Hello all, after doing some digging and wondering and pondering, I thought I would whip out my trusty CGN search page and look for some posts on +P ammo (talk about +P+ later perhaps).
Low and behold nothing.
Maybe I didn't do the several searches right, but at the very least it is not mentioned in any Thread title for the past 3 years. Anyways, strange right?
So for the record, I am not an expert, just happened to come accros the terms here and there. Wanted to edumactae my self. Nothing really on CGN. (maybe my thread can be a sticky
) - that's a double chin smiley, I was starting to get one a ways back, to much typing in my regular job). All better now, shooting sports, I've lost some weight, partially related to me feeding my gun and not my mouth.
So as it turns out this +P thing is in fact, a thing. I will leave the evolution of this thread, it's title, and of course some of it's content to the experts, but here is some things I would like to see this become.
1. Listing of firearms that positively are sold and documented as to support or not support these peculiar loads. (and the opposite but in more detail... item 2)
2. Examples of known issues that are based in science and or personal experience (not interested in a myriad of youtube links but maybe thats the best way at some point)
3. Evidence of local loaders/experts understanding the issues and document their findings or results in some way, educating others
4. other things that come up related
Depending on how awesome this thread becomes, I may choose to do some clever formatting or create separate links to public websites to track and log the data gathered. (I could create a spreadsheet or charts that will hypnotize you).
Of course, maybe there is something wrong with this thread and it has to come down, please let me know, but my thoughts are pure and lawful to my knowledge so far. I would hate for anyone to get hurt, this may help avoid accidents or perhaps even save some money somewhere.
---------
So I shall start the list...
---------
I know from an earlier call today that all Springfield 1911 5" models or higher and all XD series (XD, XDM, XD Mod2, XD-S) support the +P loads as long as they do not exceed their caliber maximum bullet grain weight. example 230gr for 45ACP, so a 231gr+P is not supported.
=====
That above sentence is really important to note... this stuff isn't just about one or two variables it seems. Depending on what others report, we will try to work out a means to display the results in a meaningful way.
---------
Here is a couple links to useful knowledge on the subject:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overpressure_ammunition
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/07/foghorn/ask-foghorn-what-does-p-and-p-mean/
http://www.taurususa.com/ammunition-guide.cfm
http://www.gundigest.com/ammunition...ticles-advice/understanding-plus-p-ammunition
***Added New links***
http://www.saami.org/
http://www.saami.org/PubResources/infoSpecs.cfm
********************
I was also told explicitly by Springfield Armory USA Customer Service in a very authoritative confident way about the above after they warned about two things-
1. they do not have this support listed in print officially (I asked) and probably won't for legal or other reasons, and
2. that +P+ is NOT the same as +P and the former +P+ should not be used in their firearms.
Anyone else know of some firearms they own if they do or do not support this type of ammo and their source for the information? I still don't know what to make of anyone making a claim, alebit perhaps even tested, that one works with X gun, just cause they tried and nothing bad happened once, or more times. I do not support simply doing that from my level of experience and think it a foolish act performed by those unqualified for which I am also not capable in assessing. You are all responsible for your things people, I can only hope you take the utmost care at all times and seek professional service for anything outside of your abilities. Stay Safe, that is what this thread is about. Having fun cannot be accomplished with this fundamental requirement.
I also realize there may be other forms of over pressure ammunition loads out there, let's try to keep this thread for now about gun support of these two types of loads, primarily the +P variation since +P+ is generally not a real standard but the former is a standard.
Also, if anyone has any contradicting information and preferably evidence to mine or others posts of their claim, I am wondering how to deal with that, but we shall see what happens with the posts... if anyone other than myself starts adding to this.
!! !! ! ................... !! !! !
Low and behold nothing.
Maybe I didn't do the several searches right, but at the very least it is not mentioned in any Thread title for the past 3 years. Anyways, strange right?
So for the record, I am not an expert, just happened to come accros the terms here and there. Wanted to edumactae my self. Nothing really on CGN. (maybe my thread can be a sticky
) - that's a double chin smiley, I was starting to get one a ways back, to much typing in my regular job). All better now, shooting sports, I've lost some weight, partially related to me feeding my gun and not my mouth.So as it turns out this +P thing is in fact, a thing. I will leave the evolution of this thread, it's title, and of course some of it's content to the experts, but here is some things I would like to see this become.
1. Listing of firearms that positively are sold and documented as to support or not support these peculiar loads. (and the opposite but in more detail... item 2)
2. Examples of known issues that are based in science and or personal experience (not interested in a myriad of youtube links but maybe thats the best way at some point)
3. Evidence of local loaders/experts understanding the issues and document their findings or results in some way, educating others
4. other things that come up related
Depending on how awesome this thread becomes, I may choose to do some clever formatting or create separate links to public websites to track and log the data gathered. (I could create a spreadsheet or charts that will hypnotize you).
Of course, maybe there is something wrong with this thread and it has to come down, please let me know, but my thoughts are pure and lawful to my knowledge so far. I would hate for anyone to get hurt, this may help avoid accidents or perhaps even save some money somewhere.
---------
So I shall start the list...
---------
I know from an earlier call today that all Springfield 1911 5" models or higher and all XD series (XD, XDM, XD Mod2, XD-S) support the +P loads as long as they do not exceed their caliber maximum bullet grain weight. example 230gr for 45ACP, so a 231gr+P is not supported.
=====
That above sentence is really important to note... this stuff isn't just about one or two variables it seems. Depending on what others report, we will try to work out a means to display the results in a meaningful way.
---------
Here is a couple links to useful knowledge on the subject:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overpressure_ammunition
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/07/foghorn/ask-foghorn-what-does-p-and-p-mean/
http://www.taurususa.com/ammunition-guide.cfm
http://www.gundigest.com/ammunition...ticles-advice/understanding-plus-p-ammunition
***Added New links***
http://www.saami.org/
http://www.saami.org/PubResources/infoSpecs.cfm
********************
I was also told explicitly by Springfield Armory USA Customer Service in a very authoritative confident way about the above after they warned about two things-
1. they do not have this support listed in print officially (I asked) and probably won't for legal or other reasons, and
2. that +P+ is NOT the same as +P and the former +P+ should not be used in their firearms.
Anyone else know of some firearms they own if they do or do not support this type of ammo and their source for the information? I still don't know what to make of anyone making a claim, alebit perhaps even tested, that one works with X gun, just cause they tried and nothing bad happened once, or more times. I do not support simply doing that from my level of experience and think it a foolish act performed by those unqualified for which I am also not capable in assessing. You are all responsible for your things people, I can only hope you take the utmost care at all times and seek professional service for anything outside of your abilities. Stay Safe, that is what this thread is about. Having fun cannot be accomplished with this fundamental requirement.
I also realize there may be other forms of over pressure ammunition loads out there, let's try to keep this thread for now about gun support of these two types of loads, primarily the +P variation since +P+ is generally not a real standard but the former is a standard.
Also, if anyone has any contradicting information and preferably evidence to mine or others posts of their claim, I am wondering how to deal with that, but we shall see what happens with the posts... if anyone other than myself starts adding to this.
!! !! ! ................... !! !! !
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