Patrick Lamont of Brandon, MB Does It Again...

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Pat captured the 2022 ATA Grand American Singles Championship shooting 200 straight and tying 62 other shooters with the same score. After the clay target dust settled and gun smoke cleared the field he went on to capture the title by shooting another 400 straight. :runaway: He also tied 8 other shooters for first place in the Preliminary Handicap Championship with 99x100 from 27 yards, tied 16 other shooters for first place in the Doubles Championship with a perfect 100x100 and shot 97x100 in the Grand American Handicap Championship(the most prestigious of all the events but it wasn't enough to place). The total on the three big events though was enough to earn him a tie for second place HAA(High All Around) with a 397x400 total score and by prize possessions the HAA 1000 Targets Title with a score of 991x1000! Stellar shooting!!
Congratulations Pat! :cheers:
 
Those scores tell me that the skill is very high. But, in international rifle disciplines, the trend is pairs teams scores. Someone is going to slip off a perfect streak, and bring the team total down. Is there room in Trap rules to make the scoring harder?
 
maple_leaf_eh said:
Those scores tell me that the skill is very high. But, in international rifle disciplines, the trend is pairs teams scores. Someone is going to slip off a perfect streak, and bring the team total down. Is there room in Trap rules to make the scoring harder?
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In shoot-offs if they continue on for too many rounds they will usually set the machines to increase the angles to throw harder rights and lefts or at least they did last time I had to shoot off at the Grand American. I don't know if they still do that but to break a 200 is no small feat. The folks shooting 200's like this are the top 1% of the shooters. Most are AA(97-97.9 average) and AAA(98+ average shooters). The majority of competitive trap shooters will never break 100 straight in their lifetime, never mind 200 straight then follow that up with 400 in shoot-off?!!
 
maple_leaf_eh said:
Those scores tell me that the skill is very high. But, in international rifle disciplines, the trend is pairs teams scores. Someone is going to slip off a perfect streak, and bring the team total down. Is there room in Trap rules to make the scoring harder?
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I understand what you're getting at. I'm not good enough to ever shoot 200 straight and never will be because I just don't have the drive, talent or ambition to do so but having 63 shooters tie at 200 straight tells me the scoring isn't difficult enough.
One of the neat things about sporting clays is that if I'm setting the targets and too many shooters are getting close to 100% on a round then I can quickly change the course to make it more difficult on the next round. Shoot offs (at least around here) generally don't last more than 10 or 20 targets between two shooters because we usually pick the most difficult station for the shoot off! Even the big world class sporting events that are well attended don't have that many ties for shoot offs, granted that they don't get as many competitors as the Grand does. In the world sporting championships for 2022, there was only one winner at 2 points ahead of second place and the next 6 placings were all 1 point apart. There were a bunch of ties after that but there are no shoot off's for that far down the placing. The world FITASC champion ships were the same way, no ties in the first top 4.
 
Does anyone remember 3 hole targets. I have never shot them, but they were certainly more difficult and the decision was made to settle on 2 hole targets. Although it is usually straight aways that I struggle with. :)
 
I believe the current ATA rule is 17 degrees off center line with a minimum spread of 34 degrees total which is defined as two hole. There doesn't seem to be a maximum angle published (I could be wrong) but I'm sure that opening up the spread would eliminate at least a few of those perfect score contenders!
One thing I do know is that if the spread is too wide it will open up a litany of complaints from most trap shooters around these parts. :)
 
Westward1 said:
Does anyone remember 3 hole targets. I have never shot them, but they were certainly more difficult and the decision was made to settle on 2 hole targets. Although it is usually straight aways that I struggle with. :)
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When I started shooting registered trap #3 hole was the required setting. I don't know exactly when that changed but when it did it most certainly propelled alot of A-D class shooters up in their averages. It's funny but Brad Dysinger and I and a few others had this exact discussion on American Trapshooter. Many of us, Brad and myself included feel there should be a return to the 3 hole setting. There was never this many AA & AAA shooters as their is now when ATA was 3 hole. However it gets pointed out as well that there was never near the number of shooters as their is now who shoot high end fitted guns and a fitted gun certainly changes the game ten fold. The combination of the two imo is what is responsible for trap scores as we know them today. Most shooters years ago shot Remington 1100's, 870's, Model 12's, BT99's etc. Only a small percentage shot the higher end guns like Perazzi. Few had heard of names like Kolar or Krieghoff, Silver Seitz etc and very, very few shot combo guns. Registered trap shooting was always an expensive sport but nowadays it has virtually eliminated the blue collar worker from the game by way of target requirement #'s. It costs alot of $ to maintain the annual target requirements especially in Canada where clubs can be hours drive apart and hosting a shoot is a once a year affair for many clubs. The travel expenses add up fast. Personally I don't worry about meeting requirements and if I have to shoot penalty class due to not enough targets so be it. Funny thing is for the most part my averages never fluctuated much between the #2 and # 3 hole settings over the years. Mine seem to be more effected by the change in my vision as I've aged. It's taken me a long time to get used to shooting with prescription glasses and a change in eye dominance. I would never argue a change back to the #3 hole though. I much preferred the wider target angle. For interest sake the first time I attended The Grand #3 hole was the norm, shoot-offs were set by the second round to #4 hole. Those were some WIDE angles and knocked alot of us out FAST! LOL
 
stripperclipper said:
I think I read on another site that he was using a bt100, but I'm sure someone on here knows him and can confirm that with first hand knowledge.
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Pat shoots a Perazzi combo and when I saw him this year at Canadians was shooting Winchester AA factory loads. The GAH was won this year by a Sub-Junior shooter using a BT-100 from 22 yds handicap and he had to shoot-off for the title against a Junior class shooter 27yds handicap both tied with 100's!!
 
Falconflyer said:
I believe the current ATA rule is 17 degrees off center line with a minimum spread of 34 degrees total which is defined as two hole. There doesn't seem to be a maximum angle published (I could be wrong) but I'm sure that opening up the spread would eliminate at least a few of those perfect score contenders!
One thing I do know is that if the spread is too wide it will open up a litany of complaints from most trap shooters around these parts. :)
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I'll have to read the rule book, it's been a long time but my memory tells me you are correct but that their is I believe a maximum of 22.5 degrees each side of centre for 45 degrees which is defined as the three hole setting. Again if memory serves when I started 22.5(3 hole) was the rule and the maximum was 25 degrees or 4 hole but I need to confirm that. My memory like many other things is starting to fade...btw my avatar picture is my one and only Grand American trophy and we shot #3 hole back then. Looking at todays scores including my own I don't think I'll be getting one of those if I was to attend The Grand again even shooting todays current #2 hole setting! ;)
 
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