Prohib to Restricted PO8 Luger.

Oramac21

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Hey All,

Here is my problem..... My brother IN LAW has passed away. In his Will he left all his possesions to his wife. She has now moved in with me and my wife. He held a 12(6) POL. He has left her with a Arminius .22 revolver w/4" barrel and a PO8 9mm Luger w/4" barrel. These now reside in my safe as she occupies the same address. She has gifted me the PO8 and the revolver. I need to have the barrel changed on the Luger in order for it to be Restricted. Who would be recomended for such a job? What is involved? Its a shame to lose this all numbers matching gun over a 1/4". Any thoughts would be helpful.

Thanks. Oramac.
 
Your wife should get an RPAL - she can legally inherit the Luger under license provision 12.7 (you might be able to as well - but I'm pretty sure it has to be directly willed to you) assuming the Luger is pre-1947. No changes would be necessary under 12.7. If the Arminius isn't pre 1947 it'll have to be destroyed or sold.
 
Your wife should get an RPAL - she can legally inherit the Luger under license provision 12.7 (you might be able to as well - but I'm pretty sure it has to be directly willed to you) assuming the Luger is pre-1947. No changes would be necessary under 12.7. If the Arminius isn't pre 1947 it'll have to be destroyed or sold.

I would look into this first
 
Your wife should get an RPAL - she can legally inherit the Luger under license provision 12.7 (you might be able to as well - but I'm pretty sure it has to be directly willed to you) assuming the Luger is pre-1947. No changes would be necessary under 12.7. If the Arminius isn't pre 1947 it'll have to be destroyed or sold.

she can obviously have it willed to her, then she can will it to him since she is his wife and he can inherit it before she dies (how that works im not sure, i just have seen it happen)
 
There is one other option. If a good smith can weld a nub on the end and then drill out and sleeve the original barrel you can add the extra .2 inch to it to just sneak over the limit. If it's done right it would not look TOO bad.

Otherwise it's a case of the longer non prohib barrel and non matching serial numbers.

Your call....
 
Change the barrel and lose big value.

If your wife got the gun as an inheritance, her new restricted PAL will allow her to own it as 12[7]. You can still fire it, enjoy it, etc.
Changing the barrel to restricted will halve it's value and make it undesirable for collectors, should she want to sell it and reap some value later.
Welding a nub on the end will DESTROY the value and you will have a $200.00 luger pistol that no one will want. Selling it after the nub means the new owner will have to install new barrel and the new owner will be in the same place as you will be if you changed the barrel.
If you cannot stomach the 12[7] status, then just sell it, get the value from it and buy something you wife will like.....
 
can a person not change the barrel on it to make it restricted , and keep the original barrel seperate , then if the time comes to sell the gun , all the parts are there to make it a numbers matching again , assuming the new owner has the proper license . ?
 
Mind providing a source for that ? First I've heard tell of this...

I've seen prohib barrels for sale on FirearmsCanada..?

:confused:

source is having a gun rebarrelled to restricted and then trying to use the barrel taken off that gun to replace a crappy barrel in a different one and the CFC being pissy about that and still having to turn in the crappy barrel (after my smith had crushed it in a press)
 
The 4" rifled tube itself becomes the prohibited device.
You might have trouble actually getting the barrel off without tweaking the reciever. Dlask had to relieve the shoulder of the battle with a lathe to get mine to come loose.
He does a great 110mm barrel conversion.
 
if you rebarrel a prohibit gun you have to turn in the barrel to be destroyed

not true.

I have a restricted that had the orginal barrel drilled out and they put a .22lr insert in the barrel to make it legal length so bacicly the made a new barrel out of the old one as a template.

Allot of companies that do that conversion will hold onto the barrel or pay to have it destroyed to prevent someone from converting it back or someone who doesn't have a prohibit license from getting in trouble by having the barrel The barrel it self is a prohibited device.
 
The definition of "prohibited device" in s. 84 of the Criminal Code includes "a handgun barrel that is equal to or less than 105 mm in length". Possesion of a "prohibited device" is a criminal offence under s. 88 of the Code.

The owner's of 12.6 and 12.7 pistols are not in possession of a "prohibited device", they are in possession of a "prohibited firearm". Their firearms licence does not allow them to possess other barrels 105mm or less which are not part of their registered prohibited firearm. My understanding is that no "spare" barrels are permitted, although there is a mechanism to legally obtain parts to repair a prohibited firearm to keep it in good working order, which presumably would include barrels.

In order to possess (or do anything else with) "prohibited devices" you have to have a licence for that. In practice most "firearms business licences" seem to have this (although s. 11 of the Firearms Act makes it look like it is the exception rather than the norm). Everything is regulated and licenced into the ground... as we are all very well aware.

Definitely check out the 12.7 option, but one thing you should keep in mind: the value of all firearms is largely destroyed by prohibited status. Changes in value due to alterations are an afterthought. The idea that you might have a valuable firearm that you are going to be able to sell for big money is inaccurate. That would only be the case if the firearm was in the United States. If the firearm becomes a 12.7 its monetary value is $0. It is, by definition, a family heirloom.

No need to discuss 12.6, as that will not be in the cards for you, but the value of 12.6 firearms is also largely destroyed by their prohibited status - as the class of 12.6 licence holders was created almost 20 years ago, is relatively small (compared to restricted licence holders), and is getting smaller all the time.

Rebarrelling a Luger is also a viable option. I have a restricted Luger and it shoots great. It is a very accurate design. Just as a testament to how thoroughly effective the Firearms Act has been in wiping out certain types of firearms, I would say about 90% of the guys I know at my range (including the range officers) had never handled or fired a Luger before they tried mine. There are a few old fudds that come out once in ahwile at my range who have these big collections of prohib handguns, but they keep to themselves mostly. I'm 36 years old. Most of the shooters I know are late 20's to early 40's, and were not owning short barrelled pistols back in the early 1990s. A lot of the shooters I know, including my wife, had not even immigrated to Canada yet when the Firearms Act provisions started coming into force. Alan Rock and company definiately succeeded in wiping whole classes of firearms off the map, for all practical purposes, in Canada - not just the 12.3, 12.4 and 12.5, but the 12.6's too.

That's my rant :rolleyes: Check into 12.7 and keep it as a heirloom or contact Barry Jensen at Bits and Pieces about rebarrelling.

My restricted Luger:
Luger3.jpg

Luger8.jpg

Luger6.jpg

Luger10.jpg

Luger5.jpg

Luger4.jpg

Luger7.jpg


Fits in the repro holster too:
LH2.jpg

LH7.jpg
 
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Tought I'd chime in this one...

First off I'll second what Ghostie said, all good info...

I've been collecting these for a while...and I've built many ``restricted shooter Lugers`` over the years with attention to fit/finish/details & reliability. Here's a few projects from the last few years:

DSC_0005R-1.jpg


DSC_0004R.jpg


DSC_0008Lftfull.jpg


Oramac, bear in mind the whole project cost (you already have the pistol) if you intend to have it rebarreled as it can easily bring you in the $500.00+ range. Full reblue of the rebarreled Luger should also be done for cosmetics (a lot of fellows will sell you a rebarreled Luger with very different finishes from that new bbl on a well worn pistol !! Yuk !!) And be sure to use good mags stuffed with powerfull FMJ ammo...

Mk
 
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First off, for 12(7) transfers, nobody has to die.

If it's your wife's sister, your wife (usually) needs an RPAL to receive the 12(7) eligible Luger from your sister in law. Once registered to your wife, she as your blood relative can in turn give it to you. All while everyone is still enjoying sunshine.

Close blood relative (Mother, Father, Sister, Brother, Daughter, Son -- and Wife) is the rule.

Your CFO may choose to allow you to obtain this firearm if the path to you, via blood relatives, is clear, without an intervening person (wife) having their RPAL. This is discretionary, so it probably won't happen, but you can always ask. Don't believe the first person who says "no" either. But count on your wife needing her RPAL.

You can leave the Luger all original, own it, shoot it, and eventually pass it on to your own blood relatives. All while everyone concerned is alive. As long as 12(7) lasts.

Half a dozen 'Smiths would happily do your Restricted conversion, in which you would need to lose the original barrel forever. At that point you have a more commercially valuable Restricted Luger, though the costs will be North of $400. Plenty of people can steer you in many directions on that one. If it were mine, I'd spend half the money (or less), get my wife her RPAL, and keep the thing original.
 
No barrel turn-in.

Lugers are unique pistols, and it is very hard to believe that between 1938 and very early 1942, if not very late 1941, over one million Lugers were manufactured for the German war services. In contrast, the Inglis company of Toronto in 1944-45 made 151,000 copies of the BHP, the majority for the soon to be Chi-com army. A small portion of the 151K was for the Canadian Army.
Original condition Lugers continue to increase in value, even with the very large number made. Changing the barrel out or trying to change them into the restricted class usually changes the value. And not for the better.
Should an interested Luger owner or any other 12[6] prohibited handgun owner want to change his gun to the restricted class, he does not have to turn in the prohibited barrel to the RCMPolice. That so-called rule is a CFO idea and has NO basis in law. There is NO provision to collect prohibited barrels in the heinous Bill C-68!
 
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