Remington 700 or savage 10

[Mystic Precision]

Test work up for the customer rifle in an Oryx chassis rifle in 6.5 CM... prefit match barrel swap. Firing pin spring swap. NO other mods to the rifle

Timney should be announcing a trigger at SHOT.... Be interesting to see what SHOT brings

I rather choose an action with excellent function and accuracy that doesn't need a bucket of money to get working..... For me, more then enough parts for what I want to do.

Jerry

 

[kthomas]

I definitely agree with your last paragraph - it's why I always recommend Tikka for a more budget rifle. IMO, it's the best value proposition in this sport. Quality action that feels and functions great, tight enough tolerances that shouldered pre-fits can be spun up for it, and amazing aftermarket support that continues to grow. They also shoot extremely well out of the box.

No matter which way you go, there's compromises. For the Tikka, it's the OEM stocks, the bolt stop can be a weak point, and the factory barrels, while great shooters, are generally on the slower side. They also used to have a gorilla that torqued the barrels on at the factory, but I think he's since retired. For the R783, it's weak aftermarket support, which would be a deal breaker for me. For Big green and Savage in general, it's poor quality with high chance of getting a "Friday gun".

There's lots of great options these days. Don't discount Howa or Bergara as well. Determine what you want in an action, and what the pro's and compromises are for each action you are considering. There's no free lunch. Thankfully with most modern manufacturing practices, most guns are pretty decent shooters out of the factory, compared to what they used to be. It's other factors, like quality, features and aftermarket support that end up becoming the bigger differentiators.

 

[Mystic Precision]

Rem 783s are NOT made in New York... and that has made a world of difference.

My ongoing dimensional tests have now reached 15 SA receivers... produced over at least 3 yrs... likely 4yrs. So far, all good. This is a testament to proper CNC manufacturing... and QC

Factory firing pin springs of old were crap... swap them out asap. Haven't beat on new gen actions enough to see if they have finally spent the extra 50 cents????

The last 2 builds, I just swapped out the springs cause that is grief no one needs.

Beyond that, current gen actions are smoother then mine of 3 yrs ago... and mine broke in to be pretty darn smooth. These are the new HB versions with the varmint style bolt handle... a far better knob vs the gawd awful flattened ones

If Rem will ever move all manf to these inland factories, QC of the 700 may return to bygone years. Right now, if you want to use a "700" for the aftermarket options, just start with a custom action... you will likely be money ahead in the long run.

As a many year Savage fan, I am saddened to not include it on my list of preferred AICS mag fed factory donor actions to use. I have given up trying to figure out how many variants are considered 110 or 10 AND still are considered short actions. I have never seen so many versions of the 'same thing' at one time in the same year of production. And I definitely do not like some of the cost cutting measures they have applied... A 110/10 should not be an upscale Axis

This will likely cause alot of tempers to flair, but as much as I like the T3 as a hunting receiver, I would not recommend it as an AICS factory mag donor for prs type applications. The final rifle can be incredibly accurate though... but that is not why it is not on my list.

Haven't spent enough time with either HOWA/Wby Vanguard or Bergara to offer an opinion.

Consider that very few factory rifles are fully compatible with AICS or AW mags. Again, a very good reason to lean on custom actions that are... or the odd factory rifle that is.

Jerry

 

[kthomas]

Curious as to why you don't recommend a Tikka T3 with AICS mags.

Plenty of people (into the thousands in the US and abroad), run AICS mags in their Tikka T3 rifles, when paired up with a chassis such as the ones KRG offers, and very successfully.

I haven't heard of any compatibility issues with T3's and AICS mags when paired up in chassis that accepts AICS pattern mags.

And I agree with your statement on R700 action vs custom. Much better value starting off with a custom then doing work to a R700, even if it means spending more money from the get go.

And AW mags are almost always a "miss" with any actions beyond the ones they were designed for (AI's).

 

[Mystic Precision]

I’ve owned both and find my 783 better than both.
Only issue is lack of aftermarket support.

Keep an eye on any irratic ignitions or WTF's... it may very well be the firing pin spring. I have swapped out the spring in every action I have worked on cause they have failed in use.

Simple job, WOLFF Rem 700 SA 24lbs spring. I prefer to chop a few coils off the 700 length but can be used full length if desired.

Problem solved.

Jerry

 

[Mystic Precision]

For those interested in the HOWA/Wby V action, Gavin of Ultimate Reloader has just completed his build. Shooting great and looking great.

Some Canadian products in the mix including the IBI fluted barrel and my MPOD.

FYI, HOWAGE prefits are also possible so no worries on metric threads. Feedback I have received from well informed sources rate this action very highly and I like the integral recoil lug.

Jerry

 

[kthomas]

I've seen nothing but decent reports of the Howa's. Bergara as well. Growing aftermarket support for Howa, but it's not to the levels of Tikka. Bergara has the advantage of being an R700 footprint and the ability to take accessories such as R700 triggers.

Great time for precision rifle shooters, good options available at every level these days.

 

[Mystic Precision]

XXw.ammoland.com/2017/11/ab-arms-modx-gen-iii-modular-rifle-system-remington-model-783-sa/#axzz6Bayw4qx8

This popped up on a recent search... I have no connection with AB Arms in the US.

Jerry

 

[rdavidson]

r700

 

[kthomas]

This will likely cause alot of tempers to flair, but as much as I like the T3 as a hunting receiver, I would not recommend it as an AICS factory mag donor for prs type applications. The final rifle can be incredibly accurate though... but that is not why it is not on my list.

Haven't spent enough time with either HOWA/Wby Vanguard or Bergara to offer an opinion.

Consider that very few factory rifles are fully compatible with AICS or AW mags. Again, a very good reason to lean on custom actions that are... or the odd factory rifle that is.

Jerry

Here's a thread with 6,569 posts, all dedicated to the Tikka T3. Lots of people in there using their Tikka T3's with AICS mags and in PRS type disciplines. All pretty happy.

There's some pretty nicely dressed up Tikka's in here, in all sorts of configurations from lightweight hunting guns to full on PRS rigs for those that want some ideas on what you can do with your Tikka's and what sort of accessories are available for it:

http://forum.snipershide.com/threads/tikka-t3-thread.6252615/page-132#post-8241214

I'm not sure what you know about Tikka T3's that these people don't, that would make you not want to use it as the base action for a PRS type build. All I've seen is a whole bunch of success stories, the Tikka T3 platform is really blowing up and getting popular down in the US and abroad.

ETA: even some very popular and credible gunsmiths, along with professional precision rifle trainers (who see thousands of rifles of all budgets come through their classes) praise the Tikka T3 platform highly as an excellent budget PRS and precision rifle option.

 

[kthomas]

This guy in Finland has a nice Instagram page full of Tikka T3's done up:

https://www.instagram.com/passion_f...d&ig_mid=375FE737-8D57-4D2A-886F-5DED840A86AA

 

[Flash]

Personally I would save up a few more pennies and go straight to Tikka. Skip Remington and Savage, the quality coming out of there these days is junk.

Besides being higher quality, Tikka's have a good track record for being good shooters out of the box, and the aftermarket support is getting really strong for Tikka, so you can dress up a Tikka as you evolve with the sport. It's a good base to build off of and adapt with you, with high enough quality that you won't want to sell it later like you would a Savage or Remington.

Another bonus is pre-fit shouldered barrels are becoming more popular for Tikka's. They are built to a high enough quality that the headspace is consistent enough for gunsmiths and barrel manufacturers to offer shouldered prefits. You don't get that with Savage or Remington.

OP:" Which first car do I buy, Chev or Ford?"

CGN members:" Save your money for a Lexus man. Don't waste your time learning what you like and don't like on anything entry level inexpensive."
"No, have a custom Lambo built. Best value out there."

 

[kthomas]

Just merely another option.

Personally, if I was out shopping for Chevy's and I found a vehicle that cost 20% more but was much better performing and higher quality, I would want to know about it.

My posts as always are my personal opinion. I personally believe that a Tikka is a much better value proposition then a R700 or a Savage, even though the up front costs are a bit higher. But it gives you a higher quality platform to grow into, with the capability of "dressing it up" as your shooting evolves. It has a lot of great aftermarket support that affords you that ability.

Alternatively, I have a hard time recommending Savage and Remington these days as the quality coming out of those companies is pretty poor, to put it mildly. I just don't think it's a good platform to start on any more.

But at the end of the day, it's up to the OP to decide how much money they want to spend, and where they personally see the best value. Having more options to consider is never a bad thing.

 

[powerbaitron]

Savage 10TR will outshoot alot of custom 700’s it has come across. The 5R rifling, pillar bedded stock and accutrigger will get you under .5 moa with reloads or FGMM.

They are ugly - but they shoot. How accurate do you need to be? If you want .3 moa, it may be a thousand more...

 

[rifleman762]

Savage 10TR will outshoot alot of custom 700’s it has come across. The 5R rifling, pillar bedded stock and accutrigger will get you under .5 moa with reloads or FGMM.

They are ugly - but they shoot. How accurate do you need to be? If you want .3 moa, it may be a thousand more...

I recently got a borescope and scoped all my rifles and spare barrels. Most Savage barrels are chock-full of reamer marks but the 10 TR barrel was really nice. Coincidence? I don't think so. My very accurate Savage 300 WM also has a very smooth barrel. My Savage 243 and 223 barrels that don't want to shoot under 1 MOA with anything are just terrible. Almost as bad as an Anderson AR15 barrel. My Green Mountain and Faxon barrels are even smoother than the good Savage barrels, which surprised me considering their budget price.

Unfortunately, I don't own any Remington, Tikka, or Howa rifles so I can't scope those for comparison. Just old rifles. It was interesting seeing cut rifling on my old 9.3x62 Mauser.

I should start a borescope photo thread .

 

[mikeelliot]

Not sure if you mentioned a budget? A 20" HB I would say pick up a Tikka CTR. Will shoot better than you new or used. No "need" to upgrade

 

[ArmedGinger]

The only thing I dislike about the Savage 10TR are the magazines. I just hate that cheap Savage magazine system.

 

[Aprilia Man]

Been thinking about getting in game, and looks to me that a modest start is a Savage model 10 or a Remington 700 (probably sps) I’m looking for a 20” HB

Which would you choose?

Buy once, cry once ? ..... >>> https://pgwdti.com/product/m15-barreled-action/

 

[MartyK2500]

For a cheap accurate shooter Savage hands down.
In fact I’m playing with a Savage 10 HS precision lately, all factory setup nothing modded, never seen a factory as is rifle that accurate in my life.
The 550$ I paid for it on the EE are the best money’s worth I’ve ever seen in my life!

 

[Wild_Thing]

I have a Savage 111FXCP3 in .30-06 that I purchased as a truck rifle back when you could get Norinco SKS's for $75. I find it to be very accurate for an elcheapo, mass-produced rifle.