Rebluing an antique?
- Thread starter Thenoobgunsmith
- Start date
Its old stuff. its a part History. Don't destroy it for fun. It survived this long, why ruin it now..
And no i dont care what you do to your yard. Unless you bought a old pieces of history and you plan to destroy it. ( eg. maud lewis house)
Stuff cant be remade. You have items that lasted 100's maybe 1000's of years. Why be a #### and ruin it just because you afford to.
I wouldnt stop you but i would do it for you.
I love old stuff and history. I hate how much people these days dont care about it as it not brand new. All i can say is im glad there is real collectors and museums out there that care for and preserve this old stuff. The entire world as we know it was build using these antique things, show some respect for the work gone into make them, there are loads of muskets made by hand with no power tool/ electricity at all. so literally a hand made gun, every single part of it, think of the hours of time and effort gone into that.
and im not saying all old stuff needs to be saved at all, im saying if you if are informed what you have is rare or hard to find or used for a very specific reason or group of people then maybe save it for some one who actually cares about what it is. and dont ruin it, as some day there will be none left.
i have loads of old stuff i modified to make work better or to be able to use, i have load of over 100 year old sporter rifles and i few 32 rimfire handguns that have been re chambered, but if i found out one was used by John Wilkes Booth i defiantly would not mess with it at all. even if i can because i own it
And no i dont care what you do to your yard. Unless you bought a old pieces of history and you plan to destroy it. ( eg. maud lewis house)
Stuff cant be remade. You have items that lasted 100's maybe 1000's of years. Why be a #### and ruin it just because you afford to.
I wouldnt stop you but i would do it for you.
I love old stuff and history. I hate how much people these days dont care about it as it not brand new. All i can say is im glad there is real collectors and museums out there that care for and preserve this old stuff. The entire world as we know it was build using these antique things, show some respect for the work gone into make them, there are loads of muskets made by hand with no power tool/ electricity at all. so literally a hand made gun, every single part of it, think of the hours of time and effort gone into that.
and im not saying all old stuff needs to be saved at all, im saying if you if are informed what you have is rare or hard to find or used for a very specific reason or group of people then maybe save it for some one who actually cares about what it is. and dont ruin it, as some day there will be none left.
i have loads of old stuff i modified to make work better or to be able to use, i have load of over 100 year old sporter rifles and i few 32 rimfire handguns that have been re chambered, but if i found out one was used by John Wilkes Booth i defiantly would not mess with it at all. even if i can because i own it
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If it needs it...do it. Not all antiques are in any sort of shape. I acquired a Antique wheel gun that was 'In the White' thanks to some well intended Bubba with some steel wool.
I just cold blued it... no harm done. No one has asked the OP about condition...many just said..."No, it's a travesty to do that!"
Maybe it's an eyesore. Most are in decent shape...if so, sure, leave it.
If it's not, clean it up...OP's business IMO.
That deep S & W blue probably wouldn't suit it though. My son got A Savage LE reblued...too deep, looks funny. Mind you; it needed it, it was totally rusted on the exterior...totally trashed.
Was a any harm done? Well, it's not my style...but it's an improvement anyhow.
That "No never do it!" mantra gets tiresome every now and again. Sometimes a gun needs a freshen up...sometimes folks ruin stuff too. At the end of the day it's his business.
I just cold blued it... no harm done. No one has asked the OP about condition...many just said..."No, it's a travesty to do that!"
Maybe it's an eyesore. Most are in decent shape...if so, sure, leave it.
If it's not, clean it up...OP's business IMO.
That deep S & W blue probably wouldn't suit it though. My son got A Savage LE reblued...too deep, looks funny. Mind you; it needed it, it was totally rusted on the exterior...totally trashed.
Was a any harm done? Well, it's not my style...but it's an improvement anyhow.
That "No never do it!" mantra gets tiresome every now and again. Sometimes a gun needs a freshen up...sometimes folks ruin stuff too. At the end of the day it's his business.
I didnt realize how much of a debate and strong response this question would provoke. I agree with most that antiques should not really be altered or refinished to honor and protect the workmanship and history. The gun i was considering rebluing has no finish remaining, some rust and the barrel was replaced at some point. So she definitely quite an eyesore and not even all original or parts matching, but shes a great shooter. When professionally done it can fix problems and while not an improvement its a trade off if you are saving a rusty gun.
Seems like you and I can't afford the good stuff friend...we have to go with working antiques. No velvet lined boxes at my house. I have stoned in a replacement part or two in my day as well... gunsmith's usually want it for a year or so til they get at it...I don't have time for that.
It usually works better after I get done with it...sometimes looks alright too. But I use mine now and again... no safe queens at my house.
Try and replicate the original finish and the grumpy old men can go kick rocks IMO
An interesting conversation from two opposite ends of the field.
My tuppence worth.....
I have no problem in refinishing the metalwork on an antique rifle if it is going to be a utility gun and used around the farm.
It is common in England to have your sporting gun re-blued or re-stocked, but we talking expensive sporting guns, not surplus army rifles.
For the most part, I leave well alone and do not touch the metal finish in a restoration, if I can help it. Now that being said, if the metalwork is poor and needs to be fixed to get rid of rust and pitting, or if I had to machine or do other work on the metal, I will refinish with an appropriate method. If I do refinish, I try to make the finish match with regards to wear and patina. Enfields were slow rust blued and their small parts were oil blackened.
That is one of the skills of a good restorer. To remove the signs of abuse and neglect, yet leave the gun looking worn for its years.
I flash back to Yorkshire and to me a kid of about ten years old looking at a recruiting booth for the Territorials. They would roll into town once a year with their road show and set up a big display on the market square with trucks and armoured vehicles. They had a table with weapons on display. Touchy feely.
I remember handling the FN SLR rifle, I wanted to grow up to be a soldier and get one so bad. The thing was obviously pulled out of stores for the display. It might even have been DP. But what I remember was the wear in the finish. It was polished from use and most edges and corners were devoid of finish. I can see it in my mind now, the patina was awesome!
Nothing wrong with honest wear in my eyes. An old rifle is allowed to look old.
Now here is a suggestion for something that I do quite often. When I restore a rifle or carbine and the finish is poor, or waiting for refinish, I fix the mechanicals and wood work, then spray bomb paint the rifle black with Tremclad rust paint or similar (ya, call me Bubba!)
This is for two main reasons. One is rust protection. It can take me months or even years before I revisit that restoration project after I get that gun shooting. It could go rusty sitting on the rack, never mind being dragged through the bush. BUT, the paint can be removed with stripper in very short time when need be.
Secondly, painting the thing also lets me see how pretty it will be with a nice even black finish. Sometimes that temporary finish stays on there for years.
Sometimes painting the thing black shows me that it aint right for that rifle with antique looking wood and furniture, just too nice, it looks wrong. That then confirms that I should not reblue to finish the project but to perhaps touch up and restore patina.
And just to stir the pot, if you were restoring an old car, boat or motor cycle that still had original paint, but was faded, rusted or peeling, would you repaint?? No longer original finish! Does that ruin the restoration? Just wondering what opinions on that would be.
Generally, it can be argued that an original antique gun with 10% of original finish, is worth more than it would be if it had 100% refinish. Refinishing devalues a gun by about 50%.
I know that it don't work like that for collectable automobiles.
My tuppence worth.....
I have no problem in refinishing the metalwork on an antique rifle if it is going to be a utility gun and used around the farm.
It is common in England to have your sporting gun re-blued or re-stocked, but we talking expensive sporting guns, not surplus army rifles.
For the most part, I leave well alone and do not touch the metal finish in a restoration, if I can help it. Now that being said, if the metalwork is poor and needs to be fixed to get rid of rust and pitting, or if I had to machine or do other work on the metal, I will refinish with an appropriate method. If I do refinish, I try to make the finish match with regards to wear and patina. Enfields were slow rust blued and their small parts were oil blackened.
That is one of the skills of a good restorer. To remove the signs of abuse and neglect, yet leave the gun looking worn for its years.
I flash back to Yorkshire and to me a kid of about ten years old looking at a recruiting booth for the Territorials. They would roll into town once a year with their road show and set up a big display on the market square with trucks and armoured vehicles. They had a table with weapons on display. Touchy feely.
I remember handling the FN SLR rifle, I wanted to grow up to be a soldier and get one so bad. The thing was obviously pulled out of stores for the display. It might even have been DP. But what I remember was the wear in the finish. It was polished from use and most edges and corners were devoid of finish. I can see it in my mind now, the patina was awesome!
Nothing wrong with honest wear in my eyes. An old rifle is allowed to look old.
Now here is a suggestion for something that I do quite often. When I restore a rifle or carbine and the finish is poor, or waiting for refinish, I fix the mechanicals and wood work, then spray bomb paint the rifle black with Tremclad rust paint or similar (ya, call me Bubba!)
This is for two main reasons. One is rust protection. It can take me months or even years before I revisit that restoration project after I get that gun shooting. It could go rusty sitting on the rack, never mind being dragged through the bush. BUT, the paint can be removed with stripper in very short time when need be.
Secondly, painting the thing also lets me see how pretty it will be with a nice even black finish. Sometimes that temporary finish stays on there for years.
Sometimes painting the thing black shows me that it aint right for that rifle with antique looking wood and furniture, just too nice, it looks wrong. That then confirms that I should not reblue to finish the project but to perhaps touch up and restore patina.
And just to stir the pot, if you were restoring an old car, boat or motor cycle that still had original paint, but was faded, rusted or peeling, would you repaint?? No longer original finish! Does that ruin the restoration? Just wondering what opinions on that would be.
Generally, it can be argued that an original antique gun with 10% of original finish, is worth more than it would be if it had 100% refinish. Refinishing devalues a gun by about 50%.
I know that it don't work like that for collectable automobiles.
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I remain unrepentant when it comes to old tired British Shotguns ; I much prefer the clear damascus finish to the old oxidized patina. Wood finishing I rarely touch because it is usually in good shape.
cheers mooncoon
cheers mooncoon
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I agree. In Britain, it is quite common to re-brown damascus or twist barrels, while leaving locks and furniture well alone, and a few drops of red-tinted linseed oil for the stock. A good compromise on showing age and showing off gunmaking craft.
