*PICS* I did some groupings today, Opinion?

[rci2950]

I am working on three projects here at once but this evening i tested some loads for my .308 using IMR 4166 and 130 grain TTSX bullets. Number on the box is 30364. Anyway my start load is 44.9 grains. Thats what i got from the Hodgedon website for the start load on a 130 grain bullet. I noticed right off the top that my powder seems to be really close to the neck for a start load. I load my three cartridges. Then i add .5 grains for the next three and think to myself. Thats pretty close to crush. Add .5 grains for the next three and i am at crush. I think WTF? So i go with those 9 rounds.

Here are some pictures. In this first picture you can see the three sets of rounds. The first three with the 1 on them in sharpie are 44.9 grains of 4166 the second three are 45.4 grains and the third are 45.9 grains. does this look like flattened primers to you? Or am i just being paranoid because i think the powder level is too high?

Here is a closer look at the 45.4 grain loads which shot the best of the three.

Here is the target. The top left corner was the first three, the next group down was the second and the ones above bullseye are the third.

Thumb over the best group.

And last the scenery.

If someone could check their book for IMR 4166 and confirm this is where i should be for powder weight i would appreciate it. I also double checked my 44.9 grain set on my backup scale and my actual measurements are correct. Anyway if you think those primers dont look flattened then i have found the load i am going with. 45.5 grains....



Thanks!

 

[rci2950]

well fugg, looking at those pictures close up of the primers i noticed i had a primer blow out and i just checked the bolt face and i have a tiny little pit where that happened.

Pic of the blow out

 

[Hitzy]

Primers look fine, except the 2nd number two has primer leak, which could be a crappy primer, stretched pocket, or pressure as the culprit.

 

[Slamfire]

I see that your primers are cratered, a ridge is apparent along the edges where the pin hits. A sign of excessive pressure.

 

[Rod B]

How many times has that brass been reloaded? As Hitzy suggested perhaps an oversized primer pocket.

Your load doesn't appear to be hot as per the Hodgdon website.


Bullet Weight
130 GR. SPR HP


Starting Loads

Maximum Loads



Manufacturer

Powder

Bullet Diam.


C.O.L.


Grs.


Vel. (ft/s)


Pressure



Grs.


Vel. (ft/s)


Pressure




IMR

IMR 4166

.308"

2.615"



44.9

2,796

43,200 PSI



50.0C

3,059

54,800 PSI

 

[rci2950]

think that little pit on my bolt face is something that should concern me?

 

[propliner]

think that little pit on my bolt face is something that should concern me?

Not to worry in the least. It won't affect accuracy or safety.

Winchester primers?

 

[hometownhero]

think that little pit on my bolt face is something that should concern me?

No. Winchester primers have been known to have blow outs. Buy something else or risk it getting worse

 

[rci2950]

yes winchester primers. Jeez. I guess i will be using the rest of these up on my Savage Axis hand loads. lol. CCI is likely the best?

 

[Hitzy]

yes winchester primers. Jeez. I guess i will be using the rest of these up on my Savage Axis hand loads. lol. CCI is likely the best?

I could see the pin hole in your second set of pics... Winchester strikes again lol.
CCI are good, so are just about anything other then Winchester.

 

[Hitzy]

I see that your primers are cratered, a ridge is apparent along the edges where the pin hits. A sign of excessive pressure.

That is also a sign of a chamfered firing pin hole.... Remington does it on everything except the Magnums, and this Steyr thing or whatever it is, seems to have it done as well.

 

[propliner]

I stay away from Winchester and Remington primers for two reasons. They have a bad reputation for blowouts and they fit looser than others. My preferred brands are Federal and CCI. I really like Federal Match.

 

[Slamfire]

Could be the chamfer. Or if start loads don't exhibit cratering then begins to appear as charge is increased it would seem to be an excessive pressure sign. A blown primer sounds suspect too. Head space issue maybe.

 

[rci2950]

Out of curiosity i just checked the rest of my rifles. My Garand has two, my savage Axis has one deeper then my Steyr and my swedish mauser has one. I wouldn't have even noticed this happening if i didnt take that pic of my fired cases earlier and zoom way on in it.

Go check your rifles see if you have any

 

[Ganderite]

I don't see any sign of pressure at all.

The full case is because the powder is less dense than others. It would be perfect in a 3006.

Load hotter and check to see if group improves.

 

[Hitzy]

Could be the chamfer. Or if start loads don't exhibit cratering then begins to appear as charge is increased it would seem to be an excessive pressure sign. A blown primer sounds suspect too. Head space issue maybe.

That's not really a blown primer, it's Winchester QC problems, well documented over the last few years with these pin-hole blow outs.

 

[Slamfire]

Symptoms add up to something isn't right. Powder charge is under maximum according to the IMR data?

The 30 caliber 130gr TTSX is a rather long bullet, longer than the 130gr TSX shown here with a 130gr SP Hornady. Increased seating depth to maintain maximum COAL might be causing excessive chamber pressure even though the powder charge is less than the listed maximum.

 

[rci2950]

Well. I got an email saying a representative will be in touch with me shortly. Lets see what happens.

 

[257Roberts]

Had the same issue with Winchester Primers a year ago.
Contacted the Winchester supplier and sent them back with the blown primer, the sent me credit for the purchase.
The Pic of the blown primer is exactly what happened to me.

David

 

[Hitzy]

I had a dozen or so do that in a box of 1000. Happened in a Vanguard and my Benelli R1, oddly neither suffered any flame cutting.