Questions - LEE Load-All II and reloading Shotshells

Alex McKr said:
Brocolt: With the low cost of a Lee Load-All, the simplest choice would be to purchase one of each. That way, you have a dedicated press ready to go for either gauge, with no additional set up. Nothing wrong in purchasing a conversion kit, though. If that suits your budget and shooting needs better, then go for it.

A 12-gauge press would be the obvious place to start. Then, add the 20-gauge conversion kit, if necessary.

As others have already mentioned, if you only plan on shooting a limited number of 12-gauge shells per year... particularly for limited casual shooting, there are no real cost savings. The real benefit comes from being able to tailor loads to your specific needs..ie: Turkey hunting. That's where reloading really shines. Or, if you plan on shooting competitively. Where going through hundreds, or even thousands of rounds per year, can be common. Then, the cost savings do add up.

There are savings with 20-gauge. Again....depending on how much you plan to shoot. Plus, the ability to tailor loads to your specific needs and gun.

Though the Load-All is a good press(Have owned one for 4 decades and counting)..... it does have it's limitations. The lack of press adjustment being the biggest issue. Though really not that much of one, in my experience. Or insurmountable. Mostly a matter of paying attention to the load column. For consistent, tight crimps. Which many shotgunners...myself included, regard as being one of the most critical components for good shot shell performance. Not hard to do.
I should mention that Mec presses (which are adjustable) will need some fine tuning as well, to attain good crimps.

Still, the Load-All is a good, basic reloading press that turns out good quality shot shells. Plus, capable of delivering many years of dependable service. A great bargain, in my view. Purchase one with confidence and start reloading.

I fully agree with others though, who recommend purchasing a Mec loader. A Mec 600, for example, is always a good choice. Very rugged. Plenty of adjustment and easy to set up and run. Produces good quality shot shells. Pricier than the Lee.....but, a great long term investment. Well worth the cost.
Have run a Mec Sizemaster for more years than I care to count. With thousands of rounds going through that press, without a single hitch. That press will easily outlive me.

Worth mentioning: Mec also offers excellent customer support *. Parts are readily available. Mec even features a series of online how-to videos, on proper set up and running of their product. Another handy resource.

Well worth a look, before making up your mind.

In any case, hope some of this advice is useful.

Al

* Lee does, too.
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For competitive shooting like IPSC (shotgun version), 3 gun or other dynamic shotgun sports can the loads be tailored by loading like they can for pistol for example (ie tuned to be just above the power factor IPSC specifies)?

If the rounds can be loaded to get closer to minimum power factor that does that mean the reliability of the gun suffers? Semi shotguns can be fickle animals. Thinking out loud maybe the type of system matters? Benelli / Remington or similar piston operated gas systems probably need full power / full gas but do inertia gas systems for example need full power?
 
Are you shooting steel knock down targets or paper? If you have knock down steel targets its probably a lot of work to load softer shooting shells that offer no advantage over factory shells. The other question is are you going too see enough reduction in recoil in a semi to offer an advantage to make the extra work worth the effort.
It really depends on a gun too gun basis. Your right that gas guns might need a certain amount of gas to operate properly. I've had 3 intertia The Benelli supersport I had ran anything flawlessly . The other 2 were much more picky on shells and preferred 1250-1300 1 1/8 loads
My A300 and Versamx I had will run a 7/8 oz 12 ga load without issue while my buddies 1301 will have hickups with 1145 Fps 1 1/8 loads.
It really boils down too what shells your gun prefers.
 
One trick I learned somewhere, from someone, is to warm the hulls slightly, as in under a desk lamp etc, just before crimping. When I loaded 12 ga AA hulls and warmed them, they came out perfect, using a LoadAll II.
 
G_Alan said:
Are you shooting steel knock down targets or paper? If you have knock down steel targets its probably a lot of work to load softer shooting shells that offer no advantage over factory shells. The other question is are you going too see enough reduction in recoil in a semi to offer an advantage to make the extra work worth the effort.
It really depends on a gun too gun basis. Your right that gas guns might need a certain amount of gas to operate properly. I've had 3 intertia The Benelli supersport I had ran anything flawlessly . The other 2 were much more picky on shells and preferred 1250-1300 1 1/8 loads
My A300 and Versamx I had will run a 7/8 oz 12 ga load without issue while my buddies 1301 will have hickups with 1145 Fps 1 1/8 loads.
It really boils down too what shells your gun prefers.
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Steel knick down and paper :D

So if I understand correctly one of your inertia guns wasnt picky and the other two were?

Really considering a new shogun and want to get the best fit.
 
I have a Lee Load all in 12 gauge, also have the 20 g conversion. I was never that impressed with it. As someone else mentioned I found the crimps to somewhat open up and get low pressure blooper shots. Also the base of the case right above the brass would sometimes buckle in when crimping. Yes it will do the job but friend of mine has a Mec and it does much better in the crimp dept. I haven’t used mine in years, not worth it IMO unless for the smaller gauges when ammo is scarce. I try to buy my 12 and 20 gauge ammo when on sale. Lead shot is not as cheap as it used to be.
 
I owned a Lee years ago and had no success at all with it but all I had was heavy field load ribbed hulls....it went in the trash ( wouldnt have sold it to my worst enemy).
I now have 2 Mecs that I use happily and often mind you I only load AA hulls with then and they work/crimp flawlessly.
 
I did costing a couple of years back. At the club I could buy 12 ga. Challenger for $12.50 a box and it cost me about $9. I dumpster dive for hulls (Winchester) and boxes. Prices at the club have increased . Each trip I go through a couple of boxes (50)

I bought a used MEC 600jr for $100 and parts for upgrading were $65

I wanted a 2 3/4" non-toxic turkey load and the only way to get it was to make it myself. I shoot lead at clay but f I'm going to eat it, it's bismuth.

Unlike rifle reloading ,because shotgun is low pressure, you must follow the recipe exactly . It's very easy to overload. Lymans #5 is a great how to and Hodgdons has the reloading data.

When I stared, getting primers were an issue. But wads,lead and powder were not a problem
 
per box
6.25 shot 1 1/8 oz
primers 3.25
wads 1.25
powder 6.00
16.50 $ per box
powder 85.00 per lb
100$ shot
30.00 primers per 100
wads 30$ per 500
check my math i may be incorrect
 
My breakdown sourced from the cheapest local store

Shots $59 From the manufacture no tax if you pay cash 1oz load .1475
Powder Hodgdon high gun $52 a lb tax in 19.5 grns .14
wads Claybuster TGT 1000 count $37.23 tax in .04
primers Cheddite 1000 cnt 84.75 tax in .085
_________
.4125 a shell so $10.31 a box not including time

Not really a ton of savings but I'd rather use my shells and have some confidence
 
For target loads if you want to save money, it's best to make loads you can't normally buy - 3/4 or less oz in 12 and 20. There are claybuster wads you can get for those, and if you have the chance to scour a field you can basically get hulls for free. I often see hulls available for cheap as well. Personally I run 11/16 oz lead for 12-20-28 shells. The lyman 5th manual is a little out of date especially for components, and some powders have had changes since their publication there and older recipes do occasionally get removed as being unsafe. Use powder manufacturer websites as the best source and if you have a question call them, they can be super great to have a chat with.
 
stubblejumper said:
There is no real savings in loading 12 gauge target loads. The savings comes in loading 16, 28 or 410, and then only if you load volume. I load around 3000 rounds each of 28 and 410 annually for skeet, and I save around $3000 per year, now that my presses are paid for. I purchased a MEC 9000 for each 28 and 410, and both were paid for the first year, and I still saved a bit.
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There will be savings in the 12 gauge now. Ammo where I am is going up 40-50 percent. 44-50$ a box of what I usually shoot. I really want to get into it
 
The best shotgun reloading manual ever produced was the RCBS Shotshell manual !!!!! SOOO much different info in there for a shotgun reloading enthusiast, BUTT, they are rarer than an honest politician !
Lyman's are great manuals as well as the Ballistic Products specialty books.
I have the Lymans from #2 thru the newest one #6.
Hodgdon reload data on line is also another great source of info. Hummason's Mfg is still a great source for powder, primers, lead and wads ! Also Mec reloader parts.

For me now, it's Ponsness & Warren reloaders for the past 13 or 14 yrs !
 
My above post stated that when I warmed the hulls just prior to loading, I should make it clear that I just heated the top part of the hull under a small lamp. My old LoadAll II worked like a charm with the old style AA hulls. I don't remember if I loaded any of the newer style AA. I just might start loading a few again. I have some shot that is calling.
 
kjohn said:
My above post stated that when I warmed the hulls just prior to loading, I should make it clear that I just heated the top part of the hull under a small lamp. My old LoadAll II worked like a charm with the old style AA hulls. I don't remember if I loaded any of the newer style AA. I just might start loading a few again. I have some shot that is calling.
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kjojn: The new design, AA-HS hulls respond well to warming, too. Most times, pie-crimped hulls will form just fine at normal, indoor temperatures. But....if loading in a cold basement environment, for example, warming does aid in the crimping process.

I've found that many Reifenhauser-type hulls, ie: Federal, Challenger(Cheddite), etc. also respond very well to prior warming. In some cases, I find that they crimp easier and hold tighter, when pre-warmed.

Most beneficial use for hull mouth warming... in my experience, anyway... is just prior to turning in case mouths when forming roll crimps.

With regards to the Lee Load-All. My experience with these machines has been mostly favourable. The only time problems seem to arise, is with payload stack height. Since these machines lack any sort of crimp adjustment, careful attention needs to be paid to overall shell length, when selecting components.
When hulls crumple during the crimping process, that's usually an indicator that the load column is too high. So, the shell's overall length exceeds the crimp station's maximum limit. As a result: excess pressure on the hull while attempting to form the crimp,, causes it to buckle.


Al
 
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