Please recommend an inexpensive mil/mil optic just for learning the system

stangri

stangri

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I need your help gentlemen, I'm a pistol guy, getting into the long guns and while there's plenty of the BDC scopes out there I want to learn the mil dot system. So if any of you can recommend an inexpensive 3-6 or 3-9 x 40 mil/mil scope so I can start learning the system I would be very grateful.

PS. I think metric, that's why the mil dot and from the little research I've done so far the math is so much easier if it's mil/mil instead of mil/moa.
PPS. I've googled of course, but most results date 2-4 years back, I'm wondering if there are any new scopes on the market which mavens would know of.

THANKS!
 
How much do you want/are willing to spend, I would look at something in the first focal plane (FFP) maybe Vortex? or the Leupold AR line of scopes?
 
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ultimate_monkey said:
the mil system isnt metric.... both MIL and MOA are excuse my caps ANGULAR measurements
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But MOA translates better for those who think in yards and inches, and MILS works better for Meters & Centimeters when you're doing the conversions on the fly.

Despite my youth I still think in feet inches and yards, so MOA makes more sense to me.
 
In a FFP scope uising MIL/MIL, so the reticle is in MIL, & the turrets are in MIL, you simply "dial" the correction via retcle and your done.
 
mildot said:
How much do you want/are willing to spend, I would look at something in the first focal plane (FFP) maybe Vortex? or the Leupold AR line fo scopes?
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I was hoping to get an ideally non-throwaway for about $200-$300. Maybe not new tho. Should have probably used "cheap" instead of the "inexpensive".

ultimate_monkey said:
the mil system isnt metric.... both MIL and MOA are excuse my caps ANGULAR measurements
Click to expand...
I never said either mil or moa is metric or imperial, what I said is that because I think metric, mil/mil will be easier for me to do the math.


Island_Craig said:
Bushnell 10x40
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Thanks, that was suggested on a few other forums, however as I'll be starting with smaller calibers/distances I want something with adjustable power, even if it's ffp.

Is it silly to expect an ffp optic with the modern reticles for ranging in my price range (below $300)? Maybe just with the coarser adjustments?
 
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sorry what i was meaning that it doesnt matter if you think in imperial or metric, its angular, one mil is 1/1000 of the distance so a 1/10 click would be .36" at 100 yards, 1cm at 100 meters, and so on..

on the topic of FFP vs SFP , if you plan to range with the scope pay for FFP, the retical will hold true threw out the magnification range a SFP scope will only work at a certain point in the range , unless you want to do alot of math
 
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ultimate_monkey said:
sorry what i was meaning that it doesnt matter if you think in imperial or metric, its angular, one 1/10 mil click is 1/1000 of the distance ie - .36" at 100 yards, 1cm at 100 meters, .001miles at 1 mile and so on..

on the topic of FFP vs SFP , if you plan to range with the scope pay for FFP, the retical will hold true threw out the magnification range a SFP scope will only work at a certain point in the range , unless you want to do alot of math
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I'd love to get FFP, any practical recommendations for a cheap one? Especially with the modern reticles suitable for ranging?
 
Falcon optics. I don't think you can get cheaper ffp scope. I have their 5.5x25x50 scope and love it.

Just to add, don't buy it direct from Falcon in UK. The export permits you have to sign and mail in with tracking,the duties and taxes add huge costs. Easier and faster to get it from a dealer in Canada.
 
After asking the same question recently, I got a good deal on a Nikon Pro Staff 4-12x40. Love this thing. I have it on my Savage 10TR and its working great. Ive got it dialed in and I cant say enough good about it. Im a beginner in the longer range stuff (over 100 yards) so its suiting me just fine.
I will upgrade, and when I do, it will make a great hunting scope. Its a great deal at the prices you can find them for. Good value all around for a lower end of that magnification. I love the BDC, going to be hard to go to another after warming up to it.
 
Weaver Grand Slam 3-10x40 $300.
Falcon 4-14x44 $400

Those are the cheapest I've found in my lookings. The most "budget friendly" mil/mil scope I'd recommend is a Vortex Viper HS-T 4-16x44, but that's outside your budget perimeters.
 
I've looked around and didn't find anything real interesting at the lower end of pricing. What I did find that has some appeal to me in FFP are the following:

1. Weaver Tacticle 3-15x50 30mm tube EMDR reticle (decent) - The one I looked at had FINE cross hairs and if chosen one would have to decide if it would work as a hold-over scope. May be available with mil dot.
2. Vortex Viper HS-T 6-24x50 30mm tub; VMR-1 Mil / Mil reticle (Simple and not too crowded)
3. Burris Veracity 3-15x50 (or 6-24x50) 30mm tube; Ballistic E 1 FFP MOA reticle (not by favorite but design is fine)
4. Bushnell Elite LRHS 3-12x44 G 2 H FFP reticle. (my favorite reticle of the above mentioned scopes)
5. Sightron SIII 6-24X50 LRMD/CM Have not looked at it but it fits in this category. Mil / mil reticle and not too busy.

Others to consider that are a bit of a step down from the scopes listed above are as follows:

1. Burris FFII 4.5-14x42 AO Ballistic Plex 1 inch tube
2. Burris C-4 4.5-14x42 AO C-4 Wind MOA reticle. 1 inch or 30mm tube
3. Vortex Diamond back 4-12x42 Dead Hold BDC 1 inch tube
4. Sightron SIII LR Fixed 10x Modified Mildot Reticle this is a tactical scope
5. Bushnell LEGEND ULTRA HD 4.5-14X 44MM - MIL-DOT
6. Zeis Conquest 3-9 or 3.5-10 Nice glass and fine cross hairs.

Lots to choose from and not all the scopes listed above are in FFP as some are in SFP scopes. One has to look at all these (and probably a few more) to appreciate what they offer and try to envision what potential each one offers.
 
Now here's what they didn't tell you at the gun shop... With SFP you will need to explore and document your subtensions throughout your power range(s) because each power setting will represent a different spot to where the bullet will "print" on target. Some salespeople at some gunshops are not well-versed on subtensions but should be able to explain the difference between FFP and SFP.

To see an example of this here is a link that should be looked at to get the idea on subtensions. Some scope companies will assist with software that will help the shooter to get this right. And consider that it may require some additional shooting to decide on which power levels of the scope will be used the most often. This becomes a bit more important when hunting at extended distances.

RETICLE'SUBTENSIONS'(Subtension'values'are'inches'at'100'yards)
http://www.cameralandny.com/pdf/minoxreticlesubtensions.pdf
 
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ultimate_monkey said:
sorry what i was meaning that it doesnt matter if you think in imperial or metric, its angular, one mil is 1/1000 of the distance so a 1/10 click would be .36" at 100 yards, 1cm at 100 meters, and so on..
Click to expand...

So, it does matter. 0.36" is a hell of a lot stranger math than 1cm for those of us educated in the metric system.
 
Well, if I had a few hundred more and lived in the states I would have totally ordered the SWFA SS, but with my limited budget and no option to order the SWFA SS at their MSRP here in Canada I ended up going with the BSA TMD414X44/30 (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/45...il-adjustments-first-focal-mrad-reticle-matte) which is made in China and if you look hard enough can be had for well less than $200 shipped to Canada with free rings, sunshade and bikini covers included.

It took quite a lot of the adjustable range to zero it for my .22LR (short barrel Ruger American Rimfire), so my hopes of using farther than 100m might be short-lived, but we'll see next spring/summer.
 
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