Remington going bankrupt again
- Thread starter mbogo3
- Start date
The biggest problem is NOT the rifle, but the user. If one always watches where the muzzle is pointing, no injuries or fatalities would have occurred.
Honestly, this so-called "unsafe" trigger system has been literally beaten to death. I have owned Remington 700 since they were first released
in the early 1960's, and I have owned probably close to 100 of them, but strangely, my rifles have never injured nor killed any human.....game animals,
on the other hand.
Dave.
Just a couple questions. Wouldn't a socialist system be obliged to channel through a government as the mechanism of it's implementation for the society at large? So not necessarily a perversion of the system? And wouldn't capitalism at it's extreme ultimately result in a continual attempt at growth that finally ends with all the assets controlled by one huge entity, like Amazon? After all the buyouts are finished?
I do agree the govt does create many of the problems but their corrupt administration of the laws is still a product of selling out to the highest bidder. Basic human greed combined with the authority to pursue it, as it were. Yes that debate of capitalism/communism does distract from the oppression of govt but the govt does not operate in a vacuum. It is a body of corrupt greedy people swayed by the dollars where ever they may come from. In my part of the world 3 large family corporations hold huge sway on our governance and have done so for many years. Thus they are awarded with monopoly like status
Market saturation may be the problem.
Winchester and Colt and S&W have all gone through this as well.
The old saying that no one ever owns a rifle but only leases it for a lifetime applies.
There are tens of thousands of used rifles out there selling at less than half of new rifle prices. Quality of most older ones IMHO is better than new.
Lots of new players getting into the game as well.
Winchester and Colt and S&W have all gone through this as well.
The old saying that no one ever owns a rifle but only leases it for a lifetime applies.
There are tens of thousands of used rifles out there selling at less than half of new rifle prices. Quality of most older ones IMHO is better than new.
Lots of new players getting into the game as well.
Cameron SS
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Ground Zero
Socialism inherently results in non-voluntary wealth transfer, ie theft. People don't generally tolerate theft from other people, which also includes corporations. Detecting the theft might be a challenge, but once detected personal and corporate theft is generally despised.
Government is really the only entity which can commit the mass the theft necessary to sustain socialist wealth redistribution for any length of time. While personal theft is not tolerated, people will quickly given in to coercion, usually disguised as nationalism, when it is the state doing the theft. Further, because peoples economic literacy is so poor. states will often outsource the theft to so called 'private' central banks to do the theft through inflation.
Capitalism as its extreme has zero state intervention in the market place. In such a system, hegemonic monopolies like amazon or facebook or apple simply aren't possible.
Big corporations are inherently inefficient. They require greater coordination, larger over heads, significantly more complicated business plans, greater degrees of systemic risk etc. Only when governments subsidize these things, or create significant barriers to entering the market can such corporations achieve monopoly status. If you lift the corporate veil you will find that there has never been a a significant corporate monopoly that wasn't significantly supported by government.
If you want to complain about Canada's big three telecommunications companies and their monopoly on telecommunications services, just call CRTC and ask them whats required to get an operators license to compete.
Virtually all licensing regimes, for all industries everywhere create barriers to entry that stifle competition. Consider supply management in the dairy industry. All of our massive corporate farms that manage to always get visa for foreign workers paid well below minimum wage, while independent owner operator farms just can't seem to get approved.
There was a great documentary a while back about the chicken industry, a chicken farmer that tried scaling up to compete with the big boys, and the obstacles they ran into.
Start ups will always be more agile, more responsive, with better newer products and lower costs and over heads. Whenever some corporation gets big and rich with a good idea, in a capitalist economy there will quickly be a swarm of start ups eating into the profits and market share of the corporation. Only when the state intervenes to squeeze out those competitors can you get an amazon or a google.
Problem isn't that there are bidders trying to buy power, or that greed motivates people to accumulate more. The problem is that there is a system of power that can be bought, and when you buy it, you get to play with a special set of rules that virtually guarantees your continued success at everyone elses expense.
I'll bet those 3 large families have a revolving door relationship with big corporations, big banks, and big politics.
Rockmcdock
New member
- Location
- Calgary, AB
Eagleye, I respect the way you handle firearms, and I am glad you have had good experiences with the 700. But in some cases, the users are not responsible for guns inadvertently going off, even if they are still responsible for where the gun always points. These are not the same thing. My hunting buddy’s father has an older 700 bought new in the 1970s. It has twice gone off with the safety on and no finger on the trigger. No one was hurt because the user was acting safely, but that didn’t keep the rifle from behaving badly. If I owned a 700, I would immediately get the trigger replaced. Even if I always handle my weapons safely, having a rifle with a safety that has an earned reputation for not preventing the gun from inadvertently firing with the safety on and the trigger not touched, is risking more than I want to risk. Why would anyone risk this?
Nothing wrong with remington products. The 700, 783, 1100, and 870 are great rifles/shotguns. Problem is the people running the company. And as for the posts above youre full of BS....funny how everyone knows someone who has a 700 that randomly fires without a finger on the trigger
The biggest problem is NOT the rifle, but the user. If one always watches where the muzzle is pointing, no injuries or fatalities would have occurred.
Honestly, this so-called "unsafe" trigger system has been literally beaten to death. I have owned Remington 700 since they were first released
in the early 1960's, and I have owned probably close to 100 of them, but strangely, my rifles have never injured nor killed any human.....game animals,
on the other hand.
Yeah....and a lot of Boeing 737 MAX's landed safely, unless you were one of those 346 people....when they didn't....
Rockmcdock
New member
- Location
- Calgary, AB
I’ve known and hunted with my friend and his dad and four other members of their family numerous times since 1987. Very safe hunters all. They, along with hundreds of others have stopped using their 700s or had the triggers changed out—for free, by Remington—because of what they have experienced. I, too, have Remingtons—three 870s and a semi-auto .30-06. But when it comes to 700s, being wise and safe about a gun that has been shown many times to have a trigger/safety problem, including the incidents my friends experienced, doesn’t make me full of B.S., or stupid, or paranoid, it makes me a safer hunter than I otherwise would be. Those who have been killed and injured, or who have killed or injured someone else because of a faulty trigger/safety, don’t think it’s funny at all, nor do my friends who thankfully saw no one injured, but whose guns fired inadvertently. It’s not a big deal to change out the triggers, and then 700 owners have a great rifle. I hope they do.
Cocked&Locked
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- S. Ontario
Your entire statement is very thought provoking, and summed up ^^^ extremely well.
Rockmcdock
New member
- Location
- Calgary, AB
I understand that this is the case with almost everyone, and I am really glad for you it is your experience. But the logic is the same with many things. I have driven millions of miles and never been involved in a fatal accident. It can still be a dangerous activity. Millions of Ford Pintos back in the day were involved in rear end collisions, and they didn’t explode. Millions of Ford Explorers were driven on Bridgestone tires and didn’t roll over. Thousands (probably millions?) of Samsung phones were used wIthout their batteries catching on fire. All of my 12 aunts and uncles smoked cigarettes; none died of lung cancer. Etc., etc. We tend to think our experience negates all the other incidents where something did go wrong because of a real problem, and we ignore a genuine issue, playing the odds that the faulty issue won’t happen to us because it hasn’t so far. The odds of someone’s (your) Remington 700 inadvertently going off are very very small. But out of the 7,000,000 or so that have been sold, a certain percentage are getting older, are dirty and maybe just the slightest bit rusty, and in some cases the way they are designed can (and does, and has) caused the guns to fire with the safety’s on and no one pulling the trigger. That’s not hearsay, rumour, or someone’s BS, it’s just a fact, and I personally hunt with someone to whom it has happened. The easiest and safest thing to do is change out the trigger/safety, and then everything is good, and it’s free from Remington through their recall program. So, the guy two doors down from me is right now selling his 700 at a good price. I may buy it, and if I do, I the first thing I will do is get a new trigger and safety installed, if it hasn’t been done already.
The big issue I have with those lawsuits is the death and injury involved .
The rifle was blamed for killing and/or maiming when the point is that unsafe gun handling was the cause NOT the gun going off .
Sweep somebody at a match even with an empty firearm and you are DQ'd for good reason .
There is no reason to point s muzzle in the direction of s person unless it is intentional .
I have seen other rifles discharge when thr safety was released and it wa because they were not adjusted properly , but the rifle was always pointed in a safe direction
Cat
