Pros and cons of fluting barrel

[Superbrad]

No it doesn't "start to cool earlier" . Both barrels start to lose energy (heat) as soon as the source of the energy (the heat and pressure of the cartridge firing and friction) is removed.

wrong.... lets say we go to the range..... I start firing off my mini 14 as fast as I can.... after ten shots you reach over and wrap your hand around the barrel while I am still firing.... do you think it is going to be cold?

No, of course not because air is being dissipated from the barrel surface as yo uare firing.... it is both heating and cooling at the same time... only reason it heats up is because while you are firing the heating force will always outdo the cooling force... (The gun heats up quicker than the barrel can cool it down)..... doesn't mean it isn't cooling.....

 

[mlehtovaara]

Look at "cross-section" picture below... given that:

-A is a regular sporter barrel
-B is a MANUFACTURER'S fluted barrel configuration

Which will Cool faster? Which will be more accurate / stiff?.....

Why do you continue to compare heavy fluted barrels to pencil thin sporter barrels?

Nobody is gonna argue that the sporter is better than fluted heavier barrel.

We are talking about a heavy barrel vs, a heavy barrel with flutes! That is the original argument! Nobody is talking about sporter contour barrels!

Take 2 identical HEAVY barrels, and add flutes to one. Which performs better? That is the original question!

As has already been discussed, if there was any benefits to adding flutes to a barrel we would see them on every BR, or LR rig out there, as they spare no expense in gaining every fraction of accuracy out of their rigs.

This argument should have ended a long time ago.

 

[Superbrad]

Why do you continue to compare heavy fluted barrels to pencil thin sporter barrels?

Nobody is gonna argue that the sporter is better than fluted heavier barrel.

We are talking about a heavy barrel vs, a heavy barrel with flutes! That is the original argument! Nobody is talking about sporter contour barrels!

Take 2 identical HEAVY barrels, and add flutes to one. Which performs better? That is the original question!

As has already been discussed, if there was any benefits to adding flutes to a barrel we would see them on every BR, or LR rig out there, as they spare no expense in gaining every fraction of accuracy out of their rigs.

This argument should have ended a long time ago.

No..... here is the original question.....

need some advice on fluting barrel. Pros and cons. what are you opinions?

thanks

And here was your original answer... which I agreed with....

My understanding of the subject:

Pro - Cools faster, lose some weight

Con - Barrel loses some rigidity

My opinion - A rigid barrel is more important unless you are firing multiple shots in quick succession. A varmint gun may benefit from fluting, but if your shooting slow fire bench rest type stuff I would not bother with flutes.

All depends on application.

It's not me who is hung up on sporter barrels... it's you that is hung up on heavy barrels... and obviously the argument is pretty far from the OP.....

 

[crazydave]

Why do you continue to compare heavy fluted barrels to pencil thin sporter barrels?

Nobody is gonna argue that the sporter is better than fluted heavier barrel.

We are talking about a heavy barrel vs, a heavy barrel with flutes! That is the original argument! Nobody is talking about sporter contour barrels!

Take 2 identical HEAVY barrels, and add flutes to one. Which performs better? That is the original question!

As has already been discussed, if there was any benefits to adding flutes to a barrel we would see them on every BR, or LR rig out there, as they spare no expense in gaining every fraction of accuracy out of their rigs.

This argument should have ended a long time ago.

Interesting that the fact if 2 barrels are the same OD the fluted barrel could weigh the same according to some out there anyways.

On a hunting rifle where weight is supposed to be so important to some this would negate fluting benefits of being lighter, THE MAIN SELLING FEATURE THE COMPANY'S ADVERTISE.

In the pics the thinner part (bottom of flutes) would expand due to heat quicker than the thicker parts, which would cause loss of tolerences plus increased pressure on the thicker parts, causing excessive wear on those parts.

 

[crazydave]

Also i was not arguing with the last quote by mlehtovarra but agreeing with his statement, but i do remember that some were mentioning hunting rifles and weight savings, so these would have been lighter barrels talked of, not super heavy crowbars.

 

[Superbrad]

Interesting that the fact if 2 barrels are the same OD the fluted barrel could weigh the same according to some out there anyways.

On a hunting rifle where weight is supposed to be so important to some this would negate fluting benefits of being lighter, THE MAIN SELLING FEATURE THE COMPANY'S ADVERTISE.

In the pics the thinner part (bottom of flutes) would expand due to heat quicker than the thicker parts, which would cause loss of tolerences plus increased pressure on the thicker parts, causing excessive wear on those parts.

1- I don't recall anyone saying that about barrels of the same OD....

2- Here is a quote from Remington when advertising one of their fluted rifles... I have NEVER heard a manufacturer claim fluting as a weight reduction....

The Model 700 Sendero SF II are finely tuned tack-drivers created using input from serious shooters across America. The stock is reinforced with aramid fibers and features contoured beavertail fore-end with ambidextrous finger grooves and palm swell. Twin front swivel studs accommodate a sling and a bipod. Full-length aluminum bedding blocks create accuracy-enhancing platforms for the barreled actions. The 26" heavy-contour barrels are fluted for rapid cooling

3- You are correct about the uneven heating and cooling.... but you would have to get the barrel awfully hot before that happened.... which is why they have a place on bolt action rifles... not semis or other more "rapid fire applications....

 

[mlehtovaara]

It's not me who is hung up on sporter barrels... it's you that is hung up on heavy barrels... and obviously the argument is pretty far from the OP.....

The way I understand the OP's question he is not talking about factory guns! My reference to Varmint guns was simply to say that is the only place I can see any usefulness in fluting, but I still question wether the cooling benefits outweigh the negatives!

This is the GUNSMITHING forum, and he is asking about fluting a barrel, not buying a factory fluted Varmint gun.

You are really making yourself look silly with all this argument.

Why you are taking all of this so personal is beyond me.

 

[mlehtovaara]

3- You are correct about the uneven heating and cooling.... but you would have to get the barrel awfully hot before that happened.... which is why they have a place on bolt action rifles... not semis or other more "rapid fire applications....

Remington flutes the barrels on their R series AR rifles!!!

So you are using them to support your theory but also disagreeing with them at the same time!

 

[Superbrad]

The way I understand the OP's question he is not talking about factory guns!

This is the GUNSMITHING forum, and he is asking about fluting a barrel, not buying a factory fluted Varmint gun.

You are really making yourself look silly with all this argument.

Why you are taking all of this so personal is beyond me.

Firstly, you were the first one to bring up varmint rifles and other platforms... that wasn't me... it was your first post in this thread that brought them into this discussion....

Secondly, I don't take it personally.... I am an engineer and a bit of a physics geek... I enjoy talking and debating this stuff.... I have no ill will towards anyone in this thread and appreciate what everyone brings to the table.... I fail to see where I took anything personally.... if I came across that way I apologize....

The fact is, if the OP had said "should I flute my heavy barrel for BR shooting" we coudl have just said "no" and teh thread would be over....lol...

 

[Superbrad]

Remington flutes the barrels on their R series AR rifles!!!

So you are using them to support your theory but also disagreeing with them at the same time!

I used them to dispute crazydave's statement that the manufacturers touted fluting as a weight reduction solution.... not to support my theory...

Fluting an AR barrel is beyond stupid....

 

[mlehtovaara]

The fact is, if the OP had said "should I flute my heavy barrel for BR shooting" we coudl have just said "no" and teh thread would be over....lol...

I think this is something we can all agree on!

 

[bearkilr]

Fluting looks good. Aside from that, I doubt it has any added benefits or faults for that matter, including "cooling","weight loss" or a loss in strength.

I would suspect most competitive shooters don't have fluted barrels as the added costs have no benefits. Think of it as a webbing pattern on a synthetic stock.

I'm sure all the above's been covered in the last 150 posts, I just don't feel like reading them all.

 

[mg4201]

wrong.... lets say we go to the range..... I start firing off my mini 14 as fast as I can.... after ten shots you reach over and wrap your hand around the barrel while I am still firing.... do you think it is going to be cold?

No, of course not because air is being dissipated from the barrel surface as yo uare firing.... it is both heating and cooling at the same time... only reason it heats up is because while you are firing the heating force will always outdo the cooling force... (The gun heats up quicker than the barrel can cool it down)..... doesn't mean it isn't cooling.....

Your grasp of the concepts you are talking about is, at best, poor. None of what you wrote here even resembles a logical argument. Not only that but you keep moving the goalposts when someone refutes your statements with facts. Argue with yourself because I am done.