IchBinEinSniper
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Brockvegas
Your right, everytime a customer complains about a product, it must be their own lack of knowledge or experience, not the product being crappy...
Remington shotguns going down hill?
- Thread starter Turkeyslayer 1300
- Start date
Your right, everytime a customer complains about a product, it must be their own lack of knowledge or experience, not the product being crappy...
Right. I guess that would explain everyone here including me that has noted the downward sprial of Remington products in the last twenty years.
Now if they invaded and our military does not have the power to defend us, that would leave the resistance movement with CGN, and with so many CGNs who own Norincos and so many sponsoring dealers who sell Norincos this would leave them waiting for our weapons to break! eh? Thanks God that all those Cooy's and Savages and CIL's still work
That squeeky wheel is starting to become deafening! and the fact that so many are switching to the norcheapos seems to be proof enough or maybe we need a remington and norincos for dummies
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That's BULL ####!! I personally take very good care of my firearms! We're talking about pump gunz here for gawd sake! They do not have to be babied and scented with sweet smelling oil! I know many with mega gun experience, who in no way are ever gentle with their pumps. The best ones are like timex claims for their watches. "Takes a lickin and keeps on tickin!" Recently it seems that some of the presnt junk hardly makes it out of the store before it craps out! Although I spend a lot of time cleaning some of my gunz, I got an old 870, and a BPS 20 and a 94 that hardly ever get a surface wipe. They seem to thrive on dirt and abuse! Remington deserves their recent reputation!
Here's what you do. Stop buying the fake, and buy the real deal. the 'express' is a dumbed down model of the Wingmaster. Buy the real thing and you get real Remington performance.
Kris....owns 2 wingmasters....never had a problem feeding them that couldn't be solved with a few drops of rem oil.
Kris....owns 2 wingmasters....never had a problem feeding them that couldn't be solved with a few drops of rem oil.
Since you assume that they have like and dislikes, I will assume that as well! Real shot guns do not really give a #### and they are not afraid of or have a break down at the sight of it. Most of the new Remingtons can not handle it when they are forced to leave the serenity of the cardboard box.
So you have had problems with those 2 wingmasters that needed to be solved?
I have has a few wingmasters, and still have one that I can not make malfunction. Modern or present day wingmasters are only a slight bit better than the express. I think that the old wingmasters that were originally chambered for 2 3/4 inch functioned better than those that are now chambered for 3 inch.
Any pump on the planet will have problems feeding if you beat it up, leave it dirty and don't oil it.
The only problem I have had with both of them is that after a hard workout, the actions get a bit sticky. Normal. Let em cool and feed em some oil.
Treat your guns right, and they'll do the same for you.
The only problem I have had with both of them is that after a hard workout, the actions get a bit sticky. Normal. Let em cool and feed em some oil.
Treat your guns right, and they'll do the same for you.
- Location
- Guelph, Ontario
That squeeky wheel is starting to become deafening! and the fact that so many are switching to the norcheapos seems to be proof enough or maybe we need a remington and norincos for dummies
Again this is anecdotal. I heard that... He said this...etc Is there a single 3rd party objective survey which tracks product quality for guns? I have yet to hear anyone reference one. Until that happens there is nothing wrong with Remington, Winchester or anything else.
You know what there should be a buyers guide to rifles/Shotguns like there is for cars. Published annually and it shows quality levels/improvements of the various manufacturers and makes/models. That would probably make someone a lot of money and make them very influential among the firearms community. Any takers?
The reason people are flocking to Norincos is because instead of paying 360.00-400.00 for an 870 express they can get the same thing from Marstar for 250.00. That represents a substantial cost reduction of almost 30%. That is why people are buying them and not because Remington quality isnt what it used to be.
Bought the Rem Max Gobbler last Feb. and nothing but good to say about. You could build it aftermarket yourself, but I think this combo shows some innovation and thinkin' outside the "box" on Remington's part. Does everything the promo claims, great to hold, good sights, adjustable length of pull and sig recoil reduction with 3.5" Turk loads and Challenger slugs. Also own Beretta, Benelli, Browning, AYA, don't have a particular brand loyalty. Shot 2 Gobblers last spring and going to set it up for slugs and buckshot this fall. Plus it's cool lookin'
And when the Zombies do come......
And when the Zombies do come......
Hi-Standard
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Republic of Newfoundland
I agree with you to a point manbearpig, but it's not that consumers aren't demanding better quality IMHO, it's because we, and I'm guilty too, are too God Damned cheap to spend the money. Labour rates and material costs are throught the roof, and I'd say that to produce a Wingmaster from the 60's or 70's quality at todays cost could be about 2 grand! Who is willing to pay 2 large for a Wingmaster? It's all a vicious cycle. We damand a better standard of living, so up goes the wages. When the wages go up then so does everything else, including income tax so now we are bringing home less of our money, so we demand even higher wages to compensate. To top it all off, Remington and all of the other manufactures must compete with foreign made firearms from countries which pay their employees less money. What is the solution? Step one; Government slams foreign manufactures with stiff import tax. This drives the price of their guns up. Step two; The domestic makers can increase their prices accordingly to improve quality and still pay a decient wage. Step three; we spend more money for quality firearms, because we have no choice. Unfortunatly we will have to be a little more sellective in out purchases, since we(I) would not be able to afford as many guns
I do actually clean most of my gunz, and a never beat them up, but I usually do not oil my pumps and autos and I use grease on bearing points of my doubles. The only oil that my pumps ever get is what is left of the cleaning process as one of the products has a light lubricant. I found out long ago if you feed em oil that they will get sticky as you say, and needed to be fed to keep em going. 5 shots or 500 my pumps never stick. I used to feed em a little oil and only found that with lots of shooting they get gunky and needed more oil to un stick em.
I only got onto this cleaning BS because some one excused the crap that Remington makes on inexperience and lack of know how when it comes to cleaning. Most of the problem with the present 870s, wingmasters included, happen within the first box. Most of the problem seem to be rough parts and very rough chambers where no amount of oil will cure.
The only thing I blame on inexperienmce is that many just do not remember a time when there were quality Remingtons out there and confuse the fact that they got one that is still working after a few seasons as being good and do not realize that they may the exception to an inferiour product and not the norm.
I am curiuos....what issues did you have with your Remington Marine Magnum? I just bought a MM with the electroless nickel plating and find that the finish is very durable and the action is smooth as silk. For a top of the line Express model I find the quality acceptable.Then you haven't seen the Marine Magnum that I used to have
I do actually clean most of my gunz, and a never beat them up, but I usually do not oil my pumps and autos and I use grease on bearing points of my doubles. The only oil that my pumps ever get is what is left of the cleaning process as one of the products has a light lubricant. I found out long ago if you feed em oil that they will get sticky as you say, and needed to be fed to keep em going. 5 shots or 500 my pumps never stick. I used to feed em a little oil and only found that with lots of shooting they get gunky and needed more oil to un stick em.
I only got onto this cleaning BS because some one excused the crap that Remington makes on inexperience and lack of know how when it comes to cleaning. Most of the problem with the present 870s, wingmasters included, happen within the first box. Most of the problem seem to be rough parts and very rough chambers where no amount of oil will cure.
The only thing I blame on inexperience is that many just do not remember a time when there were quality Remingtons out there and confuse the fact that they got one that is still working after a few seasons as being good and do not realize that they may the exception to an inferior product and not the norm.
I'm guilty too, are too God Damned cheap to spend the money.
Unfortunatly we will have to be a little more sellective in out purchases, since we(I) would not be able to afford as many guns
I would expect that a day's wages should supply a day's needs or equivalent.
Not being able to afford is a reality today and not being able to afford is in no way the same as too God Damned cheap. The later get what they deserve.
As a business Remington has to delivery money to shareholders.
However, Tikka and Savage are hitting Remington's rifle market really hard. Moss is eating low end shotgun section. At meaning time, I don't see Remington doing anything to open new territory except making the super stupid Remington air-gun.
That left them no way but to squeeze either employee or supplier, or both.
At some point down that road, Remington's quality has to go down, simply because they can't afford the cost to make a good gun.
Just my observation.
However, Tikka and Savage are hitting Remington's rifle market really hard. Moss is eating low end shotgun section. At meaning time, I don't see Remington doing anything to open new territory except making the super stupid Remington air-gun.
That left them no way but to squeeze either employee or supplier, or both.
At some point down that road, Remington's quality has to go down, simply because they can't afford the cost to make a good gun.
Just my observation.
