Ross Sporter?

CMichaud

CMichaud

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Hey guys

Picked up a Ross sporter. What I am confused by is the lack of markings on it and the fact that it has some traditional sporter indicators such as

non-military butt plate
flat rear sight bridge with peep
barrel band screw
front blade sight

What is up with the very few markings on it?

The bolt head and barrel are marked c2 and the bolt seems to be G2.
The receiver seems to be G5.
the stock shows no external markings although the stock channel is marked with what appears to be a 58

No made in England stamps
Bolt not pinned
No serial number
No calibre or pressure stamp etc. (it is chambered in 303)

I would think it a bubba job but thought it best to confirm with you guys.

Here is the album for it - any info appreciated!

http://s583.photobucket.com/user/B-Stone/library/Guns/Ross Rifle?sort=3&page=1
 
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You might have a M1910R factory sporter. Is the there a tiny serial number stamped on the left side of the breech of the barrel? Is the barrel a slender contour, not medium weight like a service rifle? Can't ell from the photos.
 
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On one of the photos of the Barrel, it shows a "Broad Arrow" and "GR". That would indicate a Military rifle. As mentioned, the Ross Factory Sporters had a serial number on them, about 1/8 inch high, on the left side of the barrel, just ahead of the receiver. Also, another photo shows what looks like a "sold out of service" marking. This marking looks like two "broad arrows" with the points facing each other. A clear photo of this would help.

The photo of the muzzle does not show a crown to the bore, and almost looks like it has saw marks on it.

The "ladder type micrometer sight" shown is from a 1905 Ross.

On Factory Sporters, I have found the inside of the butt plate SOMETIMES has the serial number, (the same number as on the barrel), stamped on it. You have to take the butt plate off, and this number is stamped at the INSIDE TOP of the butt plate.
 
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Opps...the ladder sight is a Sutherland but it is actually mounted on an Martini. I will move those pics out as not sure how they got in there!

The Ross does not have any dove tail on the barrel.

No facing arrows (I know what they look like)

The barrel looks uncrowned but up close I cannot see saw cuts.

No markings on inside of butt plate although there "appears" to be three numbers along the right side of the receiver (would be hidden by the stock) although I cant seem to make them out.

There is also that mark on the rear of the barrel before tapering down that looks like a big * you see with miilsurps

I am wondering if this is a rebarreled sporter receiver although the barrel and bolt have the same C2 mark and the receiver appears to have G5 and the bolt handle G2

I am not sure that the broad arrow is even a broad arrow. It looks like the arrow head flares etc.

I have posted up some more pics which are hopefully a bit clearer.

I will add that the stock was slathered in some sort of varnish. I have removed the varnish and hit it with BLO. While the stock is finely inletted the wood shows some small and consistent circular sanding marks on the butt.

Did the Ross factory have 'smiths make trial/practice guns kind of like the Swedes?
 
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flying pig said:
Good eye Buff! I've got a soft spot for nice curvy butts. It's how my wife got me too!
Click to expand...

It's those long Alberta Winters where you are snowbound and have to have something to do for recreation.Laugh2


Now that there is a better picture of the "star" marking on the barrel, that is a British Military Armourer's marking for a fault, (usually rust or "honeycombing" ) in the chamber of the rifle. There were several versions of the "broad arrow" with some having straight arms and some having curving arms on the head. A factory sporter should not have the "GR" marking as that denotes property of the Crown. It also looks like the chamber has been enlarged, (the "E" looks like it is buffed.) It might be the light in the pictures, but it does look like saw or file marks on the muzzle ---(parallel lines.)
 
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M-10 action, late type trigger assembly, fixed external magazine.

Barrel is definitely sporter profile. The flat crown was popular at that time and was widely believed to be very accurate. It was. It was also prone to damage were the rifle to be dropped. Generally, these were marked ".303 ROSS" on the chamber. There should be a Number, figures about 1/8-inch high, on the left side of the chamber.

Normally, they were fitted with standard Winchester rear sights, but special orders were available. The combination barrelband/sling swivel was standard on factory sporters.

The bolt has never been pinned, so it is possible to insert it in an unsafe condition. Check carefully before shooting. See the Stickie (above). There should be about an INCH between the bolt-sleeve the the rear of the bolt-head for safe assembly. 1 inch is SAFE; a quarter-inch is NOT. It can only sit in those 2 positions and it can NOT get out of adjustment by itself; it REQUIRES human intervention to become adjusted incorrectly.

Nice rifle!

Get her shooting again and post the results here!
 
Hey Smellie

No serial numbers on left side.

Ack re the bolt. The guy I got it from said it was messed up and he couldn't put it together. Took a guy I know three minutes of fiddling to get the head in alignment. I read somewhere that the hole should be up when in battery and that it should self seat (ie snap forward) when you move the bolt into locking position and pull the trigger. The bolt face has a chip on the lead "three side" thread. Will likely have to address that problem with a new bolt head.

From the info here and google search, I think it is essentially a Ross R Sporter although the overall finishing, sparse markings, and lack of rear dovetail tell me it was either rebarrelled using a scrubbed milsurp barrel or (I think more likely) it was a "lunch box gun" IU suspect the latter do the small C2 marking found on both the bolt and the barrel. The G2 and G5 stamps on the bolt handle and the barrel, while different numerically, seem to imply a relationship between the bolt and receiver.

The rear peep sight it came with is quite interesting as it can be adjusted through the oblong screw hole on the sight base. The vertical adjustment is likewise adjustable up and down. The mounting screws are only half threaded to prevent movement. Not sure if this was a "custom" piece or factory but it is actual a pretty effective little peep sight.
 
Story goes that a lot were put together by a few individuals out of spares after the factory closed. I wonder if this could be the case. The front sight and stock look too much like a R-10 to be something made at home for a sporterization. Reasons for this: the front sight base looks nearly identical to the sporter base and the barrel on the military rifle would be much larger at this point I believe, plus I think it had an extra hole though it from side to side (I don't have one in hand to compare). Second reason is the stock. You would have to cut a different barrel channel in the stock for a MkIII barrel. I don't believe this was the case, although it is a good idea, simply because I haven't done it yet. Ha ha.

I definitely do like the look of this one though. It's a nice rifle regardless.
 
I have run into a cocking-piece aperture sight before, as well as the sight on the back face of the bolt sleeve.

There is one here on a very old sporter, so they were available.

Barrel on this rifle is proper sporter profile. FLYING PIG is quite right: military barrel was much heavier.

Sporter stocks generally were top-quality Rumanian, French or Italian Walnut. Mass-production Mark III military rifles used American Walnut. Somebody REALLY good with wood might be able to suss this one out for you.

I am wondering also if this might be an 'end-of'production' sporter that someone put together as a souvenir.... or if it was simply a special-order.

At that time, before the War, ALL factories would do special-order rifles, generally for an extra dollar or two. I have seen a pre-War Winchester with SEVEN special-order features.... at a dollar apiece for most: total an extra $10 on a $24 rifle.

The absence of a serial number would indicate that either it is very early... or very late.

Unfortunately, there do not seem to be any Ross records extant.

Still a nice rifle!
 
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