Reloading .303 British

[slushee]

I am an avid reloader of .308 Win, .223 Rem and 9mm Para. I am starting to look at .303 Brit reloading and there are a few questions I have.

First, this round headspaces off the Rim. Lee Enfields are notorious for having huge chambers and therefore one can assume all my 'range brass' to be very distorted. I have read that Full Length Resizing can drastically reduce case life in a .303 because the brass 'stretches a mile' every time its fired.

My only concern is, if I have all this range brass, can I neck size each case and then check for proper fit in the chamber before I prime, powder and seat a bullet? I could understand new and factory brass not having an issue as it would be 'fire formed' but all my brass is range brass.

So in short, can I neck size and check for chamber fit, then continue to neck size .303 brit?

Also, should I get a lee factory crimp for .303 brit after i'm done?

 

[H4831]

Only yu will know the answers to your question. It's your rifle and your brass, so we don't know what will go in and what won't. Try it if you wish.
You do not have to crimp you're loaded rounds.

 

[David K]

.. You can only NECK-SIZE which helps prolong case life. Also get yourself a "Stuck Case Remover", as even with the most careful of Inspections, and light reloads, case separation will inevitably occur. It's not really a dangerous situation, but a damn nuisance ! .... Range Brass ? I'd suggest, that initially they all be inspected and full resized to start with ( The odd Berdan Primer is something to check for, with Range Brass ! ) ..... David K

 

[Sluice]

In my Lee Enfield I only use new brass or factory ammo that has been fired in that rifle. I have had case seperations when using range or brass fired in other Lee Enfields.

 

[ben hunchak]

You could have problems with your own gun/chamber if headspace is excessive, even new brass could stretch too much and not allow a reload without case separation. You just have to experiment with loads and brass.

 

[mikeystew]

New brass life span can be optimized when doing the first fireforming by wrapping dental floss around the base of the case about as thick as the rim. when the new brass is chambered the floss will force the base into the boltface creating a near zero headspace, and when it is fired the case will stretch out more evenly forwards to fill the chamber, rather than first filling the chamber and then stretching the head of the case rearward, creating a weakened area just in front of the web, which leads to head seperation.
appropriately sized o rings work well also.

 

[Fozy]

I was just having a discussion about 303 last night. So is neck sizing better to do or is it better to go with full body resizing?

 

[sunray]

"...have all this range brass..." As in brass picked up at the range? It'll have to be full length resized first anyway.
"...creating a near zero headspace..." Headspace has nothing to do with the cartridge. It's a rifle manufacturing tolerance only.

 

[mikeystew]

usually for .303 brit it is best to neck size only once the brass has been formed to your chamber because neck sizing will cause the cartridge to headspace off the shoulder rather than the rim, and this is where the floss or o rings make such a big difference because the fireformed case will not be weakened above the web. once it's formed properly the brass won't stretch much more at all and case life will be much longer. Range brass of unknown origin should always be full length resized first, and then neck sized only after that

 

[SKS50]

slushee Here is a good article on using rubber o rings to center the 303 cases in the chamber while fire forming. http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=16355&page=2

 

[vviking]

Well, in 30+years with 303br I've yet to have a problem. Not saying it couldn't happen tho.
I never size more than neccessary to close the bolt. If you were to first look for a case amongst your fired brass(before resizing) that will not chamber, and then carefully adjust the F.L. die till the bolt closes with light resistance on that case, the next discharge will be at 0 headspace. Leave the die right there and run all the cases through. Cull any that do not require as much ram pressure to size and set aside as "short". Look carefully at the angled shoulder portion of those cases for the faint marking you will see when shoulders have been pushed back. Any lacking that tell tale mark are separated and loaded with bullets jamb'ed into the rifling(I use cheap cast slugs) to prevent stretching at the web on first firing in YOUR gun. Take 'em out and blow 'em away. Now you have a batch of brass with zero headspace, some fireformed to get that way, some by the sizer die.
From then on its easy to stay away from excess sizing, or, use a Lee collet die.
New factory brass(for me mostly WW) is often quite short. 10 or 12 thou. H.S. is not uncommon.
By all means keep a sharp eye for signs of incipient case head separation at every reload, but my .303's last just as long as any other cal., assuming you never, never, push the shoulders back any more than nessessary for smooth chambering. The rim is no longer in play. The shoulder is. Just like any other rimless round.
Never thought of dental floss or 'o' rings for H.S. control before reading the above posts, will have to try.
Although not commonly recomended for the Brit., imr/h 4350 has worked very well for both vel. and accuracy. Compressed. Easy on the brass at full power.
Love my 303's.

 

[Ganderite]

What I do with strange brass is partially size a case that won't chamber and see if it does. if not, I size it a bit further, until it chambers. This is usually about a tenth of an inch short of a full size. This saves the brass from more stretching.

 

[TwoTone]

vviking and ganderite have it right

I agree with vviking and ganderite (which is pretty much what the OP was proposing anyway).

I do exactly what vviking describes with the addition of using an o-ring around the case at the rim on the first firing. (o-ring = easy, dental floss = pain in a$$)

The result is brass that fits your chamber and will last a long time.

As mentioned above, even new brass can be trouble in some 303's but if you follow the above procedure you should be fine.

No need to fear range brass, you can certainly get it to fit your chamber. You may run into some cases that have already been loaded a few times and are stretched too thin which might result in a CHS but it's no big deal.

 

[Dutchie]

usually for .303 brit it is best to neck size only once the brass has been formed to your chamber because neck sizing will cause the cartridge to headspace off the shoulder rather than the rim, and this is where the floss or o rings make such a big difference because the fireformed case will not be weakened above the web. once it's formed properly the brass won't stretch much more at all and case life will be much longer. Range brass of unknown origin should always be full length resized first, and then neck sized only after that

I agree here with Mike, and did not have to use so many words!

 

[bigedp51]

Ed Horton AKA bigedp51

I first read about the o-ring method of fire forming at the old Jouster Enfield forum and it was posted by a Canadian by the name of Terry in Victoria. (A very smart and ingenious gentleman) You will need small o-rings, o-rings that are too large will cause hard bolt closing and possible wear on the locking lug recesses.

North American or American .303 commercial ammunition is loaded by the factories at or below 43,000 cup due to the amount of "older" .303 Enfields still being shot. The Enfield smokeless pressures varied from 16.5 tsi when the first smokeless ammunition came out to 17.5 tsi and then 18.5 tsi for Mk.7 ammo. Therefore American .303 ammunition is down loaded to lower pressures than the rated pressure for Mk.7 ammo at 45,000 cup or 49,000 psi.

What this means is our American made SAAMI governed .303 brass cases do "NOT" like being fired at pressures above 43,000 cup or they will fall apart.

Ask yourself why Hodgdons sets their reloading chamber pressures at or below 43,000 cup and "LOWER" than the rated chamber pressure of 45,00 cup.

You also have a problem with a "long" and "fat" Enfield military chambers and commercial cases with small base diameters. On top of this commercial reloading dies are "NOT" made for the Enfield military chamber and if you full length resize your cases you will push the should of the case back approximately an 1/8 of and inch "too" far.

Below is a loaded South African surplus .303 cartridge, it is resting in a L.E. Wilson case gauge used for checking case head space. The .303 case below is resting on its shoulder and "NOT" the rim, it is .002 below the lip of the gauge as should all newly made .303 ammunition. (All loaded ammunition needs to be smaller than minimum head space to ensure chambering)

Below is the same case fired in a military Enfield and the amount of the case sticking above the gauge is how much "LONGER" the military chamber is than a civilian commercial SAAMI chamber.

A Winchester case fired in a different military Enfield and I think it is sticking up less due to more "brass spring back" after firing and not because this chamber is "shorter".

Now if you full length resize your fired cases they will be this much shorter "again" and when fired "again" they will stretch and thin in the web area and cause case head separations.

Animated .gif image from Parashooters "Headspace 101"


If you do not fire form your cases with the rear of the case forced into contact with the bolt face you run into two problems.

1. The small base diameter of our American made cases allows the case to rest or "lay" in the chamber and "lays" off center with the axis of the bore. This allows the case to thin on one side of the case more and causes unequal case expansion.

2. When the case is not fire formed correctly the case thins and stretches in the base web area doing "damage" to the fired case.

When you full length resize the above type case the "base" of the cartridge is pushed off center with the axis of the bore. This type resized case is called a banana shaped case because the case is "warped" even after full length resizing"

Below, please note the angle of the incipient case head separation, this case had over .008 base run out or "wobble". When a banana shaped type case is chambered the crooked base causes bullet misalignment with the axis of the bore and your accuracy will suffer greatly.

A forum member at Gunboards Enfield forum that fire formed his cases using the o-ring method got over 30 reloading before he had his first cracked neck in a destruction test of .303 cases. (With "NO" case head separations)

NOTE: Last week I received my ordered Redding Forming & trim .303 die, because the fired .303 cases are "longer" when fired in a Military Enfield you can use this case forming die to bump the shoulder of the case back and not size or effect the case body or neck. This means you can bump the shoulder back on any .303 case fired in "any" Enfield and it will chamber in "any" Enfield rifle. (unless you have a really fat chamber)

NOTE: I like tight head space "BUT" using the o-ring method head space becomes meaningless (with in reason) It also makes looking for #3 bolt heads a thing of the past.

I lapped a #0 bolt head to a head space setting of .084 (and remember .074 is maximum) and fire formed cases and reloaded and fired these cases without any ill effects. This means "NO" case swelling or enlargement at the base of the case due to .010 less chamber support of the case.

I do not recommend doing this and it is just an example of excess head space and the .303 Enfield rifle. What I'm saying is it is easer to find a rubber o-ring than it is finding a #2 or #3 bolt head.

I reloaded my "rimmed" Winchester 30-30 Trapper Model for 30 years and never had any reloading problem or case head separations. Don't blame the Enfield rifle for a problem caused by non-military "wimpy" commercial cartridge cases. (and yes that's a No.4 Long Branch)

 

[Northman999]

One thing you may very well need to get used to is extremely short brass life (in LE's), no matter what you do. That has been my experience anyway.

I'm currently shooting a batch of 2F (once reloaded) ammo (150gr Sierra's over IMR 4895, IVI brass) and I am getting about 15% with necks split wide open. My load is fairly high, but not max. I have also seen factory 303 Brit split case necks on first firing.

I've never reloaded anything that has such fragile brass as 303 Brit.

 

[bigedp51]

One thing you may very well need to get used to is extremely short brass life (in LE's), no matter what you do. That has been my experience anyway.

I'm currently shooting a batch of 2F (once reloaded) ammo (150gr Sierra's over IMR 4895, IVI brass) and I am getting about 15% with necks split wide open. My load is fairly high, but not max. I have also seen factory 303 Brit split case necks on first firing.

I've never reloaded anything that has such fragile brass as 303 Brit.

Optimist in my posting above with new Remington brass got over 30 reloadings before a split neck occurred. There is a difference between the word fragile and old, ancient and brittle.

(I can't remember the last time I had a split neck, try a Lee Collet die and annealing your case necks)

 

[coyote]

I have reloaded for 303 quite a bit and brass life is short 3-4 firings the best results were neck sizing with lee collet die after fireformed.

 

[Northman999]

Optimist in my posting above with new Remington brass got over 30 reloadings before a split neck occurred. There is a difference between the word fragile and old, ancient and brittle.

(I can't remember the last time I had a split neck, try a Lee Collet die and annealing your case necks)

I know what you are saying, but I've never heard of annealing after one factory firing. I anneal my other brass after five firings, and I do sometimes wonder if I really need to. And like I said I've seen factory (commercial and military) 303 split necks on the first firing. IVI and Winchester for sure, maybe others.

And, am I the only one who looks at the thickness of the brass on the neck of 303 cases and thinks the brass is about 1/2 as thick as on other calibers? Honestly, I have not taken a caliper to the brass (I will when I get a chance), but put a 303 case next to a .308 win case and it looks like the 303 neck brass is paper thin.

Anyway, I was just commenting on my experiences reloading 303. I reload for about five LE's and a couple pf P14's, but have only been doing it for about three years. I certainly do not consider myself an expert.

 

[bigedp51]

Below is a factory loaded Winchester .303 cases fired in my 1943 Maltby, the head space is set at just under .067.

When this cartridge was fired the case stretched and thinned .009 in the base web area near the bottom of the case.

The rim thickness of this case is .058 and the head space is .067.

.067 - .058 = .009

There is .009 head gap clearance or an "air gap" between the rear of the case and the bolt face which allows the case to stretch when fired.

You can fire form your cases using a rubber o-ring to hold the case against the bolt face and the cases will not stretch or thin when fired for the first time.

Below 50 fire formed .303 cases using the rubber o-ring method and "NO" case stretching and thinning when fired for the first time.

After fire forming the case no longer head spaces on the rim of the case and it now head spaces on the shoulder of the case. Now the shoulder of the case is holding the rear of the case against the bolt face, and when neck sized only the case can not stretch and thin when fired for the second time.

The book below tells you to set your head space .003 larger than your rim thickness to make your Enfield more accurate and make your cases last longer.

You have two small problems with this and one is finding the proper size bolt head, and second is if the cases you are using have thin rims you will need to set your head space "below" or "tighter" than the minimum head space setting of .064.

Below I lapped and fitted a second bolt head and set my head space at .061 to give me .003 clearance behind the case and bolt face.

Lee Enfield head space primer.

It is far easier to fire form your cases with a rubber o-ring to eliminate excess head space (head gap clearance) than finding new bolt heads and fitting them to your bolt.

m