Press question

[Dyspnea]

I'm looking to get into reloading and on the EE there is a older 50th Anniversary lee press. The seller states "As this is an older kit it features a standard Challenger press, not the newer breech lock press." Seems like a decent deal for a newbie.

I'm wondering what is the difference between the two and does it really matter to a new reloader?

I'm looking at reloading pistol calibers and .223, 303 primarily.

 

[Rory McCanuck]

The "Breech Lock" is a bushing that goes onto your die, and then goes into the pres with just 1/6 of a turn.
Neat idea, but now you need to buy a bushing for every die you want to use, or just leave a bushing in the press and use it like an older one by screwing in the die. One of those "Features" that sells stuff, but isn't really needed.

The newer presses are slightly different, and have the newer style of linkage on them, which is nice. If the old style breaks, it can be upgraded for ~$20(?) to the new style.

The old Lee Challenger press is not the biggest, fanciest, or most expensive, but it will make great ammo.
223 and 308 aren't real big or difficult to size, so you don't really need a bigger press.
If the price is right, go for it! If you decide to upgrade, you can pass it along, or keep it as a second press. They're handy to have around.

 

[thump_rrr]

The real question you need to ask yourself is how much is your time worth.
With the flick of your wrist one die is removed and another one is inserted.
It will cost you an additional $10.00 per 4 die set for bushings but once your dies are set up it's done.
Without the breechlock you will need to set up the dies every time they are removed.

Sometimes you forget to do something and want to quickly change dies for just a second.
Forget about it without the breechlock.

Personally I wouldn't buy a press without this feature.

Hornady has something similar called the Lock N Load bushing .

 

[ciphery]

The older one will work just fine for a new reloader.
Its economical and gets the job done.
The new quick change systems are a time saver granted.....but so is a $400 Lyman electronic powder measure...saves time but is it necessary to start into the hobby? No
As a bigginer he should be going step by step from the manuel and learning to set up dies, practice makes perfect.
Once you get better at it you may want to get a Hornady lock n load and keep the lee for depriming duties,case flaring duties or sizing duties.

 

[Dyspnea]

Good too know the difference between the two, part of me doesn't want the hassle, but really it's not that big if a deal, and perhaps later I would upgrade anyways.

 

[thump_rrr]

The complete Lee 50th anniversary kit with press mounted priming, including the Breechlock challenger press is under $140.00 in Canada.
The press alone brand new is $80.00

How much can be saved by purchasing a used non breechlock press?
Anyone who shoots a decent amount spends more on components per year than reloading equipment.

 

[Lead Loader]

It would be perfectly fine for a starting reloader, i bought a new breach lock and it comes in handy with multiple calibers and pieces like a bullet puller and such you can add in in a touch of a button.

 

[tengage]

I'd have to agree with thump_rrr, I have the breechlock challenger press and I'll be ordering a set of bushings soon, it's not a big deal to change out the dies but with the bushings you just have to set them once and then your done. right now I only have the one bushing that comes with the press and it's kind of a pain when you have to change and reset the dies especially if you only have a few to do and are changing dies a lot. But that's just my .02. I am also new to reloading and kind of wishing I would have went with a turret style press but for the money you can't beat the 50th anniversary set up for starting out.

 

[Rory McCanuck]

I don't mean to pick a fight, but I will pick apart this post.

The real question you need to ask yourself is how much is your time worth.
With the flick of your wrist one die is removed and another one is inserted.

It is a hobby, and reloading shouldn't be done in a rush.
Once the die is "cracked" it only takes a couple of seconds to spin out.
I found it took as long or longer to "crack" the bushing out.

It will cost you an additional $10.00 per 4 die set for bushings but once your dies are set up it's done.

Bushings are $10 a pair, the Lock Ring Eliminator bushings $15/pr.
That's $20-30 for each four die set. That adds up pretty quickly. I will concede the Lock Ring El. bush's are pretty nice.

Without the breechlock you will need to set up the dies every time they are removed.

That's what the lock ring is for. Even the Lee lock rings work well. If you are concerned they are going out of adjustment, draw a line on the die to the lock ring. If the line lines up, the adjustment hasn't changed.

Sometimes you forget to do something and want to quickly change dies for just a second.
Forget about it without the breechlock.

Personally I wouldn't buy a press without this feature.

Hornady has something similar called the Lock N Load bushing .

If you like them, great. There are a lot of very good presses out there without this feature. Don't discount them, they may have some very nice features you didn't know you were missing

 

[thump_rrr]

I don't mean to pick a fight, but I will pick apart this post.

It is a hobby, and reloading shouldn't be done in a rush.
Once the die is "cracked" it only takes a couple of seconds to spin out.
I found it took as long or longer to "crack" the bushing out.
Bushings are $10 a pair, the Lock Ring Eliminator bushings $15/pr.
That's $20-30 for each four die set. That adds up pretty quickly. I will concede the Lock Ring El. bush's are pretty nice.
That's what the lock ring is for. Even the Lee lock rings work well. If you are concerned they are going out of adjustment, draw a line on the die to the lock ring. If the line lines up, the adjustment hasn't changed.

If you like them, great. There are a lot of very good presses out there without this feature. Don't discount them, they may have some very nice features you didn't know you were missing

I've been picking up the bushings for 5.99 a pair up until a couple of weeks ago.
I guess I better pick up the remaining 5 packs that are on the shelf.
I have never had a lee lock ring move on me hence no need for the eliminator bushings for me.

There are also many people running other presses who purchase the Hornady LnL conversion bushings.

 

[Rory McCanuck]

^^^Oh wow.
The only places around me that sell any Lee stuff are Cabela's and NoSale Sports.
I think they were $10.99 at both places, when they actually had any.
NoSale had a set of the Eliminators, that's why I tried them. Pretty nice.

 

[Gun Lover]

I always preferred to buy new stuff, myself. However, for the right price, I would jump on it, even though the new one is probably not much more expensive. Anyways, if the OP really gets into handloading, he'll be shopping around for a Classic Cast in no time. The Challenger can then be relegated punching out primers without resizing the case and to priming duties.

I have the older Challenger, I think it came with the 35th anniversary kit. I have loaded a bunch of perfectly good rifle ammo with it, for years. It is perfectly OK for a beginner loading rifle ammo. However, I still think the Classic Cast is a much better press and I hardly ever use my Challenger anymore. Also, a progressive is almost mandatory for any kind of pistol volume reloading.

 

[ted_dent]

I always preferred to buy new stuff, myself. However, for the right price, I would jump on it, even though the new one is probably not much more expensive. Anyways, if the OP really gets into handloading, he'll be shopping around for a Classic Cast in no time. The Challenger can then be relegated punching out primers without resizing the case and to priming duties.

I have the older Challenger, I think it came with the 35th anniversary kit. I have loaded a bunch of perfectly good rifle ammo with it, for years. It is perfectly OK for a beginner loading rifle ammo. However, I still think the Classic Cast is a much better press and I hardly ever use my Challenger anymore. Also, a progressive is almost mandatory for any kind of pistol volume reloading.

I generally agree with everything you have said. Eventually he will want to upgrade. However, if the Clallenger is cheap enough it's a good way to get started for very few dollars. He'll probably get most of his money back if he sells it later to upgrade to a Rockchucker or Classic Cast so it's a cheap experiment.

As for your progressive comment, you're right. If you shoot a lot it's the way to go. However I would never recommend one to a beginner as it's an accident waiting to happen. Learn on a single stage till you are confident in what you're doing & then move up to the progressive. I had a friend who, against my advice, started with a progressive right off the bat. He ended up with his S&W 686 in three pieces (but luckily with all his fingers).

That's a lesson you don't want to learn the hard way.

 

[Gun Lover]

Yes, I agree with you too, at least somewhat. I bought my Challenger to get more precision for my rifle reloading and it certainly did a good job, though not as good as the Classic Cast in my opinion. But it's a very good value press and I still have it, it works. And by the way, nothing has ever broken on mine, either (kind of makes me wonder how some people treat them in order to break them)

That said, I did start my reloading with a Dillon RL-550B. Yes I've had few mishaps with it like primer spills, primer crushings, primers seated sideways, primers seated upside-down, powder spills, etc, etc. However, I have never had an accident induced by the press and I have never had a primer go off while reloading. I did all of my rifle reloading with it, single stage style, until I bought my Challenger and I have safely loaded many thousands of pistol rounds with it.

Oh, I also started my shooting dependence with semi-auto firearms: a semi-auto colt .45 ACP, a semi-auto-short barrelled-12 guage-Winchester 1911SL (Browning auto 5 rip-off withtout a charging handle) and a semi-auto Winchester M77 .22LR. What is it that they say about guns for beginners, single shot/low recoil?

I believe that safety is in between our ears with most things in life. But again, I agree with you, starting with a single stage makes a lot more sense, specially if handgun ammo is not on the immediate agenda. Unfortunately it was on mine.