Range Report: Hi-Point .45 vs. CZ 40P vs. M&P 9

ridgearms

ridgearms

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I went out to the range today to try out some of my new handguns. I've had the M&P 9 for a few months now and put 500+ rounds through it. The Hi-point and the CZ40P were being shot for the first time all at 8 metres.

M&P - No matter what I do or how I change my stance, sight picture I cannot get accurate with this gun. The shots seem to be off to the right of center when aiming at center plus there are a few fliers here and there. The shots are all over the place, atleast 4-6 inches apart at 8 metres.

CZ40P - This gun surprised me. I am a beginner when it comes to shooting pistols but the groupings were a lot tighter than my M&P 9 right from the first mag. The bullets were quite close to where I was aiming. I would say around 3-4 inch groups.

Hi-Point .45 JHP - This gun surprised me the most. The recoil felt less than my M&P 9 and the first shot was a near bulls-eye. The 3 successive shots were all within two to three inches. Which is better than I usually do.

Of the three the M&P is the biggest disappointment to me. I don't know if I need better sights or I need an adjustment. How accurate are some of you M&P owners? I'm quite frustrated given that the accuracy on these pistols goes from highest to lowest from the cheapest to the most expensive.
 
I was having quite a time with my M&P9... same kinda thing, I was shooting low and left @ 20 yards. I started looking around for adjustable sights, the only ones I could find were $180+...... almost a third of what the gun cost me!

So then I emailed S&W and they told me the sights on the M&P are factory set to point of aim, that they do not need adjustment they informed me that I was the problem and not the gun.

So then I went to M&P .com, A really useful site if you want to hear ALOT about M&P's.

That is where I found the Shooters pie.
http://www.bullseyepistol.com/training.htm

This is the single best thing I have ever found on the internet!

I also talked to a couple of competition shooters at my gun club (olympic style). They gave me some pointers on where to "put" my thumbs, and how to grip the pistol properly to make the best platform to shoot from.

My groups are now 4" to 6" @ 20 yards, right around the centre of the taget.

One of the olymic shooters at my club shot my M&P, his group was under 2 1/2" @ 20yards (10rnds) So I KNOW the problem with my pistol is me!

I shoot two handed, I hold my thumbs up and forward, I grip the pistol with the middle 2 fingers and the "hollow" of my hand below in the web of my hand and I "jam" the beaver tail into the web of my hand (between the thumb and fore finger) as high up on the pistol as possible so that it presses a ripple in the skin on the back of my hand. You do not want the anything before the first knuckle of your midle fingers to actually contact the grip (do not touch the grip with the finger tips of your 2 middle fingers) and you can "cut your pinkie finger off" as it does not help to place it on the grip.

As the one guy said " if you really want to shoot really well, and you don't want a hand to do anything else with, cut off your thumb and your pinkie finger... they are completely useless"

Ask around, there are some experinced shooters out there who can give you some real good advice, ask them to watch you shoot, they can tell you what you are doing wrong or what you can do to shoot better.

Good Luck with your M&P
 
Thanks for the advice, notsorich. I know a huge factor is my inability to identify my mistakes. The range is so dead when I go. I might need more time with the M&P to work out my issues. I think I will print that pie chart and take it to the range with me. I have put it up on the EE for now. I will take it to the range in the meantime if it isn't sold and see if I can work out some of my problems.
 
One common problem with the 3 dot sights on the M&P is trying to line up the dots with the target. It doesn't work. Try blacking out your sights and then shoot for groups.
 
Get onto YouTube and search for "Todd Jarret training". It'll bring up a couple of excerpts from his training DVD. The one on holding the pistol and how to place your finger on the trigger is priceless.

FWIW I've shot an M&P 9mm and like you I found that it needs some extra care in holding and aiming to get good groups. I think it's mostly the light weight that causes that.
 
I did a burris trigger job on my M&P, all I have to say is "Trigger?.... What trigger?"

I can't find the link where I found the step by step slide show on how to do a burris trigger job. I did download and save the PDF to my hard drive tho, so if you are interested PM me and I'll email it to you.

It is an easy to follow step by step power point style presentation on how to do the trigger. If you decide to do all of the stuff they tell you you can, you can get the trigger down to 2 lbs.

They do not say how to get the "take up" out of the trigger, but I figgured that out for myself, after you do this you can't help but understand the mechanism and how it works.

Sorry to hear that you decided to sell your M&P Ridge, Good luck finding the one(s) right for you.
 
My M&P trigger is a walk in the park compared to my P-99 even with the P-99's trigger job. The M&P is one of the most naturally-pointing handguns I own. Sight picture is great and the trigger, my stock trigger, is fine. I also shot left of center with this gun. I adjusted the front sight and that was that.

On the other hand, almost all my handguns shoot left of center 'till I adjust them. So I know that the problem is me.

I love my Hi-Point .45. Most fun I've ever had for $260. Did I mention tax in? Did I mentioned shipped....:p

PS: Kodiac Outpost; Anytime you're ready to ship me a new sear and transfer bar, I'm waiting.....:)
 
ridgearms said:
I went out to the range today to try out some of my new handguns. I've had the M&P 9 for a few months now and put 500+ rounds through it. The Hi-point and the CZ40P were being shot for the first time all at 8 metres.

M&P - No matter what I do or how I change my stance, sight picture I cannot get accurate with this gun. The shots seem to be off to the right of center when aiming at center plus there are a few fliers here and there. The shots are all over the place, atleast 4-6 inches apart at 8 metres.

CZ40P - This gun surprised me. I am a beginner when it comes to shooting pistols but the groupings were a lot tighter than my M&P 9 right from the first mag. The bullets were quite close to where I was aiming. I would say around 3-4 inch groups.

Hi-Point .45 JHP - This gun surprised me the most. The recoil felt less than my M&P 9 and the first shot was a near bulls-eye. The 3 successive shots were all within two to three inches. Which is better than I usually do.

Of the three the M&P is the biggest disappointment to me. I don't know if I need better sights or I need an adjustment. How accurate are some of you M&P owners? I'm quite frustrated given that the accuracy on these pistols goes from highest to lowest from the cheapest to the most expensive.
Click to expand...

I have the same experience with my MP9, shooting it it goes all over the map. I've tried several suggestions (like what ian_in_vic gave me) but nothing has tightened up the groupings. After putting 20 rounds through a target, it looks more like I shot at the target with a shotgun. Totally random every shot. my K100, 1911, and M213 (norkarev) all have nice groupings when I shoot them.

sometime this week, Im going to take the MP9 out again, and see what happens while I put a few hundred rounds through it, maybe it needs to be "broken in" still as I've only put about 500 rounds through it.
 
We seem to be in the exact same boat. The weight might be a big factor for me. It seems that slight movements with such a light pistol can throw the shots off. Nonetheless, there are some great things about it. I haven't had one fte or ftf. It is well built and I bet an officer who has to carry for 8+ hours would appreciate the lightness of the gun. For me and my sport shooting, I prefer the CZ and the Hi-point for their weight.

THX-1138 said:
I have the same experience with my MP9, shooting it it goes all over the map. I've tried several suggestions (like what ian_in_vic gave me) but nothing has tightened up the groupings. After putting 20 rounds through a target, it looks more like I shot at the target with a shotgun. Totally random every shot. my K100, 1911, and M213 (norkarev) all have nice groupings when I shoot them.

sometime this week, Im going to take the MP9 out again, and see what happens while I put a few hundred rounds through it, maybe it needs to be "broken in" still as I've only put about 500 rounds through it.
Click to expand...
 
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