Ross questions for the Pros!

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Adanac00

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Hello all

I bought this Ross M10 about a year ago when I got it the bolt was stuck as the lugs had turned when the last owner was trying to install it so he put it away for about 15 years until I saw it and convinced him to sell it to me. From there I got the Bolt out but it has been sitting since then as life got really busy with a new house and a new child!

Finally I have made time for this piece of Canadian history but yet I am a little hesitant to take this gun out from reading all the stories so I thought I would post a few pictures for you guys and see what you have to say!

Firstly all I truly know is that it is a Ross M 10 but other then that I am not to sure about much else!
Hopefully you guys can point me in the right direction and give me some pointers
Thanks for your time

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FORGET "all the stories", friend. Like the daily newspaper, only about 10% of them are true, anyway.

ONE of those true stories has to do with the tremendous strength of the 1910 Ross action. This one is very true. The action was tried at the factory for over 125000 psi pressure and didn't let go. The reason they stopped the test was that they could not build any more pressure with the powders they had. The tested action worked perfectly after the test. This is about 3 TIMES the working pressure of the .303 cartridge, double the working pressure of the massive .280 Ross round (for which this action was designed). You have no troubles there. By the way, modern rifles are factory-tested with a load developing 30% above working pressure; the Ross was good for 300%, making it 10 times as safe as a modern rifle. Not bad for an antique, eh?

ANOTHER story concerns the accuracy of these rifles. These also are true. Ross Rifles set records and targets which have never been equalled..... and they did it over a century ago. There is a special Ross shoot coming up in Calgary on July 6 to commemorate the centennial anniversary of the incredible 1913 season which the Ross had at Bisley. There is a thread up in this Forum regarding this. It is being put together by our own Range Rover who is, like yourself, very much a Ross aficionado.

And a third story concerns the fact that the 1910 action can be assembled incorrectly, in which condition it will damage you severely on the first shot. This one, also, is true. Remember one point: it can NOT get out of whack by itself. It MUST be assembled wrong. From your bottom picture, I can tell that your Bolt was assembled correctly at the time the photo was taken: that 1 inch of clearance between the front of the Bolt Sleeve the the rearmost Locking Lugs tells this. IF the bolt were NOT assembled correctly, this clearance would be 1/4 of an inch only.

MANY of these rifles were modified so that they COULD NOT be assembled incorrectly. I can not tell if yours has had this modification or not because the mod consists of a PIN driven vertically through the Bolt Sleeve, about halfway back along the shank of the Bolt Sleeve. This part of your Bolt is hidden under the Rear Sight in your bottom photo. If the pin is there, your rifle should be absolutely safe.

Here is a very quick test; I call it my "Rule of Thumb". Open the bolt and bring it halfway back. Now put your THUMB across the Bolt, just behind the locking-lugs. If your thumb is large, you will be able to FEEL the bolt-shank's position; if you have a small thumb, you can SEE the forward edge of the Bolt-Shank. This means that the rifle is SAFE.

SO:
1. check your Bolt for that vertical PIN,
2. be certain that you have that INCH of clearance between the Bolt Sleeve and the rearmost Locking Lugs,
3. go play.

Remember always that it CAN'T get out of whack by itself. Leave the Bolt IN the rifle as a safety precaution, anyway. (It has to be OUT for the Bolt to be thrown out of adjustment!)

NOW: pop on over to milsurps dot com, take out a (free) membership and download yourself a copy of the MANUAL for your rifle. It's FREE!

Once you have that under control, download your own copy of SHOOT TO LIVE! This is the Canadian WW2 manual for training men how to shoot accurately with the Number 4 Rifle, but much of it applies to ANY bolt rifle with Iron Sights. Learn what is in this book and you will become a very good shot..... in a very short time. Yes: it is that good! And th price is right: it's FREE!

Enjoy!
 
smellie said:
There is a special Ross shoot coming up in Calgary on July 6 to commemorate the centennial anniversary of the incredible 1913 season which the Ross had at Bisley. There is a thread up in this Forum regarding this. It is being put together by our own Range Rover who is, like yourself, very much a Ross aficionado.
Click to expand...

I went back about 500 posts, and did a rangerover author search, and couldn't find this thread for July 6.

Any chance a link or further info?

cheers
 
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As to the original post by ADANAC00,

1. Read and pay attention to what SMELLIE has posted above.

2. Read the STICKIE at the start of the Milsurps Forum on "1910 Ross Bolt Disassembly".
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Ross shoot details

First off, congrats on getting out the Ross, Adanac00. Looking forward to hearing how she does on the range.

Next, thanks for the plug for the shoot, smellie and buffdog.

Koldt, and other Ross shooters, basic details about the event, taking place just west of Calgary on July 6 and 7 can be found in the Events and Gathering forum:http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?871469-Ross-Rifle-(and-Battle-Rifle)-Shoot-Calgary-July-6-amp-7. More detailed information can be found at http://www.btsa.ca/matches/?page_id=4 (scroll down the list of matches to July and you'll see a link to the event details)

It's a fun shoot, but we'll have scored targets - operated by target pullers/markers - shot from a variety of distances. The event coincides with the Calgary Stampede, so if you need a hotel room, you might want to book one now, on spec.

To avoid further hijacking of Adanac00's thread, we should move further discussion of the shoot to the thread in the Events and Gathering forum (linked above)
 
WOW Smellie just WOW

First off Thank you very much for taking the time to Read and Post such great information!
i am a member at Millsurps and I have gone over and started to get the information you sugested so Thank you and WOW I have been reading the posts over there you are a very Helpful member of the firearms community as you are able to share alot of Knowlage on multi riffles as i have seen alot of post on my other fav the lee Enfields!

My major question tonight is, That there are no Calliber markings that i have noticed on this Rifle?

i know they are either .303 or .280 just not sure and dont want to find out the hard way! I have just started collecting millsurps in the last 2 years so i am not sure about a lot of things!

Also I dont seem to beable to find any Ser #s anywear I will take the wood off this weekend to have a better look!

Thanks again
 
The military 1910 model was manufactured only in calibre .303 British, so you have no troubles there.

As to a serial number, I am afraid that you are out of luck. The serial was marked on the right side of the Butt and consisted of a Number (up to 3 figures) on top of a Bar. Beneath the Bar was the Year of manufacture. A 2-letter Letter Group was to the right of the Bar. That made up the entire Number of a particular rifle, apart from a VERY few early rifles with anomalous numbers. The problem here is that so many of the rifles were sanded deeply while being converted to Sporter status, obliterating the markings. For SOME rifle, though, there is a POSSIBLE aid: ultra-violet light. What you do is get a mechanic's Trouble Light and a BLACK LIGHT bulb (75 cents to $1.25 at your local Dollar Store). You use the Shield of the Trouble Light to shield your eyes from the direct rays of the UV bulb as a lot of UV is NOT healthy for your eyes. Install the Black Light bulb and hold it close to the area of the Butt where the Serial Number should be. When the Number was marked, the Stamps which were used COMPRESSED the wood slightly and this compression often will show long after the markings are invisible to ordinary light. This trick was borrowed from Stamp Collectors, who use Black Light when looking for rare stamps which have been faked, forged or "restored" in order to enhance their value. Believe it or not, it actually works much of the time.

COMMERCIAL Ross Sporters were numbered in tiny (1/8 inch) numbers on the Left side of the Chamber, JUST above the wood line.

Your rifle is definitely a converted military rifle; the heavy barrel tells that much, as Commercial rifles tended to have slender, tapered barrels in th 26- or 28-inch range.

When you are firing fresh ammunition from your rifle, be sure to use Ed's Famous O-Rings (or pony-tail ties) on the bases of the cartridges. This will allow the brass to expand perfectly in YOUR chamber. Then you get into handloading and start cranking out your own ammo which will make your Ross sit up and do tricks. Handloading is the only way to get the very BEST performance out of any rifle.

Rifling on your Ross is 1 turn in 10 inches, left-hand and the rifling FORM is pure Ross: narrow Lands, wide Grooves and a special shape of Land designed to give these barrels an exceptionally-long life. If you are able to pick up a relatively undeformed slug from your rifle (shooting into a long snowbank and waiting for Spring works quite well, I find) you will find that the markings on the slug cannot be mistaken for anything else. This rifling works very well with flat-base bullets (as was all of the military ammo of that time) but is also should tolerate well the modern boat-tailed types.

For handloading for this rifle, try 36 to 38 grains of 4895 with a Sierra 180 Pro-Hunter. My 1910 (a Test rifle) likes 35 grains but my Barrel is still 30.5 inches, so the velocities will be similar. Seat your bullet to the same overall length as a Ball cartridge; with the Sierra bullet, this crowds the Leade just a bit, but the rifles like it.

Thanks for the kind words regarding my participation. I just try to help new guys avoid a few of the (many, many, many) mistakes I made when I was starting out with these critters.

Most important of all: enjoy!

Hope this helps.
 
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