Rifle Recoil table .45-70 a pussy cat?

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wetcoaster

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I noticed in Chuck Hawks rifle recoil table that he shows the 45-70 shooting 300 and 400 grain pills from a 7 to 7.5 pound gun is similar to shooting a .30'06 with 180 grain pills from an 8 pound gun?

I have not shot a .45-70 so I wouldn't know, but is all the chest pounding and barking from guide gun owners about how they can handle the recoil from their big thumpers just allot of bunk? Is it true that it is more of a pussy.........cat cartridge?:D

http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
 
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Recoil

:rolleyes: I own three 306's (Tikka T3, Winchester 70, Reminton 7400) and 2 Marlin 45-70's (1895SS and 1895G). Very comparable recoil except for the 1895G due to the shorter barrel. It is ported but still kicks. I use the 45-70 's for bear, although the Winchester and the Tikka have taken bears. The Marlins are fast and quick to point with fast follow up shots. The Remington is the carbine model with the 18 1/2 " barrel similar to the size of the 1895G but it weighs more. The semi auto action of the Remington takes up a lot of the recoil, but it has jammed, not what I take bear hunting:) .
 
I call bull on that, but it greatly depends on the load you're shooting. If you're shooting loads that could be shot in a trapdoor rifle then sure it won't recoil much at all. If those loads are at the top end reaching volocities that close in the the lower scale of .458 Win mag loads then NO WAY is it like shooting 180's from a '06. Fill those cases up and shoot them from a Ruger #1, or something like my rebarelled P-14 and see what the recoil feels like. Although, I'd compare even the top end loads of the 45/70 with 400 grain bullets similar to a 300 Win mag. shot out of my bolt 45/70.
 
For you guys hand loading for the 45-70 what kind of MV are you getting with your average load you are using for hunting?
 
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I run my cast loads under 2,000FPS (around 1,400IIRC), but I shoot black for the most part.
Smokless stuff can run past that a tad, but that's with cup 'n' core bullets, which I do not use for the most part.
I must add that I shoot heavier rifles, not guide guns.
Cat
 
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This is an open invitation to the poster to come to M.T. Chambers' range of horrors, to try for himself some 480gr. WFN Gc Hardcasts @1900 fps from the Marlin, he can fill the "bone box" and test penetration, he would have to cover his own medical expenses of course, if the minus 30 degree weather doesn't do it, the dislocated shoulder and detached retinas will!
 
wetcoaster said:
I noticed in Chuck Hawks rifle recoil table that he shows the 45-70 shooting 300 and 400 grain pills from a 7 to 7.5 pound gun is similar to shooting a .30'06 with 180 grain pills from an 8 pound gun?

I have not shot a .45-70 so I wouldn't know, but is all the chest pounding and barking from guide gun owners about how they can handle the recoil from their big thumpers just allot of bunk? Is it true that it is more of a pussy.........cat cartridge?:D

http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
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I would take whatever I read from that site with a grain of salt.
Chuck Hawks ain't noted for his experiance as much as his "cut and paste" abilities!
cat
 
See what happens, people start talking about "pussy...cats" and the Hat shows up.

It ain't the cartridge that makes all of the difference, a more reliable measure is bullet energy versus rifle weight. Where it comes down to really getting hurt though, stock conformation can be a very big factor.
 
ben hunchak said:
This is an open invitation to the poster to come to M.T. Chambers' range of horrors, to try for himself some 480gr. WFN Gc Hardcasts @1900 fps from the Marlin, he can fill the "bone box" and test penetration, he would have to cover his own medical expenses of course, if the minus 30 degree weather doesn't do it, the dislocated shoulder and detached retinas will!
Click to expand...

Sounds like a barrel load of fun!;) I'm glad to see at least a few of you have a sense of humour!:D

I am thinking of converting a .303 to .45-70 so I have been doing some research on it. Saw the Chuck Hawks table and thought it was pretty funny. My .300 savage is the same, factory loads are loaded way down because of all the old rifles. Are any companies loading the 45-70 in higher pressures? I don't hand load although I should get around to giving it a try someday.
 
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have a look at garrett cartridges 45/70, read the reveiws,the 415 grs full power loads impressed me, i shot some stuff like that from a ruger #3, not fun,i hunted with ,338 win 250 gr bullets the #3 out kicked it in my opinion, i have a guide gun 45/70 i load 405 g.c. rcbs bullets to 1650 fps thats enough for me ,,,,, wade
 
Gatehouse said:
Agreed.

Besides, Chuck Hawks is silly...
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Ain't that the truth. He is a real legend in his own mind!

Just another self-styled 'expert" that quotes the same old tired cliches over and over again and as Cat noted an expert at plagiarism.

To tell the truth the average CGN member is more of an expert than Mr. Hawks.
 
Recoil is a matter of severl factors. Weight of the rifle, design of the stock and recoil pad, velocity of the round and weight of the bullet comes to mind.
Add in method of shooting, ie offf the bench, sitting, standing etc.
Not just a smiple thing.
 
catnthehatt said:
I would take whatever I read from that site with a grain of salt.
Chuck Hawks ain't noted for his experie;) nce as much as his "cut and paste" abilities!
cat
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O.K. sealhunter, wanna chime in on this one?
 
Against my better judgement, why not?

While Chuck Hawks may not be the guru he claims to be, he does take his info, for the most part from fairly reputable places (cut and paste it may be)

His idea of the 45 70 being a pussycat. It is a Pussycat, it can be lion as well, just depends what you feed it,
I will have to say for the most part, being well knowledged in pussies, no pun :D , that my 45 70 even with light loads is still nothing to sneeze at.

I answered the call, now you do the same......

What is your view on Kim du Toit as it relates to firearms?

You know where I am going.:)
 
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45-70

Wetcoaster;

There is a good article on the 45-70 and Ruger Model No. 1 in the latest issue of Outdoor Edge. Do you get that magazine yet? If not, I will try to remember to give "your boss" a copy of that article next week (at work) to give to you.

Gunsmoke
 
sealhunter said:
What is your view on Kim du Toit as it relates to firarms?

You know where I am going.:)
Click to expand...

Okay sealhunter I owe you one, I just read Kim's excellent essay "The pussification of the western male" Talk about nailing it! As time permits I'll read more from his new site, looks very interesting. I'm still laughing at that essay thanx for the heads up.:D
 
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