Please help! Newbie restricted storage question

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Aatrox

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Hello everyone

I recently decided to buy a cz 75, and while looking for gun safes I have been filled with all sorts of horror stories with gun owners end up in jail or spends tons of money in court to stay out over the most trivial matters (mike Hargreaves case)

I read extensively on the rcmp website and different interpretations, I thought all I need is a locked safe box and trigger lock my pistol, but the store I went to told me I need a vault that is at least 300 lbs or nailed onto the ground permanently, both options are extremely inconvenient to me currently , is this mandatory? Where do I find on rcmp website that outlines the 300 lbs requirement?

Also, I find it extremely unreasonable that if a break and enter happens, Even after I report my gun stolen I would still head straight to jail for 2-5 years. In fact I had experienced break and enter before and I don’t believe a rooted strong box have any major impact in protecting my gun if they insist on breaking it, plus moving in a giant 300 lbs gun safe in an apartment is like announcing to everyone I have weapons stored in my unit.

If I am going to buy a 24 gun safe to store 1 pistol just to meet the weight requirement , I must see the requirement somewhere， and I just couldn’t find it, can someone please enlighten me on this matter?

Or can I just grab that 22 lbs pistol vault store my pistol trigger locked and hidden from sight ?

Sorry for then ranting guys, thanks for helping in advance
 
Not a lawyer but your interpretation sounds correct. In my RPAL course I was taught non-restricted firearm = 1 lock (i.e. trigger locked OR room/container), restricted = 2 locks (i.e. trigger locked AND room/container). I believe gun safes/rooms allow for storage of even restricted firearms without trigger locks but not sure how the law defines a "gun safe/gun room" (eg. does one of the cheap sheet metal gun cabinets from Canadian Tire count or do you need a full size Liberty?). This seems to align with the storage regulations under the Firearms Act.

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-209/page-1.html

If you really want to be 100% sure about your specific storage situation you should give a firearms lawyer a call. Your gun store doesn't sound like they know what they're talking about or they've got a bunch of 24 gun safes they need to get rid of. I believe Australian gun laws stipulate safe weight and permanent attachment but I've never heard anything like that in Canada.
 
Actually it would not matter even if you had a bank vault if some gets in you will be charged. This has already happened in the past
 
Ian Runkle did a video on this . Courts have ruled a metal container with a secure lock is a safe.
https://youtu.be/6lowop2svZw

I put trigger locks on mine and store them in a lockable file cabinet that you can get cheap used. I also have a habit of removing the slide/bolt etc. and storing it somewhere else.
 
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I do the following: 1. Trigger lock and put them in the cheapish cabinet (like the cheap CT ones) or smaller similar one which has a lock, or 2. Buy the small safe at Costco, then you don't need a trigger lock, no need for the heavy big ones, although I have one.
 
I started with a small safe from walmart.
No trigger locks on 3 handguns.

I've now moved on to a bigger safe.
 
Aatrox said:
Hello everyone

I recently decided to buy a cz 75, and while looking for gun safes I have been filled with all sorts of horror stories with gun owners end up in jail or spends tons of money in court to stay out over the most trivial matters (mike Hargreaves case)

I read extensively on the rcmp website and different interpretations, I thought all I need is a locked safe box and trigger lock my pistol, but the store I went to told me I need a vault that is at least 300 lbs or nailed onto the ground permanently, both options are extremely inconvenient to me currently , is this mandatory? Where do I find on rcmp website that outlines the 300 lbs requirement?

Also, I find it extremely unreasonable that if a break and enter happens, Even after I report my gun stolen I would still head straight to jail for 2-5 years. In fact I had experienced break and enter before and I don’t believe a rooted strong box have any major impact in protecting my gun if they insist on breaking it, plus moving in a giant 300 lbs gun safe in an apartment is like announcing to everyone I have weapons stored in my unit.

If I am going to buy a 24 gun safe to store 1 pistol just to meet the weight requirement , I must see the requirement somewhere， and I just couldn’t find it, can someone please enlighten me on this matter?

Or can I just grab that 22 lbs pistol vault store my pistol trigger locked and hidden from sight ?

Sorry for then ranting guys, thanks for helping in advance
Click to expand...

Just trying to up sell !
 
That was your first mistake, relying on camo-belly gunstore commandos as your information source. The only advice is the one you can prove came directly from the government's firearms safety program. The Firearms Safety Course student manual (2014 edition) is available on line for download. The RCMP Firearms Program publishes a pamphlet entitled 'Storing, Transporting and Displaying FIREARMS'. These two amplify and expand on the "Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations (SOR/98-209)" https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-209/FullText.html Read and respond. You are an adult who has completed the course and has been found capable.

As already explained by others, relax and breath through your nose. The objective is to make accessing firearms more difficult. No judge has issued a resistance to force test requirement. The RCMP have all the Queen's resources to decide what kind of lockups to buy for themselves. Joe-Blow Six Pack has his wits and common sense. And, there is no definition of a safe in the Regulations for good reason.
 
maple_leaf_eh said:
That was your first mistake, relying on camo-belly gunstore commandos as your information source. The only advice is the one you can prove came directly from the government's firearms safety program. The Firearms Safety Course student manual (2014 edition) is available on line for download. The RCMP Firearms Program publishes a pamphlet entitled 'Storing, Transporting and Displaying FIREARMS'. These two amplify and expand on the "Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations (SOR/98-209)" https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/sor-98-209/FullText.html Read and respond. You are an adult who has completed the course and has been found capable.

As already explained by others, relax and breath through your nose. The objective is to make accessing firearms more difficult. No judge has issued a resistance to force test requirement. The RCMP have all the Queen's resources to decide what kind of lockups to buy for themselves. Joe-Blow Six Pack has his wits and common sense. And, there is no definition of a safe in the Regulations for good reason.
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Thank you so much for the information provided, yeah I should not rely on them for information source. I already did decent research before I decided to buy the firearm and the smaller vault, but they gave me the “ didn’t you know you shouldn’t do this, you sound so dumb “ attitude, and outright told me in confidence I shouldn’t buy the smaller storage vault as it does not comply with law, I was really confused because why would they stop a sale? And I assumed I didn’t research hard enough. I spent the weekend looking things up and nowhere in government website or rpal training book mentioned the 300 lbs requirement, that’s why I decided to ask here
 
Thank you for your help everyone. I am really surprised that someone in the industry would pass around false information like that, but yeah now I will be careful with listening to what these “professionals” tell me in the future . In my defense the rcmp law is super vague and when people come up with information like this it does raise the doubt of whether they have other intentions or did I not look hard enough on the rules and regulations.

And I must say the gun forum community is so friendly and helpful to newbies, it’s a shame that the rcmp assume we are potential criminals and guilty until proven innocent , but that’s a different story
 
I heard a firearms instructor tell my wife that hollow point bullets are very dangerous and therefore banned in Canada. I showed him some Canadian dealer web sites where you can buy all kind of different caliber hollow point ammunition. Even then he didn't believe me.
 
Aatrox said:
.....

And I must say the gun forum community is so friendly and helpful to newbies, it’s a shame that the rcmp assume we are potential criminals and guilty until proven innocent , but that’s a different story
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Just wait! One mistake, and we'll rip the flesh off your bones like a pack of wolverines in springtime on a fresh moose carcass.
 
scianna54 said:
I heard a firearms instructor tell my wife that hollow point bullets are very dangerous and therefore banned in Canada. I showed him some Canadian dealer web sites where you can buy all kind of different caliber hollow point ammunition. Even then he didn't believe me.
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Yes indeed the uninformed abound. And unfortunately many of them insist their position is absolutely factual.

I will say part of the ignorance of the outside world comes from having to teach the half-truths and heavy messaging incorporated in the safety course itself. As I also warn people who know firearms, hold your nose and repeat exactly what you are taught.
 
Aatrox said:
Hello everyone. I recently decided to buy a cz 75, and while looking for gun safes I have been filled with all sorts of horror stories with gun owners end up in jail or spends tons of money in court to stay out over the most trivial matters (mike Hargreaves case). I read extensively on the rcmp website and different interpretations, I thought all I need is a locked safe box and trigger lock my pistol, but the store I went to told me I need a vault that is at least 300 lbs or nailed onto the ground permanently, both options are extremely inconvenient to me currently , is this mandatory? Where do I find on rcmp website that outlines the 300 lbs requirement? Also, I find it extremely unreasonable that if a break and enter happens, Even after I report my gun stolen I would still head straight to jail for 2-5 years. In fact I had experienced break and enter before and I don’t believe a rooted strong box have any major impact in protecting my gun if they insist on breaking it, plus moving in a giant 300 lbs gun safe in an apartment is like announcing to everyone I have weapons stored in my unit. If I am going to buy a 24 gun safe to store 1 pistol just to meet the weight requirement , I must see the requirement somewhere， and I just couldn’t find it, can someone please enlighten me on this matter? Or can I just grab that 22 lbs pistol vault store my pistol trigger locked and hidden from sight? Sorry for then ranting guys, thanks for helping in advance
Click to expand...

Given your concerns, best get a short-term Authorization To Transport (ATT), "for temporary storage", and keep your CZ-75 in a bank safety deposit box.
 
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