Problems with 20 moa rings/rapid z 1000

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yidava25

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Hey guys,
My buddy and I were trying to sight in his new rem 700 308 the other day and we ran into some difficulties.
First of all it's an sps varmint and the scope is a zeiss conquest 6.5-20 x 50 with the rapid z 1000 reticle. The book said to use a 20 moa base to fully utilize the reticle. So he had 20 moa Burris rings mounted by p&d and we took it out.
We set up and shot at 50m to get on target then backed off to 100m.
The combination grouped well enough (1.5" off bipod, quickly) but basically we found that the point of impact changed when we adjusted the scope from 6.5 power to 20 power. I don't remember the exact details of what it was doing but is the reticle supposed to work at only one power setting, similar to how mil dots only work at one power? Would this problem be gone if normal rings and bases were used? I'm trying to wrap my head around this and it hurts.
Thanks for reading.
 
The combination grouped well enough (1.5" off bipod, quickly) but basically we found that the point of impact changed when we adjusted the scope from 6.5 power to 20 power. I don't remember the exact details of what it was doing but is the reticle supposed to work at only one power setting, similar to how mil dots only work at one power?
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The reticle will only work at one magnification setting.

Would this problem be gone if normal rings and bases were used?
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No.
 
Hey thanks for the quick reply. So the scope needs to be sighted in at a certain power and then used only at that power?
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You can use any magnification to zero the main reticle, but the other hash marks will only be accurate at one magnification. If you have the BC of your bullet, and the actual muzzle velocity, you can calculate the proper magnification using the calculator on the Zeiss site. Then you need to actually shoot the load at various distances to validate the data.If you change the load, the correct magnification may also change.
 
Here's your answer.....
Originally the reticle for your scope was made by a company called "Pride and Fowler"

Pride and Fowler got paid by Zeiss for their fantastic design which was originally intended to be used on a European focal plane

-not- the way most scopes are set up in North America (I think it's called "on the front focal plane").

Zeiss didn't follow the original design instructions because they didn't think that it would sell in this country because on European scopes when you dial up your magnification, the reticle also gets bigger...and "supposedly it's not liked here" but it keeps your point of impact where it should be.

If you read your instructions that came with your scope Zeiss got around this "little" problem by telling users of their scope to only use it at a certain magnification!!! The correct magnification depends on the speed of your bullet.(I think this info is also available on Zeiss website).

I talked to John Pride who designed the reticle and he said he was very disappointed that Zeiss would NOT follow his recommendations.I have an original Pride and Fowler scope which I love for the last 7 yrs. although the glass is not quite as good but it works as it should.If you don't like it,take it back and get the original Pride and Fowler as it's still being made and can be purchased on their site.Different rings and bases will NOT solve your problem :(


TWK
 
Ok good info. I think what he should do is ignore all the hash marks and just use the turrets for elevation and windage adjustments. I must say I'm really not a fan of how cluttered your view is with that reticle and how it's supposed to help you make hits out to 1000m when it's not even tailored to a specific caliber, never mind the potential differences between different .308 loads.
Anyone ever send a scope in to zeiss to have the reticle changed out? Wondering if that's a viable option.
 
I must say I'm really not a fan of how cluttered your view is with that reticle and how it's supposed to help you make hits out to 1000m when it's not even tailored to a specific caliber, never mind the potential differences between different .308 loads.
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That reticle was designed for a specific 308win load.
 
I'm using that exact scope with a .223 and love it. Hellishly complicated and almost impossible for anyone but me to shoot, though. Lol.
 
You wouldn't happen to know where I could find that load data eh
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If you go to the Zeiss site, and start putting numbers from some common 308win target loads into the ballistic calculator, it won't be difficult to come up with a load that matches the reticle using 20x or just under.
 
I ordered my Pride and Fowler from California about 7 yrs ago but maybe that was before ITAR regs kicked in,email John Pride he will get back to you quickly.I think they do have Canadian distributor
 
yidava25 said:
Ok good info. I think what he should do is ignore all the hash marks and just use the turrets for elevation and windage adjustments. I must say I'm really not a fan of how cluttered your view is with that reticle and how it's supposed to help you make hits out to 1000m when it's not even tailored to a specific caliber, never mind the potential differences between different .308 loads.
Anyone ever send a scope in to zeiss to have the reticle changed out? Wondering if that's a viable option.
Click to expand...

Get to know Zeiss's on-line computer program for that reticle. Easy to navigate, even for me, and very informative. I don't shoot the Z-1000 but sure like the Z-600 and find there computer information very close.
 
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