Price check on M-14 shorties on Aisle five ...

exactly :D

but... for interests sake, my near complete shorty goes like this ( i lost track of what this cost a long time ago hehehe ) you tell me what you think this is worth... and it ain't for sale hehehe

-Norc receiver
-norc 18.75 barrel , professionally crowned and vortex installed
-marstar gas ring front sight (for now)
-usgi gas assembly fitted and indexed... must be installed with gentle taps with rubber mallet and gas lock needs tool to bring tight ;D
- usgi oprod spring and guide
-norc oprod
-usgi rear sight set
-usgi bolt stop
-complete usgi trigger group consisting of all new parts
-usgi bolt and bolt bits, lapped and headspaced to 2 thou over .308 go ;D
- custom pistol grip fiberglass stock, match bedded to the rifle, with accessory rail for harris bipod
will be also eventually running a falcon scope and arms 18 with qd throw lever rings.

this rifle has been tuned from front to back and has an audible 9 second ring when dropping the oprod..... which is music to the ears if ya know what i mean

I would say...... this would have to be worth more than a springfield m1a.... so what's yer guess hehehe
 
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Beet this(love the spelling).$99.95,feed Higgens for THREE months and take Miss Roommate (if she accepts) out for dinner three times. What do ya say Tom.
 
okay... the drooling can start with these tasty pics.... hehehe
100_0146.jpg

100_0149.jpg

100_0150.jpg

100_0153.jpg

100_0152.jpg


enjoy ;)
 
Very nice lookin gun ....
BUT,
how does it shoot??

"... on a different but related note what accuracy would you expect from a chopped norc?"

Maybe we Wet Coasters can find a definitive answer for him?? we certainly have chopped enough shorties recently to get a valid sample.

Anyone have time to shoot their M-14 shorty rifles?
Or are you all like me ....
too darn busy workin on the guns to shoot them??

Hmmmmmmm???
[;[)
LAZ 1
[;{)
LAZ 1
 
As for cost on my last build (which I posted pics earlier in this thread), I figure it would have cost roughly $1800.00 to $1900.00 to build.

A lot of work went into fabricating the Dummy Selector set up and painting the stock.Plus the NIW TRW bolt........ Those three items would add up to $800.00 to $900.00 themselves...........

For accuracy, I posted in Laz's other thread, but I will say here as well............At 100 meters with iron sights from the off-hand position I could hit a 6" X 6" steel plate with every shot............and not shooting that slow either..........;)

I built that gun as a 100m to 200m gun, so I was happy with that performance.

SKBY.
 
Lazerus2000 said:
Ok, Skullboy set the standard ...
and I'll say I haven't missed a 200 yd ram shot ....offhand ... yet!
Click to expand...

Laz......... after fitting/lapping that chamber headspaced deadnuts at 1.630" with that TRW bolt (which was brand new in the wrapper!!! :D )................That the way I like all my M14 chambers......................except the Hungry built one..........That was 2 thou crush at 1.628" with a TRW bolt....................

SKBY.
 
I've built over a dozen shorties to date, and I'd say that you're right in the ballpark Laz. If it is a Plain-Jane Norinco where all that's been done is to buck off the barrel, thread it for an opened up AR flash hider or the DLASK vortex, and a GLFS, then I'd say $400 for the gun + $450 for the work is a great deal. As soon as you start adding USGI parts to the mix the price should climb northwards quickly but given the tighetning supply of USGI parts I suspect this is the world of diminishing returns with respect to making any money. For example, I just imported an LRB 18.5 inch gun with a smith dovetail gas lock sight and vortex; all parts except the barreled receiver are USGI and I paid approximately $2700 canadian all in (import/export services and shipping included.) This is the benchmark against what I measure everything else I've got against, and it is one nice gun, hands down nicer than the nicest norinco I have ever re-built. Outrageous price some might say? Well, rack up what an everything-in USGI shorty costs on a norinco receiver and you might be surprised at where you end up.

I've build several shorties on springfield M1A guns that have come in around $2000 to $2200 (problem with these boys is the slightly out of spec springfield receiver. Finish sure is nice though!), and I have a large number of M14s/305 guns where the only original chinese part left is the receiver; LRB barrels, smith sight and vortex, op rod guide upgrade and USGI everything else winds up coming in around $2100 for just the parts + alot of tweeking to make sure barrel draws correctly, rifle headspaces, etc etc. Not alot left over for profit!

So I think the $1850 you mention for a USGI build on a Norinco receiver is a steal. It was unclear to me though if the build used the factory norinco barrel (chopped, crowned, threaded), a USGI barrel (same treatment as the norinco, and is it used or new and what condition if used), or a new criterion made barrel. Either of the last two should push the price northwards IMHO. Also, you make reference to a trigger job....is this a trigger job on the norinco factory trigger group or a USGI trigger group? If USGI, how used?

Lots of variables to consider in the upgrade department, but given the number of shorties I've built and sold my experience would suggest there is a healthy market for everything between the $850 for the chinese chop job to 3k$ for something quite nice. There are some people who always want the cheapest thing they can get their hands on, others who like to pay for something nice, and everyone inbetween.

As an aside, I am keeping all my current shorties....:)

Good luck to those playing with their rifle! I agree that this is the way the M14 should have been build to begin with......

Brobee
 
Brobee ... good to hear from you.

The $ 1850 Shorty was, except for the receiver, ALL GI, including the barrel.

I do my field grade trigger jobs @ 5 1/2 lbs, CRISP ... and I approach this with caution if NORC hammer and trigger are used.

My personal "RANGE" shorty [ maintained carefully ] has 4 3/4 lb trigger and .308 GO headspace, but I don't like to do things up that tight in a serious rifle for other users, where I don't know it woll be maintained immaculately.

Now,
how do your shorties shoot??
Notice any trends in what ammo they like?
LAZ 1
 
PS: BRAND NEW GARAND hammers and triggers are available from Italy ... is what I use, with SMITH oversize pins, for my best trigger jobs ... but it gets EXPENSIVE!!!

parts alone add about $ 100 ...
LAZ 1
 
My M14s/M1A/M305 load of choice:

  • Winchester Case, Full length small base resized with primer pocket reamed out 5 thou for below-surface seating, case length trimmed to 2.008 max, chamfered mouth....brass prep takes forever...*sigh*...most important step though IMHO so don't cut corners.
  • cci large rifle primer
  • 43gr H4895
  • 155gr SHPB Palma Match
  • 2.800 OAL
  • primed with a lee autoprime
  • assembled with a dillon 550
  • dillon seating and crimp dies

Hunting load: everything the same except substitute a Barnes 155gr ### for the projectile.

In just about all my shorties, this load prints about an 1.25 to 2 inches (depending on the shorty).....I shoot mostly service rifle type practice or 12 inch steel plates at ranges out to about 400 yards (mostly 300 or 200) though, so I'm very very happy with this kind of accuracy.

They all shoot about 3 inches with either SA surplus or Winchester White Box.

A couple of my shorties have ultra tight headspace (the better shooting ones typically), however most of them average about 1.632 to 1.634. I shoot my tightly headspaced TRW clone the most though so I'm always gripped about high primers, a dirty chamber, a dirty firing pin channel, or hammer/bolt following. The chamber gets scrubbed hard after every outing and the bolt gets blown out about once every 1000 rounds.

I don't have a lot of hammer/trigger spare parts (other than a big box full of complete chinese trigger groups from all my USGI conversions)....I might have to try and source some of those hammers/triggers from Italy. How often do you see broken hooks or worn sear surfaces? I'm too chicken to stone anything in the trigger group though and figure the best way to smooth it out is to run about 5000 rounds through her....:)

IMHO - $1850 USGI complete rebuild = a steal to the tune of a couple hundred bucks. And shame on you for grinding down the tab on a USGI op rod tab to make it fit the chinese op rod tab channel...:eek: Whenever you do that your punishment should be to sell me at half price the chinese one from the donor rifle :D
 
sorry, i have never ground the tab to fit a USGI op rod into a Chinese rifle ... the Chinese rifles have MILSPEC slots curt in thwe receiver.

I do,
however,
plead guilty to spending a bout three or four hours fitting a US GI op rod tab to a SPROINGFIELD receiver. The SA receiver slot was way out of spec, too small, rough, and with high spots. The fix is NOT to remove material on the op rod tab, but to run fine stones [ or wet & dry sandpaper wrapped around needle files with bent handles ] until you are in the ballpark inside the slot. then you lap a bit for perfect fit.

so NO GI OP ROD for you.

PS: trigger jobs, the way I do them are dead easy ... e-mail me privately and I'll describe it. I think we have a video somewhere of me doing one??

PPS: I sold my last TRW near mint op rod, for close to what we pay for a New complete NORC. And to tell the truth, since the NORC op rodfs are also one piece [ just like the infamous TRW op rods ] AND forged, I dont see the point in paying for a GI op rod ...
but of course, your personal mileage may vary.
[;{)
LAZ 1
 
Man....I must of either had some bad USGI oprods or bad norinco receivers, 'cause there was no way they were going to fit without either opening up the slot on the chinese receiver or stoning down the tab on the oprod. I elected to do neither, choosing instead to use the excellent chinese op rod (thus my semi-veiled attempt to acquire more of them from those doing USGI conversions...it's the chinese op-rods I am interested in acquiring NOT the USGI ones!).

I have never tried to replace the oprod on either of my springfields...but have noticed all kinds of other dimensional anomolies. I'll add the oprod tab observations you make to my list of things to watch for!

Brobee
 
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