Para High Capacity 40SW ?

[Canuck44]

While I am sure he has access to as many guns he wants I believe I read where he has taken a few of his competition guns over 100,000 rounds. I don't know what the life expectancy of my Para SSP is but I suspect it will out live me and then some. also true of my STI Trojan and Tanfoglio. With proper maintenance the guns we are talking about will out live most shooters.

As far as breakage is concerned any and all mechanical devices will wear and parts will break. What is important to me as a recreactional shooter who likes to play the games occassionally is I own a gun that is backed by a decent service department and warranty. In that regard I believe Para ORdmance is better than most and as good as any other maker.

I do know it will be over amonth before I see a G.D. screw for my Beretta Stampede out of the rep in Canada.

Take Care

Bob

 

[black]

Agreed. And they are a lot more affordable than the S*I varieties. As it happens, I should be getting mine next week after what will be an almost six week wait. At this point, if I have to wait any longer I will probably burst a vein in my head.

Hey R** I hear it's going to be a few more weeks.....just kidding, I hope you get it soon, I know your hurting critter waiting for it.

40 Cal does well with his Para (when he's not shooting the Glock) and yes he has done a fair bit of mods. The only advantage is you can upgrade a Para as the budget permits vs going for the 2000.00+ for the ST.

Either way buy one and just come out and shoot, it doesnt matter how great you gun is unless you get the experiance to shoot better.

 

[relliott]

Hey R** I hear it's going to be a few more weeks.....just kidding, I hope you get it soon, I know your hurting critter waiting for it.

That was just cruel man. Cruel.
It got shipped out today I think, so tomorrow I hope.....

 

[black]

That was just cruel man. Cruel.
It got shipped out today I think, so tomorrow I hope.....

That's great, too bad BRRC is closed for the rest of the week due to the paving of the parking lot....... You could bring it to Waterford this weekend, nothing says fun like trying a new gun out for the first time ever at a match....

 

[40cal]

Did I just hear a kick to the groin while relliott was down? This is fun!!

Wait till he gets up, black, wait till he gets up! He's gonna come out swingin'.

I just wanna be there.

 

[curtdad]

I've heard Paras compared to boats.

When you get one, it's the best day of your life. When you sell it, it's the best day of your life.

Dan; your lucky Curt moved to open, now i'm shooting his 40ltd over
the 45.............and you know how much help I need!
Oh and Curt says dang you your lucky your out west or he would have at you

 

[relliott]

You could bring it to Waterford this weekend, nothing says fun like trying a new gun out for the first time ever at a match....

Actually I'm hoping to do that very thing. I do tend to live dangerously...
12600 seconds since notification of shipping. I wonder how many until it arrives?

 

[Freedom Ventures]

Didn't he win IPSC Production with a stock LDA?

Bad form to slag your competition. Isn't done in polite circles.

He won USPSA production with an LDA. USPSA production guns at that level ain't "stock".

Ever met Todd or Dave? I have. Ever closely examined Todd's gun at a match?

Actually, I'm not slagging. I am correcting information that that you have erroneously posted. Stating that Todd Jarret's competition gun is a para is like saying that Dale Earnhardt drives a Chevy or Gilles Villeneuve drives a BMW.

I don't consider Paras competition to STI. One is a parts bin gun, the other is a fitted gun. STI compares with Les Baer, Wilson and Brown. Para is in the Springfield, SigArms, & Colt realm.

 

[Canuck44]

Great to hear about STI Trojan makes my $1,100 purchase look good. As far as function is concerned though I would not pay much more for one over a Para as I don't see $500 to a $1,000 depending on the model, in value for the type of shooting I do. Glad you have met Tood, I waived at the Queen once does that count.

Take care

Bob

 

[relliott]

You could bring it to Waterford this weekend, nothing says fun like trying a new gun out for the first time ever at a match....

Looks like I'm going to be shooting it at Waterford for sure. It arrived this afternoon and I have already put 500 rounds through it. Hoo-ee! Nice gat!

 

[jjackman]

MEOW!

I have a Para 16-40 LTD that I bought as a starter pistol for IPSC. I've put 2000 rounds through it and except for some crummy reloads with a poor crimp, I've not had any problems.

I won't disagree that an STI/SVI or any of the fitted pistols mentioned above are a better pistol, but for almost twice the price, they should be.

My Para is still tight, fits my grip well, and if it doesn't hit the target it's always my fault, not the pistol's.

There always seems to be 2 lines of thinking getting into this sport. Buy cheap and have a smith work it over, or buy expensive and shoot it out of the box. Do what you want. If price is an issue, buy the best you can (don't forget the cost of accessories) and then go shoot, and shoot and shoot!

If you are still in doubt, buy the fanciest, most expensive pistol you can and in 6-12 months if you decide you don't like it, sell it to me for half price.

 

[Freedom Ventures]

Only 2000 rounds so far? Did you just get it in October? You can't assess reliability at 2K.

Jeez, during the summer competition season I don't get to clean my gun until 2K...

Edge - $2200, P-16 - $1600 (SRP for both, dealers may sell for less.)
Not twice the price.

See Len at Phoenix. Try both. You'll know why you're getting beaten by guys with Edges right away.

 

[nognog]

Sean is right on the "2000-rounds conclusive" no problem performance of P16-40. Would be interesting to hear from JJackman after that Para reaches a "milestone" of shooting over 10k straight from the box. Then you will see the difference of a "Para slide & Frame tightness" against a better quality STI frame and slide.
I have a stock STI Edge chrome, over a year old.... shot around 14,000 +/- rounds through it with NO ISSUE at all. The only problem it had with it was the rear elevation screw of the rear sight snapped into half.
You may ask how tight is the gun after all these rounds thru it? BETTER than my sons Para 16-40 that only has around 5000 thru it.
Just my 2-cents

 

[Quigley]

...I'm not knocking Para's...but it's a bit of a lottary...sometimes they work...sometimes they don't.

The extra cost of the higher end guns (STI SVI) is due to the fact that they are actually hand fit...

Para is really losing ground in a market they once dominated...

There are good lower end guns that represent a better value...and the price bogey on the higher end lines have really come down.

This is partly due to a stronger Canadian $ (for the US guns) bit also due to volume. FV sells allot of guns...we are benefitting from that buying power

Para is some where in the middle and that's getting to be a lonly space.

 

[relliott]

2K rounds out of an IPSC gun is what...a weekends worth?

 

[Musky Hunter]

Bah, i would never buy a Para. Go to any gunsmith and you will see all the broken Para slides. Like Rob said, 2000 rds is very little for some shooters. Some ppl shoot over 30,000 rds a year, a Para will never last that long. The best options for a DS Standard pistal are STI, SVI or Tangfolio Limited Custom.

MEOW!

I have a Para 16-40 LTD that I bought as a starter pistol for IPSC. I've put 2000 rounds through it and except for some crummy reloads with a poor crimp, I've not had any problems.

I won't disagree that an STI/SVI or any of the fitted pistols mentioned above are a better pistol, but for almost twice the price, they should be.

My Para is still tight, fits my grip well, and if it doesn't hit the target it's always my fault, not the pistol's.

There always seems to be 2 lines of thinking getting into this sport. Buy cheap and have a smith work it over, or buy expensive and shoot it out of the box. Do what you want. If price is an issue, buy the best you can (don't forget the cost of accessories) and then go shoot, and shoot and shoot!

If you are still in doubt, buy the fanciest, most expensive pistol you can and in 6-12 months if you decide you don't like it, sell it to me for half price.

 

[relliott]

Right out of the gate, you can expect the standard Para trigger group to last between 2 and 3K rounds and the they have to be replaced. Ditto on the extractor. I think Para makes them from reclaimed tin or something. Though the slides are soft-ish, slide/frame tightness is really not that important for accuracy (maybe 3% of total mechanical accuracy potential) if the gun locks up in battery the same way each time, and that is a hit and miss with Paras also. Some are good; some are really quite bad, but note that if a gun with a cast frame and slide is too loose you can expect to see fractures at some point due to the impact signature that occurs when the round fires and the slide tries it's best to lift off of the frame.

Doing a trigger job on one is often a chore because the pin holes are always just slightly out of alignment, so the sear has to be "specialed" to the hammer hooks, even with top quality parts.

Can they be made to work? Sure, but to make it into a true competition gun you will end up spending pretty much the same money as a high end gun with a grip that does not feel like you're holding on to a 4 X 4.

I speak with some experience on this; I used to shoot Paras and went through all the pain and $$$ it took to make them stand up to the 30,000 or so rounds per year I was shooting through them at the time. It was a constant effort, and a constant expen$e.

 

[Canuck44]

I am surprised Para is still in business. I am glad you folks who own STI are happy with your guns but to post some of the nonsense abouot Para guns is just silly.

My STI Trojan is a beautiful gun, but it's hand fitted slide stop was made for the .45acp model not the 9MM that my gun was. STI sent up a new part to me. It's 14# hand fitted recoil spring was to heavy for the 9MM round, preventing the slide from locking back. Until this was discovered STI, to their credit, was prepared to fund the cost of having JOe Dlask look at. I was impressed with the service.

Turning to my Paras, my P-14 Stainless Ltd that I sold my son has well over 5,000 rounds through it without a hic up if any kind. Gun is very accurate and reliable. It remains as tight as it was the day it was bought.

Do parts break, of course they do. Gunsmiths having been making a living repairing firearms for a very long time. If a part is going to fail it will, just like the infamous non-hand fitted part.

I have been to a couple of Gunsmiths and have yet to see this infamous drawer of broken Para slides etc. If you have pictures, post them.

We all like our guns and buy them for our own reasons. If a $2,200 Limted gun floats your boat and the STI fits your budget go for it.

A hand fitted part just means it was made oversize and requires further fitting to work properly. I suspect a more proper description would be hand finished part.

Take Care

Bob

 

[raks]

Yeah I gotta weigh in here, the last 2 guys I know that bought STI's wound up spending a few weeks and extra $$ each in tuning and replacing parts.

This may not be typical, but 2 for 2 needing 'fixes' dosen't give me a lot of confidence in the product 'out of the box'. Beautiful pistols, I'm definitley getting one someday, but for the significant additional expense (~30% more $$) why can't they work properly out of the box??? My P16 isn't perfect but it works.

 

[curtdad]

Keeping in tune with the last 3 post's I have to agree. Opinions vary, some people end up with a Friday gun. I purchased a used 16-40 that my son shot for near 1 year with easy 25k through and no problems. He is now shooting an STI that I am sure will serve him just as well. I have taken his old gun and will have no concerns shooting it. Mid way through this year I bought a brand new out of the box 14-45 (don't ask) and shy of a 3lb. trigger, which was an easy fit and a lighter recoil spring 11lb. I have easy 10k with not a hickup
FWIW

DVC