Possibility of a Canadian Made Bullpup Bolt Action?

Brian46 said:
Registration certificate reflected no such status with the pistol grip
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This is the RCMP we are talking about. Nobody oversees their doings and they have no duty to justify their decisions. What it says on the paper is irrelevant, they simply refused to allow a super shorty to be NR because it was "factory made". In reality it should be NR, but they took the first chance they could to make up an excuse for its restriction (which was put a stock on it or we will require registration "like a pistol"). This lines up with some other shot gun injustices that recently got corrected as well (MKA 1919 Akdal used to be considered a AR and was restricted as such). Dlask could probably request a review and make a case for it to be NR.
 
nathank said:
Why can’t a decent chasis be built for an existing riffle? Like savage or rem 700?
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MDT makes lots of chassis systems. If you are referring to a bullpup chassis that would be illegal. Any stock conversion from regular rifle configuration to bullpup with the same barrel and receiver are prohibited. It has to be a unique receiver that only integrates with the bullpup chassis design (which it would have to be anyways).
 
onetwentyish said:
This is the RCMP we are talking about. Nobody oversees their doings and they have no duty to justify their decisions. What it says on the paper is irrelevant, they simply refused to allow a super shorty to be NR because it was "factory made". In reality it should be NR, but they took the first chance they could to make up an excuse for its restriction (which was put a stock on it or we will require registration "like a pistol"). This lines up with some other shot gun injustices that recently got corrected as well (MKA 1919 Akdal used to be considered a AR and was restricted as such). Dlask could probably request a review and make a case for it to be NR.
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None of the owners were sent a letter or revised registration certificate showing it as a pistol unless a stock was added.
 
driller212 said:
Hey guys,

I am starting this thread out of my own personal interest, and to see if maybe you might be interested in taking on such a project (assuming there is enough interest).

A Canadian made bullpup bolt action precision rifle sub 3K in cost would be really awesome. There is a huge market gap in this area currently and you could fill it with something unique and functional. If you would be willing to take this on, there are a few (I think obvious) things I would want to see out of it personally:

Available in 16"-24" barrel lengths

Short action and long action models (maybe short action first with long action to follow)

Takes AICS magazines

Adjustable trigger preferably


I just wanted to start this thread to guage interest, however if you are not interested in this, feel free to nuke this thread.

Thank you for your time,

-driller
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Given that our shops capacity is booked up for the next year or more I don't see this happening.
The other issue I see is the bullpup bolt action market in Canada is minute at best and unless there was a SIGNIFICANT number of guys demanding such a thing no-one will bother to invest the resources in even the R&D.
For a small boutique shop such as ours sub $3k is not even a wildest dream. To get into that sort of price area is something someone like Salvage or Mushberg or NEA would need to get on board with.
Guys you need to understand 1 very basic reality of the firearms industry in Canada. Canada has a tiny potential when it comes to firearms sales. With a small number of sales the costs of R&D along with the fixture costs can only get divided up by a small number of guns, which increases the cost. Economies of scale is the term.
Add this to the fact that a small shop like ours who pays a premium labor cost, building rent and insurance all equates to a more expensive product.
IF we had access to the US market and were to outsource many of the parts like stocks, mags and small parts to China or some of the Pacific rim countries it would help to reduce the cost of the rifle overall. HOWEVER in order to do this the numbers need to be there, which they aren't so we are back to square 1. Which is why there is this gap already. IF there was enough of a market do you not think that one of the big makers would not have seized the opportunity?

IF we could get enough guys willing to crowd fund a project it might be worth looking into further, but my pockets are only so deep and to try and take on a LARGE undertaking like this is just not in the cards at this time or for the foreseeable future.
 
Would it be possible to take an existing action and modify it so it no longer fit into a regular chassis and then build a bullpup chassis around the modified action? I’m thinking like what you did with the DA 50 uppers. Just throwing ideas out there.
 
Uisge said:
Pros:
Shorter
Lighter
Longer barrel but similar OAL
Possibility of long action cartridges not feasible in a short barreled rifle
Centre of balance/weight moved inward

Cons:
... makes fudds angry? Help me out here, can’t think of any.
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If it's a bolt action it's already pretty fuddly. 30-06 would be cool in a bullpup.
 
Shorerider said:
Would it be possible to take an existing action and modify it so it no longer fit into a regular chassis and then build a bullpup chassis around the modified action? I’m thinking like what you did with the DA 50 uppers. Just throwing ideas out there.
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as far as I know... that would qualify as a bullpup stock/chassis and would become a prohibitted device.
Now if you were prototyping and the action was being molded or machined to be a bullpup configuration..... i'm pretty sure this would not be illegal and is why we have bullpup firearms today.
For years , the bullpup design was seemed verboten here in canada when all stocks on the market that fit various popular firearms were deemed prohibitted devices. Was a sad day
Not sure how one would go about the prototyping but the action and body that make it bullpup will have to be machined in a one piece unit I'm thinking. I don't mind being corrected though.....
 
alberta tactical rifle said:
Given that our shops capacity is booked up for the next year or more I don't see this happening.
The other issue I see is the bullpup bolt action market in Canada is minute at best and unless there was a SIGNIFICANT number of guys demanding such a thing no-one will bother to invest the resources in even the R&D.
For a small boutique shop such as ours sub $3k is not even a wildest dream. To get into that sort of price area is something someone like Salvage or Mushberg or NEA would need to get on board with.
Guys you need to understand 1 very basic reality of the firearms industry in Canada. Canada has a tiny potential when it comes to firearms sales. With a small number of sales the costs of R&D along with the fixture costs can only get divided up by a small number of guns, which increases the cost. Economies of scale is the term.
Add this to the fact that a small shop like ours who pays a premium labor cost, building rent and insurance all equates to a more expensive product.
IF we had access to the US market and were to outsource many of the parts like stocks, mags and small parts to China or some of the Pacific rim countries it would help to reduce the cost of the rifle overall. HOWEVER in order to do this the numbers need to be there, which they aren't so we are back to square 1. Which is why there is this gap already. IF there was enough of a market do you not think that one of the big makers would not have seized the opportunity?

IF we could get enough guys willing to crowd fund a project it might be worth looking into further, but my pockets are only so deep and to try and take on a LARGE undertaking like this is just not in the cards at this time or for the foreseeable future.
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Is there any specific reason why you're not able to tap into the US market?
 
Suther said:
Is there any specific reason why you're not able to tap into the US market?
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2 BIG reasons. BATFE has deemed all of our rifles as "weapons of war" despite the fact we have never sold any of our guns to any military. By this designation our guns are not legal to import on a permanent basis into the USA.
2nd reason, our insurer Lloyds of London has put a cluase into our policy basically stating they do not want any liability claims coming from the "land of the lawsuit". God forbid some US citizen hurts themselves with our gun. Maybe they insured MacDonalds at 1 time and got "burned" :) For us to export to the USA would increase our insurance premiums 10 fold.
This is the reason we no longer are the North American distributor for DSR, they were reluctant to ship to North America to begin with. We signed a Non Re-export document but someone in Canada exported a DSR to the USA after we sold it to them and DSR found out, so what there is of DSR product in North America is all there ever will be.
Gotta love lawyers sometimes.
 
alberta tactical rifle said:
2 BIG reasons. BATFE has deemed all of our rifles as "weapons of war" despite the fact we have never sold any of our guns to any military. By this designation our guns are not legal to import on a permanent basis into the USA.
2nd reason, our insurer Lloyds of London has put a cluase into our policy basically stating they do not want any liability claims coming from the "land of the lawsuit". God forbid some US citizen hurts themselves with our gun. Maybe they insured MacDonalds at 1 time and got "burned" :) For us to export to the USA would increase our insurance premiums 10 fold.
This is the reason we no longer are the North American distributor for DSR, they were reluctant to ship to North America to begin with. We signed a Non Re-export document but someone in Canada exported a DSR to the USA after we sold it to them and DSR found out, so what there is of DSR product in North America is all there ever will be.
Gotta love lawyers sometimes.
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Lame. Not you guys, batfe. Thanks for the explanation though.
 
Uisge said:
There are plenty of semi auto bullpups cheaper than 3k, how hard could it be to make a manual action? It’s not rocket appliances.
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Most of those were designed for a military contract and made for the world market.

You’re talking about a Canada only precision rifle. Just a good barrel is 500+, even if you could work around an existing trigger that’s a few hundred, and the chassis will be a substantial cost. You need to make a good profit per item to cover your investment so these aren’t going to come out too cheap.
 
rommelrommel said:
Most of those were designed for a military contract and made for the world market.

You’re talking about a Canada only precision rifle. Just a good barrel is 500+, even if you could work around an existing trigger that’s a few hundred, and the chassis will be a substantial cost. You need to make a good profit per item to cover your investment so these aren’t going to come out too cheap.
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Have you seen the Jard rifles ? But seriously, I would be very interested in buying one. A business currently making chassis systems could incorporate a new design with less cost than starting from scratch but yes it won't be cheap. Someone just has to design it. Plastic mold or aluminum chassis. Its not technically difficult. It just takes a plan and a desire to follow through. Having a supply chain already in existence would be a game changer. MDT ?
 
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