Rem 700 long leade issue

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IMR4320

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So this is nothing new but I am looking for a solution to this issue. Remington 700 chambers tend to have longer leades to the rifling than other manufacturers. On my 308 Winchester the bullet's ogive starts to touch the rifling at about 2.900" over all length depending on the batch of bullets( it fluctuates .005 + or -). The factory ammo specs are actually 2.800". For precision reloaders, the recommended free run of the bullet to the rifling is .020-.040 although I know many reloaders go for less or even let it touch. Now if I want to be somewhere from .015 - .030 to be safe but at the same time maintain accuracy, my 700's chamber does not let me to do that because I would have to build a round that would be on the average 2.880" long again depending on the batch of bullets, which has 2 very basic problems. One, my detachable Magpul magazine starts getting very tight and the second, there is very little bit of bullet's body being held in the case. For information, I have 20" barrel with 1/12 twist and load 168 gr. HPBT bullet. I currently build rounds at 2.855" OAL which puts me to the maximum limit of for the cartridge to stay safely together even with a little bit of a crimp but my free run is still about .045 - .050.
Is the only solution to shave off a little bit of the barrel and re-chamber for shorter leade or is there any other way to fix this problem ? The barrel does not appear to be shot out, nor do I load hot loads but this is not the first Rem 700 chamber with very long leade I have seen.
Thanks for any input.
 
so long as the bullet will stick in the neck your okay, the 2.800 length from the reloading manuals is nothing more then the length that will fit in every rifle magazine, this may be really short for OAL in your chamber but it will fit in the mag. If you load your ammo at a OAL of 2.980 because that's where your rifling is in relation to the bullet it's not a issue, the round however may not fit in the magazine if you need a repeater and sometimes will not eject from the rifle without removing the bolt.
 
Remington chambers are designed by their lawyers. The long lead accommodates ammo loaded too hot.

If it was my rifle I would find a longer bullet (190 gr SMK) and shoot it without the mag.

A gunsmith could take the barrel off and shorten it by a half inch and rechamber with a good match chamber. But that would cost $.
 
I have the same issue with my rem700's. my rem700 .308 will shoot .3 moa with 168SMK with a COL of 2.800 with the long leade. my conclusion is that this situation is not a problem. I will take this accuracy, and not alter the gun.
 
The throat in my Savage .223 with a 1 in 9 twist is longer than the throats in my AR15 rifles. (.0500 vs .0566)

HOLLIGER ON .223/5.56 CHAMBERS (the longer the throat the longer and heavier the bullet can be)
http://www.radomski.us/njhp/cart_tech.htm

And Weatherby rifles also have longer throats so the ammo can be loaded "warmer" and keep pressures normal.
 
bigedp51 said:
The throat in my Savage .223 with a 1 in 9 twist is longer than the throats in my AR15 rifles. (.0500 vs .0566)

HOLLIGER ON .223/5.56 CHAMBERS (the longer the throat the longer and heavier the bullet can be)
http://www.radomski.us/njhp/cart_tech.htm
Click to expand...

I was involved with that. I pressured Savage to bring out a faster twist barrel than the standard 1:12. I wanted a 1:8. They made up some 1:9s for me to test with Sierra 80s. I reported they would work, if loaded hot.

As for chamber, I wanted them to use the Wylde design (SAAMI minimum body with a long throat). They went with a SAAMI minimum body with a NATO throat.

So I would have expected your Savage and AR-15 to be similar.
 
Ganderite said:
I was involved with that. I pressured Savage to bring out a faster twist barrel than the standard 1:12. I wanted a 1:8. They made up some 1:9s for me to test with Sierra 80s. I reported they would work, if loaded hot.

As for chamber, I wanted them to use the Wylde design (SAAMI minimum body with a long throat). They went with a SAAMI minimum body with a NATO throat.

So I would have expected your Savage and AR-15 to be similar.
Click to expand...

Savage were sure out to lunch when they designed my 6BR LRPV in 12 twist. They put a throat in that was suitable for an 8 twist and 107 grain bullets. However with a 12 twist I can't shoot more than 80 grain. I think somehow the lawyers got involved in that one, or they were just asleep at the switch.
 
I have a 700 Varmint Synthetic 308 I got in about 1993 that also has a long leade, but it shoots brilliantly.
I was out earlier last week when it was quite nice out and had some nice groups. The lower left is 10 shots at 100 yards. RP case, 168 Hornady National Match, 41.5 IMR 4064, 2.820" coal.
The other not so great group to the right is RP case, Hornady 155 A-Max, 44.0 Varget, 2.895" coal.
I have found even with the long throat, you can get pretty decent accuracy with a load the rifle likes.
The other groups are different rifles. I had the range pretty much to myself that day, so I shot a lot betwen target changes.
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I had more decent groups that day as well, but these two just happen to show the best and worst.
 
Interesting, I'm getting here all kind of interesting information. My rifle has no problem achieving .5 MOA, probably averaging .6 MOA but having done .3 as well. It is the occasional fart it has and ruins otherwise nice stretch of shots and minimizing the leade would eliminate that one variable when not all has fit together well and then it shows. I'm reluctant to use heavier bullet because of the 1/12 twist and it may not stabilize heavier bullet enough and at that point not solving anything, never mind I have a load of supplies for 168 bullet setup.
 
IMR4320 said:
Interesting, I'm getting here all kind of interesting information. My rifle has no problem achieving .5 MOA, probably averaging .6 MOA but having done .3 as well. It is the occasional fart it has and ruins otherwise nice stretch of shots and minimizing the leade would eliminate that one variable when not all has fit together well and then it shows. I'm reluctant to use heavier bullet because of the 1/12 twist and it may not stabilize heavier bullet enough and at that point not solving anything, never mind I have a load of supplies for 168 bullet setup.
Click to expand...

Just be careful of the bullets you select. In the Berger line the 185 grain classic hunter is fine with a 12 twist, as is the 175 grain Tactical. Your reloading supplies should work for the heavier bullets, except of course for the bullets!
 
IMR4320 said:
Interesting, I'm getting here all kind of interesting information. My rifle has no problem achieving .5 MOA, probably averaging .6 MOA but having done .3 as well. It is the occasional fart it has and ruins otherwise nice stretch of shots and minimizing the leade would eliminate that one variable when not all has fit together well and then it shows. I'm reluctant to use heavier bullet because of the 1/12 twist and it may not stabilize heavier bullet enough and at that point not solving anything, never mind I have a load of supplies for 168 bullet setup.
Click to expand...

1:12 will handle up to the Sierra 190MK perfectly. This was the standard American Long Range load.
 
My 700P .308 has a long leade as well. I load a 178 HPBT Hornady to 2.317" base to ogive. Sorry I don't have the COAL written in my notes. This put them .030" off the lands and JUST squeezes into Accurate AI mags. They will not fit your Magpul mags. They feed beautifully. I don't recall how deep the shank seats into the neck but IIRC it was close to the shoulder and not at all questionable. The benefit to seating long is reduced pressure. This allows you to run a little more powder without hitting pressure limits as soon as you would at 2.800". My avg mv is 2644 FPS with 42.2 grs H4895/BR2/Lapua cases. With a little more generous case and finding a higher node I think 2700 fps may be doable with the 178 but I'm happy where its at and better case life. Hopefully you find some of this helpful, the long leade can be a blessing once you put together the right combo.
 
All the more reason to use long action (standard length) cartridges in Remington rifles. Then instead in complaining that the leade is too long or the mag too short you can do a Goldilocks and find it just right for your handloads.
 
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