Range Safety Issue

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Yes, rounds hitting the ground is a saftey issue no matter what type of gun.


Better not take any more chances. Have all the people living in a 5 mile area of the range move to some where else.

Just joking.

Everyone should teach saftey and practise it at all times no matter where they are shooting.

 

[Calum]

Not sure if is the right place to post this concern, but if it attracts the attention of 7.62 X 39 shooters..it will be a good thing. Our Range is largely unsupervised and for the most part, members are pretty responsible. However, last week someone left a trail of bullet divots starting about 10M from the firing line...

You should see what the local cops do at our ranges out this way.

some of which could have skipped over the 100M backstop.

Yah and hit a unicorn right? Seriously unless the ground on the range field is one giant steel plate then I doubt 7.62x39 will skip over a 100M backstop.

I'm with clay.
I remember going to the 80 yd. range at my range in Thunder Bay. There was 100+ empties on the dry grass (PICK UP YOUR EMPTIES IN THE SUMMER ITS A F*%^ING FOREST FIRE HAZARD). There were holes in the stands etc...

How exactly is a rusted steel case left on the ground a forest fire hazard?
Gee I guess all the .22 rimfire brass left allover the place at every range in Canada is down right thermonuclear.

 

[maetsack]

Man, the Fudds have come out of the woodwork for this one.

Could you come up with a few more unsubstantiated conclusions based on your BS observations? Because it was a particular caliber was used incorrectly, then all users of that caliber have to be regulated? What a load of horse s**t.

This is just lazy f**ktard thinking - we don't like military rifles so lets trump up a false association and impose our will through it. And the Fudds wonder why the sport is dieing. Idiots.

 

[gth]

You should see what the local cops do at our ranges out this way.

We had a mortally wounded picnic table a few years ago.






Its obvious that sks should be added to the prohibited list seeing as they are so dangerous.....

 

[Claybuster]

Man, the Fudds have come out of the woodwork for this one.

Could you come up with a few more unsubstantiated conclusions based on your BS observations? Because it was a particular caliber was used incorrectly, then all users of that caliber have to be regulated? What a load of horse s**t.

This is just lazy f**ktard thinking - we don't like military rifles so lets trump up a false association and impose our will through it. And the Fudds wonder why the sport is dieing. Idiots.

I know why rifle shooting at our range is declining. It's the new rules being forced on us (some by the CFO, some by the club executive) because some asswipes think rapid firing their 7.62x39 semi-autos into the ground and at illegal targets is so cool they don't give a damn what the rules are or how it affects anyone else.

The club has had reports of rapid fire, auto-fire (most likely bump firing) and each time it's looked into there's a new pile of 7.62x39 steel cases somewhere on the range, sometimes well ahead of the line where people are not supposed to shoot.

I wouldn't support banning a cartridge or an action type but it's a small group of jerks with SKS and CZs that are causing the problem for shooting not the silhouette shooters, target shooters, reloaders and hunters who want a place to sight in their rifles.

 

[nikoinwinnipeg]

I know why rifle shooting at our range is declining. It's the new rules being forced on us (some by the CFO, some by the club executive) because some asswipes think rapid firing their 7.62x39 semi-autos into the ground and at illegal targets is so cool they don't give a damn what the rules are or how it affects anyone else.

The club has had reports of rapid fire, auto-fire (most likely bump firing) and each time it's looked into there's a new pile of 7.62x39 steel cases somewhere on the range, sometimes well ahead of the line where people are not supposed to shoot.

I wouldn't support banning a cartridge or an action type but it's a small group of jerks with SKS and CZs that are causing the problem for shooting not the silhouette shooters, target shooters, reloaders and hunters who want a place to sight in their rifles.

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to Rapid fire! " not bumpfire " thats just retarded!.

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to go down range and set up targets " not computers and other stupid s**t " at various spots and do tactical drills keeping in mind that the range is empty and only i am there.

if i pay my friggen fee they shouldnt ##### about my casings as i am PAYING to use this range!

the KEY to all this BS is I AM PAYING so DEAL with it.


The casings shouldnt be a problom its all the people shooting the friggen benches table and bringing their garbage computers and tvs and crap to shoot the range is for one thing only!! standing targets.

 

[Claybuster]

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to Rapid fire! " not bumpfire " thats just retarded!.

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to go down range and set up targets " not computers and other stupid s**t " at various spots and do tactical drills keeping in mind that the range is empty and only i am there.

if i pay my friggen fee they shouldnt ##### about my casings as i am PAYING to use this range!

the KEY to all this BS is I AM PAYING so DEAL with it.

Thank you for your post. I couldn't have captured as succinctly the attitude among a small group of shooters who are causing the issues at our range. Well done.

 

[michaelsabre]

Something other than safety:

Those Russian ammunitions are much more environment friendly choice:

1, The used case wouldn't left anything behind: after typical 1.5 years the steel shell will rusted into dust. Brass will last much longer but it's not that bad thanks to the hard work of the reloaders. the worst is shotgun shell, which is plastic. It lasts almost forever, and it's very hard to recycle them.

2, The Russian bullets use much less heavy metals than standard cartridge. The use of steel jacket and steel core dramatically reduced copper and lead contamination on range soil. The worst source of lead contamination comes from skeet/clay shooters, who sprays large amount of lead over a large area.

Note: Don't get me wrong, I love clay games.

 

[catnthehatt]

Thank you for your post. I couldn't have captured as succinctly the attitude among a small group of shooters who are causing the issues at our range. Well done.

I'm not sure of the pint of shootign at the ground so bullets buzz off into uncontrolled space, byut we ahave a fw that like to do that.
As far as casings on the ground go, I just bought a nail magnet from princess Auto that grabs steel cases an shotsless with steel rimmed rimers really well.
before that we asked all our memebers to pick up their own caseings, but that rarely happened.
just becuase someone pays a fee or membership does not entitle them to shoot a place up or leave their garbage for soemone else to pick up.
Cat

 

[Silverado]

We have some problems with shooters of 7.62X39 here also. Why these individuals can't be bothered to pick up their casings is beyond me... lazy.

We have in the past seen actual acts of vandalism, with X39 casings littering the area... when I catch the SOB and associates doing that, I relish all the CCC, FA and civil charges we're going to hit 'em with. I wouldn't feel one pang of guilt trying for a lifetime firearms prohibition for a jackass like that...

 

[gunbuny]

I have to Agree with Colin JW that this is more an issue of poor sportsmanship and lack of common skills.
I don't know how it is possible to claim that the SKS shooters are responsible however. I know the range in question and while it is largely unsupervised most of the people are quite responsible.
Ranges are the areas that should be used to practice shooting skills whether from the hip, prone, standing.
And I know that the range is used bye LEO's regularly and you should see some of the techniques they use.
Round ricochet. Its the nature of the beast.

 

[MrMatt]

Range use

Personally I don't see the problem with controlled "rapid" fire. Controlled meaning each and every shot is aimed, uncontrolled ie unaimed fire is irresponsible IMO
One reason I like my semi auto .22 is it has helped me improve my recovery after a shot.

I have heard of ranges imposing cleaning fees on users who leave brass all over. Currently my range expects everyone to clean up after themselves, there would be an extra fee if we have to hire cleaners.

If your range only permits targets at certain locations, that's all you paid for.

If you want to do tactical drills, join a range that is approved for them. They do exist, of course due to the setup and paperwork they cost more.
If your range doesn't permit this behaviour, you're not paying to use it that way. When you rent a hotel room it is to use the room in a certain way, you're generally not permitted to be excessively noise, smash up the furniture and take a dump on the carpet, to do so is wrong because you didn't pay to 'use' the room that way.

Your range doesn't offer an action range with random targets and a cleaning service? You're not paying for it, go join a range that does. Or run your own range. The range executive decides how they will run the range, what will be permitted, and how much they will charge for those activities.

My range is currently investigating how to upgrade the range to permit more tactical type situations as it is a non trivial upgrade.

That being said I'd love to find a range that permits jungle lanes, that was a blast.

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to Rapid fire! " not bumpfire " thats just retarded!.

if i pay my friggen fee i should be able to go down range and set up targets " not computers and other stupid s**t " at various spots and do tactical drills keeping in mind that the range is empty and only i am there.

if i pay my friggen fee they shouldnt ##### about my casings as i am PAYING to use this range!

the KEY to all this BS is I AM PAYING so DEAL with it.


The casings shouldnt be a problom its all the people shooting the friggen benches table and bringing their garbage computers and tvs and crap to shoot the range is for one thing only!! standing targets.

 

[Paul Morrison]

holes in the stand! wtf is that suppose to mean

You shoot the paper, not the wooden stand the paper is on. If enough morons shoot the stand, then you have to make a new stand.

How exactly is a rusted steel case left on the ground a forest fire hazard?

Its not rusting that's the problem. A fired casing remains hot for an hour or more on a hot day. Hot casing + dry grass = fire hazard.

 

[Tozman]

Why is the 7.62x39 caliber singled out here?

I have come accross shooters who do the same unethical kind of shooting and messing with their ARs, M-14 clones etc.etc.

Maybe it is more common with the Russian caliber because the ammo is cheaper and hence is used in larger volumes.

If one day, say 223 cal ammo gets dirt cheap, guess who we are going to ##### and complain against.

It is not the gun.
It is not the caliber.
IT IS THE SHOOTER.

Let's deal with the REAL problem.

 

[Silverado]

I agree with you Tozman, it's the shooter. It just seems that much of the irresponsible shooters choose to be so while shooting whatever 7.62X39 surplus rifle...

There is more X39 casing waste left than anything else, by a factor of 10X at least... that is a fact. It is also a fact that most of our major property damage issues are committed with that round...

Bottom line though, it is the irresponsible range USER, not the tool that's the problem.

 

[woodchopper]

The ricochet of a round off any of your commonly found surfaces on a range is a very interesting subject. For everyone that thinks that those rounds that hit the berms behind the targets stay there I have some news for you.... not all of them do. You may be surprised to find that a lot actually skip off the berms and into the air. Some do this at fairly extreme angles well extreme for a bullet. But the good thing is that the more extreme the angle the less energy the bullet has. Now the condition of the berms and the angle of the berms do make a big difference here. A good berm has a 3:2 slope and is faced with sand or sand sawdust mix that helps contain the bullets.

As for going downrange to change your targets on the rifle range while the pistol range next to you is live and hearing bullets….. Well guess what those bullets are the ones that are hitting the back berms and targets then skipping out of the berm. Your walking in the danger template of the pistol range.

 

[Denn0001]

I agree with those that say it is not the caliber of the round but how responsibly they shoot. I don't know about some others but I always pick up my .223cal. casings for future reloading. It's just too expensive to through away casings. Not sure about the steel ones though but they should still be picked up. .22cal. casing litter the whole area. I guess because people people think they're small they don't make a mess. Wrong. That's what the brooms are for. Clean them up. As for leaving dud rounds laying around, well that's just plain dangerous. There are boxes mounted at the range for hangfired rounds. Use them. I have also found numerous shotgun casings on our range and we don't even allow shotguns except in the cowboy action area which is only used when there is an event going as far as I know. Irisponsible people, not irisponsible ammo.