I am looking at starting to reload for my .338 Lapua and i have seen them vary from $50 for RCBS 2 die sets all the way up to $300+ like the redding competition set with the micrometer adjustment and all the bells and whistles...i mean its a cartridge that should be loaded for precision but can i do the same things with the $50 RCBS as spending $300+ on a set with all the goodies? I am fairly new to reloading and do plan on starting with my .308 but I am also looking at starting to get the stuff together so i can reload for the .338 as well. i don't mind spending money for good stuff but are you really getting a product that can do that much more or do everything that much better?
reloading dies, are the expensive ones worth it?
- Thread starter yotawheeler
- Start date
samsplacci71
Regular
- Location
- Toronto area
Competition shooters will certainly weigh in. Different die manufacturers will include other goodies like a factory crimp die, neck sizer, competition seater..... I have regular 2 die RCBS sets ie, FL resize and Bullet Seating in various calibers up to 8mm. I am not shooting competition, but you can achieve good to very good accuracy with them (MOA or sub MOA) if you do your part. Having said that, I would love to have a micrometer seating die, it makes minute adjustments in seating depth a lot easier.
just sort of for reference as to what I am looking at/comparing...and i have no desire to compete in long range shooting but i would like to be able to shoot 1 MOA or so with my .338 at longer ranges (1000+) once I'm capable of doing my part just for kicks
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/77...zer-set-338-lapua-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/34...die-set-338-lapua-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding
http://www.cabelas.ca/product/4557/rcbs-reloading-die-sets
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/77...zer-set-338-lapua-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/34...die-set-338-lapua-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding
http://www.cabelas.ca/product/4557/rcbs-reloading-die-sets
I have redding, forster and lee dies. For precision I will be going forster from now on. I have the micrometer seating die, neck sizer with bushing, and bushing shoulder bump die. I think the pricing on the forster dies is less than redding and they are amazing. On my 308 I was reading .002-.003 of runout. With the forster seater I am getting less than .001 in most cases.
Hotwheels81
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- South of GP
Yer yakkin bout a Lee collet neck die huh? Yup... Figgerd..
I have Lee RCBC and Redding on my bench, can't much tell a difference between em aside from the price tag...
What's the point in havin a fancy micrometer seating die? Yer still gunna check it with a OAL tool that measures from the ogive of the bullet anyway... Maybe if you were reloading for several rifles or several types of bullets for one rifle it would make finding the rite depth more repeatable...
The big eye opener in precision stuff (for me anyway) is neck tension an concentricity... I've turned 2MOA rifles shooting factory fodder into .5MOA rifles simply by turning necks, cleaning up an uniforming primer pockets an playing with seating depth... All with Lee an RCBS dies too... Heck my new salvage in 30-06 is looking mighty fine with some decently prepped plain ole range pickup Hornady brass I FL sized with a 20-30yr old RCBS FL die... Seating depth? Meh... They fit in the mag an ain't stuck in the lands... Group size?.... Under 1MOA.
If you got the money spend what you want if it makes you feel better or you need a fancy widget to help speed things up a lil... I know for me I see a .280 AI on the horizon an that will get a set of bushing dies and some fancy lahpooah brass... My 7-08 I shoot quite a bit is stuck with a Hornady set an still shoots better than me.
Only if they are worth it "to you".
I mostly use Lee's because they are "cheap" plus a couple Hornady's because they had the caliber I wanted (next cheapest).
I hunt my rifles plus do some plinking so don't need "minute of gnat wing accuracy", plus I use cheap brass (mostly scounged) - bambi don't seem to mind.
So "for me" dropping extra bucks on dies would have little benefit. My 30.06 is 60 years old and probably hasn't seen 200 rounds over it's lifetime - using hi-end dies would have added 1.50 to each round it has ever fired just in the die cost..
I mostly use Lee's because they are "cheap" plus a couple Hornady's because they had the caliber I wanted (next cheapest).
I hunt my rifles plus do some plinking so don't need "minute of gnat wing accuracy", plus I use cheap brass (mostly scounged) - bambi don't seem to mind.
So "for me" dropping extra bucks on dies would have little benefit. My 30.06 is 60 years old and probably hasn't seen 200 rounds over it's lifetime - using hi-end dies would have added 1.50 to each round it has ever fired just in the die cost..
thank you for all the opinions guys...this is kind of what I had thought on the dies...I think that I will find a reasonable priced RCBI set or something and if I start seeing a need or feel that I am shooting better than my gun/reloads (can't see that happening any time soon) then i can splurge then when I might actually notice a difference. till then i will just check the OAL with callipers and fine tune as needed. although I think I will spend a little bit more on the Lapua brass...if for no other reason than I have heard that they can last many more reloads than other brands and might cost a little bit more but are comparable at least.
Chinbullco
Regular
- Location
- NW Alberta
Whidden Gunworks dies are the latest choice of many competitive shooters. Reasonably priced, even for custom dies. Uses Wilson/Redding bushings. I have a couple sets of their custom dies for wildcat cartridges of my own design. they work great. The very best dies I've used are Neil Jones, very expensive at first, price of dies worth it when life of brass is extended. Send him fired cartridges from your chamber, the dies are built for your chamber, not SAMMI spec.
Hotwheels81
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- South of GP
A fancy $300 set of dies won't do ya much good anyway without the tools to measure the case and bullet runout anyway (that the fancy $300 die is supposed to all but eliminate)....
Quite the conundrum eh? Buy fancy dies to eliminate a problem that can only be measured by more fancy tools that the fancy die is supposed to eliminate... Or buy a few fancy measuring tools and cheap dies to see if there is a problem that needs correcting to begin with.... See what I'm getting at?
Also I highly suggest a neck turning tool... Just to clean em up really... You wouldn't think that a neck being .002 thicker on one side is a big deal... But it really is... Even in a factory chamber... If your buying Lapua brass then probably won't need it buuuut if your going to use any factory cases they often need all the help they can get.
Kind of suspect anything for .338 Lapua is going to cost more. Dies will most likely be a special order thing through any shop too. However, you do not need to spend $300 for any die to reload good ammo. Those $50 RCBS dies will do nicely.
The dies used has nothing to do with case life. Case life is determined by the load used.
The dies used has nothing to do with case life. Case life is determined by the load used.
What it boils down to is how anal you are about accuracy and eliminating every issue that will have a negative effect on accuracy.
If you are shooting a hunting rifle and your shots will just about always be under 300meters then there isn't a good reason to pay for premium dies. The same goes for the 338 Lapua as it does for a 308Win.
Now, where it gets really critical is when you have a long range or match rifle purpose built to shoot extremely tight groups or take out the X ring at any range. When you go out and spend anywhere from $5000 and up to $15,000 on your dream rifle that will shoot the hair of a gnats ass without harming the gnat then taking a chamber cast and shipping it to a specialty die maker to have a set of dies made up that produce ammo with absolutely zero run out on every reload is a very cheap part of the equation and well worth the money even if it's only for the piece of mind you get from eliminating another symptom that may cause inconsistent accuracy.
Then of course, you will have to ascertain that your press is true to its axis line as well. An offset ram to the die can cause negative issues as well when you are worried about 1/100 moa accuracy.
Back in the day, most of the die makers would produce such dies at a premium of course. I still have a set of 308Win "Bonanza" small base match dies made on special order as well as a set of 6.5x55 dies made by the same company. At the same time I also had a special shell holder made. I only have one press, a trued RCBS JR, that is up to the task of putting together ammo with very little if any run out. So many variables that will cause run out it is almost impossible to eliminate all of them. Slightly different ogives are usually the culprit.
Now such dies are prohibitively expensive although given the expenses incurred making them it is understandable.
Unless you are anal about eliminating an issue that causes inconsistent groups you certainly don't need those specialty dies. The set of 308Win small base dies I mentioned above combined with a very cheap LEE hand held press produced ammo every bit as good as the Wilson dies and an Arbor Press. Guess which set I took to the ranges/matches with me.
If you are shooting a hunting rifle and your shots will just about always be under 300meters then there isn't a good reason to pay for premium dies. The same goes for the 338 Lapua as it does for a 308Win.
Now, where it gets really critical is when you have a long range or match rifle purpose built to shoot extremely tight groups or take out the X ring at any range. When you go out and spend anywhere from $5000 and up to $15,000 on your dream rifle that will shoot the hair of a gnats ass without harming the gnat then taking a chamber cast and shipping it to a specialty die maker to have a set of dies made up that produce ammo with absolutely zero run out on every reload is a very cheap part of the equation and well worth the money even if it's only for the piece of mind you get from eliminating another symptom that may cause inconsistent accuracy.
Then of course, you will have to ascertain that your press is true to its axis line as well. An offset ram to the die can cause negative issues as well when you are worried about 1/100 moa accuracy.
Back in the day, most of the die makers would produce such dies at a premium of course. I still have a set of 308Win "Bonanza" small base match dies made on special order as well as a set of 6.5x55 dies made by the same company. At the same time I also had a special shell holder made. I only have one press, a trued RCBS JR, that is up to the task of putting together ammo with very little if any run out. So many variables that will cause run out it is almost impossible to eliminate all of them. Slightly different ogives are usually the culprit.
Now such dies are prohibitively expensive although given the expenses incurred making them it is understandable.
Unless you are anal about eliminating an issue that causes inconsistent groups you certainly don't need those specialty dies. The set of 308Win small base dies I mentioned above combined with a very cheap LEE hand held press produced ammo every bit as good as the Wilson dies and an Arbor Press. Guess which set I took to the ranges/matches with me.
Below a modified RCBS full length resizing die, It has a Lee lock ring with rubber o-ring and a Forster expander unit that floats. I'm using a 42 year old Rockchucker press that has a little slop in it and I'm using Redding competition shell holders.
The Lee lock ring is only tightened finger tight and this allows the die to float and self center in the press. (think of a Forster Co-Ax press and its floating dies)
The high mounted Forster expander unit floats and enters the neck while it is held in position by the neck of the die.
The die using the Redding competition shell holders always makes hard contact with the bottom of the die. This removes the press from the equation as far as slop in the press. The die floats on the o-ring and self centers in the press threads and the expander can not pull the case neck off center
This cheap modification to a standard RCBS die produces sized cases with .001 or less neck runout without spending big bucks.
The Lee lock ring is only tightened finger tight and this allows the die to float and self center in the press. (think of a Forster Co-Ax press and its floating dies)
The high mounted Forster expander unit floats and enters the neck while it is held in position by the neck of the die.
The die using the Redding competition shell holders always makes hard contact with the bottom of the die. This removes the press from the equation as far as slop in the press. The die floats on the o-ring and self centers in the press threads and the expander can not pull the case neck off center
This cheap modification to a standard RCBS die produces sized cases with .001 or less neck runout without spending big bucks.
