I thought the real reason for control feed is in the case of a short stroke..you run one case on top of the other..it could be a bad situation if under stress a bolt gun is short stroked. I think the possibility is over come by muscle memory if there is some. As long as you work the range of the bolt there is no advantage. This was the brilliance of the Mauser system in that it bailed out a stressed out kid under battle conditions....other Armies saw the advantage as well. A good rifleman is not going to have a problem and the simplicity of the pushfeed in good hands is going to be hard to beat.
Push-feed vs CRF
- Thread starter Demonical
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i meant my detachable mag 700 will spit the shell out of the magazine instead of chambering it on the last cartridge this happens even if its right side up. my floorplate bdl will feed with the rifle at any attitude. i have two detachable mags that do exactly the same thing
ALBERTA BOY
Regular
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
I own and have owned both push feed and controlled round feed.
I find the older mausers to be very stiff and kind of difficult to work with. The magazines are hard to load.
I find mauser copy actions like the newtons to be the same.
I find the Win M70 to be okay. Still, not the greatest.
Honestly, I don't see any problem with any of my push feeds. They always feed when I push.
I enjoy the 'last shot hold open' feature on many older mauser rifles.
I find the older mausers to be very stiff and kind of difficult to work with. The magazines are hard to load.
I find mauser copy actions like the newtons to be the same.
I find the Win M70 to be okay. Still, not the greatest.
Honestly, I don't see any problem with any of my push feeds. They always feed when I push.
I enjoy the 'last shot hold open' feature on many older mauser rifles.
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To each his own... I can load 6 shots into my new M70 .030-06 and have a bolt that's smooth as butter.
IMHO CRF is better, that is to say, I prefer it, not that there's anything wrong with a good push feed.
Splitting hairs and opinions are like arseholes.... Everyone's got one. Decide for your self and have fun.
I am a real stickler for cheering on the CRF. I have several claw rifles and they haven't failed me yet. Funny when I think of it, my main, go-to rifle for all my big game hunting up here in the north is my push feed HOWA lightning in .300win mag. Its so smooth and trouble free, that I kind of forgot that I was "Mr Mauser pusher" to all that asked.
Remember that up until the 1950's most if not all bolt action rifle designs were controlled round feed. The push feed design came about not because it was better, but because it was cheaper to make.
ALBERTA BOY
Regular
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
....okay
I could also load 5 rounds in the magazine and one in the tube of my M70 30'06 and have a smooth bolt.
I can also load the same number of rounds in my non-CRF rifles and have a bolt just as smooth...
edited for clarity.
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I perfer the push feed than the CRF. The push feed is sleeker, smoother, lighter, less clumsy, less sloppy and more accuarate than the CRF. Most top notch rifles are push feed..............sako, cooper, weatherby, blaser, now mauser, merkel, dakota, HS precision, etc, etc.
Ok... not sure your point.
I can do both things you mentioned in one gun.
I'm guessing you have a 64-2008 M70 and a CRF rifle. I'm guessing you're happy with both.
Good for you. I'm happy you're happy.
ALBERTA BOY
Regular
- Location
- Edmonton, AB
You mistunderstand. (because there's a typo in my post that I fixed) It's a 2012 M70 produced by FN. Yes, it's CRF, yes it holds 5 30'06 rounds in the mag and one in the tube. Yes, the bolt is smooth.
I was addressing your post by saying that I ALSO have push feed rifles which have equally smooth bolts and can hold 5 30'06 rounds in the mag and one in the tube.
In other words, I was agreeing that your M70 can do that and also pointing out that push feed rifles can do exactly the same thing.
I find it worth noting that many people suggest that CRF was used in military bolt actions and is therefore superior.
Something to ponder: current auto loading arms are obviously NOT CRF and they feed a LOT of rounds in combat. Even bolt action rifles used in the military at present are push feed. Hell, even mauser themselves have switched to push feed.
Sorry but it seems to me that Man is the most dangerous 'game' there is. If the military doesn't need CRF, neither do I. A good quality push feed is dandy. CRF is okay, I have a few. No real need for it though.
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Cool.
As I've said before I'm totally bifeedual...........a quality bolt action in either will function flawlessly and be smooth as silk. As far as dickdroppingoff from shooting dangerous game with a push feed rifle I can personally attest to it's fallacy, however I might suggest that perhaps after shooting said dangerous beast with a push feed rifle that perhaps a little too much celebration went on with the inclusion of some local girls. This will almost certainly cause your #### to drop off!!!!!!!!!!!!! I still have mine, draw your own conclusions......
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I'm reading that list and not seeing a single "top notch" maker, just fine production rifles. Kimber, CRF, is also in that rank.
Sleeker? Balogny they're the same.
Smoother? No difference, a claw extractor doesn't affect smoothness one bit, it can't. Any good CRF is going to be smoother than Warren Beatty in his prime.
Lighter? The lightest production rifle made is CRF, Kimber's Mountain Ascent, at 4lbs 13ozs and fully CRF.
Less Clumsy? (Likely the most peculiar judgement in a peculiar list), the least clumsy actions are CRF. Upside down, sideways, and short stroked? No problem.
Less sloppy? You've apparently never handled anything but budget CRFs, being CRF has no bearing on tightness, it's only an extractor style afterall.
More accurate? Balogny, since when has the style of extractor riding the bolt dictated accuracy on all rifles in the class? I'd love to hear the science on this one.
It's just an extractor, pick the style you like, I like CRF.
What is a top notch gun?.........H&H, Rigby, William Evans, who? Before I go any further. I'm also talking about two different actions, not about "you", therefore; keep the "you" out of your responses and discuss the actions...................you.
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The last Dakota 76 I saw was most certainly not push-feed.
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