems to sit there when it's fired.

 

[Leg]

I’d be interested in seeing pictures of your Scattergun Tech. One you built yourself?

Were the licensed one engraved the same as the US ones?

I’ve got an old pre Wilson 1rd mag ext that I got on trade years ago. It’s grooved as opposed to knurled and I’ve always wanted to use it on a retro build. I have two of the older Trac lock sights as well, before they added height in the rear to make them compatible with the Remington rifle ramp.

I like the 500 as well, but I have more 870s.

 

[cigar_man]

I’d be interested in seeing pictures of your Scattergun Tech. One you built yourself?

The one I have left was built with the remaining parts that I had left over and mounted on a Remington 870 Express receiver as I did not want to pay for the parkerized police model. Scatgun Tech used Remington Police grade 870's, worked on the trigger mechs and complete function reliability just to make sure there was not any hick-ups and so forth.

My 870 now, (as it has evolved since I first built it), wears an early Knoxx Spec Ops Stock and a Hogue foregrip with and 18.5 cylinder bore police 870 barrel from parts that I had left over, along with Scatgun logo sights and lastly a Scatgun logo extended magtube. I still have the Speedfeed stocks for it, but on another 870 of mine. Scatgun Tech at the time used off the shelf Speedfeed stocks, both the solid and extra shell carrying model. I liked the solid stock, tough as nails and almost indestructible.

My Knoxx recoil reducing stock is only on it for shooting slugs at the range!

I have always been a fan of the Hogue 870 foregrip, sticks to your hand like glue in all the conditions we used them for.

I'm very old school trained and have an old school thought process.

Hell, my CDN Forces days where with the FN-C1 and C-2's.

I'm personally not fond of even having a shell carrier on the side of the receiver of my shotguns.

Feedback on the shell carrier system in the 90's from the U.S. Border Patrol was that they soon stripped these off of their 870's as they were getting caught-up on clothing and brush. Also at certain points in the field some of their 870's had the mag-tube side mounted slings replaced so that they would face the bottom of the shotgun.

No more side snags!

I use ghost ring sights, but I'm also a fan of the plain ole bead sight.

I will not hang any flashlights or anything else as a matter of fact off of my shotguns, scopes, red dots, bayonets or whatever else anyone can come up with, not even real fond of a sling, except for certain circumstances.

Everyone has their own personal liking, but I consider all those things as something to just get caught up with or knocked off in real life conditions.

We were trained that a pistol grip shotgun stock could be twisted easy out of your hands by an opponent and it did, unlike a conventional stock, which was far more difficult to twist away from your grip if someone was trying to disarm you.

If you ever get to spend some time with Massad Ayoob, you will have a different look and respect at self defence scenarios.

Old School, but I still consider, solid as all hell.

Were the licensed one engraved the same as the US ones?

Yes and No, some were, but definitely not with U.S. Border Patrol etching!

At the time you had to be licensed through them to buy the parts directly.

(Myself, I was a Canadian Firearms licensed business for several years)

I eventually knew things where slipping with the company when they started selling their parts through Brownells in the U.S., then eventually the business over to Wilson Combat. I'm going to let that lay right there as I don't want to ruffle any past feathers.

I’ve got an old pre Wilson 1rd mag ext that I got on trade years ago. It’s grooved as opposed to knurled and I’ve always wanted to use it on a retro build. I have two of the older Trac lock sights as well, before they added height in the rear to make them compatible with the Remington rifle ramp.

Scat Gun Tech messed around and modded their parts as they evolved.

Somewhere I might have some pictures, but digital pics were in it's infant stage back then.

 

[Leg]

Some interesting tactical shotgun history, thanks for sharing.

I didn’t realize that Scattergun Tech, Nashville used Police Magnums as the base for their builds, makes a lot of sense though.

I have a police trade-in Wingmaster that is the perfect candidate for an old school build. Managed to get a set of new take off wood stocks off of a Police Magnum years ago. Scored a 14” barrel that came with the aforementioned Nashville magazine extension as well. I’ve had it all sitting around for years and I’d always planned on getting the barrel Vang Comp’d by TacOrd and parkerizing the receiver to match the barrel and mag extension. Need to get off my butt.

Now that I’m thinking about it, I’m pretty sure I also snagged a Scattergun Tech 3 point sling. Not that I’m a fan of them, but thought it might be good for clone build.

I do like Mossberg’s as well. I also have a 500 that I also had planned on replicating an old school build from one of Petersen’s Law Enforcement Weapons magazine articles from 2003 or so. I’ll be damned if I can find the article now though.

 

[Painkillers]

Ugh, the 835 came to me today and I swear the thing's never been fired. Unfortunately, the mag tube is too long for the 14" barrel. Who makes mag caps in house?

The barrel ring is about 2" below the magazine cap, but if a cap could be made that goes over the mag tube I could totally use the barrel. Think mag extension but reversed.

 

[Butcherbill]

Ugh, the 835 came to me today and I swear the thing's never been fired. Unfortunately, the mag tube is too long for the 14" barrel. Who makes mag caps in house?

The barrel ring is about 2" below the magazine cap, but if a cap could be made that goes over the mag tube I could totally use the barrel. Think mag extension but reversed.

Iirc people use a spacer to take up the room, inner and outer dia to match the barrel ring. Aluminum would be what I used as you’d likely not notice any weight difference, easy to turn on a lathe.

The other alternative and better looking is to find a gunsmith to relocate the ring, you’ll end up refinishing the barrel though.

 

[Painkillers]

Iirc people use a spacer to take up the room, inner and outer dia to match the barrel ring. Aluminum would be what I used as you’d likely not notice any weight difference, easy to turn on a lathe.

The other alternative and better looking is to find a gunsmith to relocate the ring, you’ll end up refinishing the barrel though.

Thanks, I'll see if TacOrdinance can sort it out. The thought of 3.5" 12 gauge buckshot out of a 14" barrel intrigues me.

 

[Butcherbill]

Thanks, I'll see if TacOrdinance can sort it out. The thought of 3.5" 12 gauge buckshot out of a 14" barrel intrigues me.

Depending on the outer diameter I might have some leftover aluminum round bar that might work as a spacer, would be easy to turn one up if you can give me good measurements of the inner and outer diameter of the barrel ring. They’re 1 1/4” in diameter and 2” in length.