S&W M&P Slide Drop Debate

Winz said:
I understand English just fine thanks.

Perhaps I should have been more blunt in insinuating a lack of understanding of common firearms on your part.

So Terminator, come back anytime.
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So would you be so nice and enlighten me please ? I do not own the said firearm, but judging by what was shown on the vid. and what others who do own one have said , my statement about this not being a feature still stands. You're entitled to your own opinion, yet you choose to voice it by trying to put down other opinions, it shows real class. You could have explained your point with technical details since your extensive experience enables you to do so, but choose not to, so that's saying something about your character.:)
 
I have 4 M&Ps, they all do it every single time....... M&P;9, 357 sig, 40 & pro.

I 'discovered' this little 'feature' when practicing my speed re-loads on my M&P9 (early 2K8). At the time it had about 800rnds down it. It now is somewhere north of 15K, still does it. My 40 and my 357 (all above mentioned were BNIB when I got them) all did it right out of the box, the pro didn't, it does however perform like the others after 2K down the pipe. I am not entirely sure when it started 'working' like the others.

The easiest way to 'teach' someone this 'trick', is to place a LOADED mag on a table or range bench (use snap caps or dud rnds if you are in the basement). Now place your M&P into your hand as if you were going to shoot it. Lock the slide back. Now leaving the mag standing (on the baseplate) on the table (bullets up) partially insert the pistol onto the mag (approx 10% of the mag into the mag well) now with a sharp downward motion seat the mag into the pistol (about the same force you would use to karate chop the bench with out breaking your hand or hurting yourself).

I have yet to see an M&P not drop the slide doing this. This should also be obvious, but the mag has to be loaded....... If not the slide stop will be engaged by the mag and the slide will not drop.......

I use this method for reloads all the time (sans bench). For the most obvious reason, it saves time when in a timed event. The other reason is that M&Ps can be notoriously hard to seat full (new) mags on a closed slide, so a little (extra) force is reqired. It is the same action/force for both mag changes.

YMMV

Why is it that 'Haters gotta hate'?
 
Tuco Pike said:
Wicked Copper the win!!! If the gun actually was meant to close the slide and chamber a round upon insertion of a full mag, it would also have to have some way to disable the firing pin until you engage it, like an automatic safety. Could you imagine what would arise holding a gun at a 45 degree angle and have the gun go full auto because of a mechanical failure?
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You mean something like the firing pin block? ;)
 
wicked_police said:
I can't believe people still think this and spread it around as 'fact'.... No modern pistol is designed for the slide to go forward on it's own when a mag is inserted. It's cause by the force used to insert the mag into the gun, and sometimes the way the gun is held/mag inserted.

If you think it's designed to do it, try inserting the mag gently. Oh no... The slide didn't go forward... It must be broken right? But then try inserting the mag forcefully, and it's more likely to cause the slide to cycle. What kind of design would work so inconsistently???

And it's not a 100% effective way of getting a round chambered anyway. If you do it enough times, eventually, the slide won't pick up a round (more likely to happen with a partially filled mag than a full one).


The only methods of maximizing the chance of the slide stripping a round from the mag when it goes forward are pulling the slide to the rear using your preferred grip, or hitting the slide stop/release lever to drop the slide.
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Exactly! Neither my FS or PRO will drop the slide when inserting a loaded mag with force or no force. I hit the slide stop every time when doing a fast reload. If the slide were to drop on its own fine but I don't assume it will and hit the slide stop when doing a reload when competing,doing drills. or just plinking a the range. It hasn't happened yet with my FS after 4k rounds and the not with the PRo with near 1K rounds. Maybe one day it will but I won't be planning for it.

Take Care

Bob
 
notsorichguy said:
the pro didn't, it does however perform like the others after 2K down the pipe.
Why is it that 'Haters gotta hate'?
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Proof in the pudding that this is not an intentional design..

If your trigger safety stopped working after 2k rounds would you say "yep, that the way they intended it to be, I'm happy now"

Haters gotta hate wrong info being spread 'bout the intenetz..
 
I just tried it with my JG edition and the slide dropped exactly 4 of the 25 times I slammed the mag in. I then got bored of the silliness and put it away. 16% of the time now that is a feature!

I'm thinking this has more to do with the ambi slide release being heavier than most guns and having an (unintentional) inertial reaction to force being applied inline against spring tension.
 
TERMINATOR101CA said:
So would you be so nice and enlighten me please ? I do not own the said firearm, but judging by what was shown on the vid. and what others who do own one have said , my statement about this not being a feature still stands. You're entitled to your own opinion, yet you choose to voice it by trying to put down other opinions, it shows real class. You could have explained your point with technical details since your extensive experience enables you to do so, but choose not to, so that's saying something about your character.:)
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No my original comment was not a put down. I actually asked 'wtf are you talking about?' is a sincere manner. You joked back that I don't understand english.

Regardless, petty things aside(and never intending to put you down), my opinion and my opinion only regarding your first comment:

TERMINATOR101CA said:
I would say no. In the Beretta 92FS the slide catch is operated by a notch in the mag follower , so it locks the slide back when the last rnd is fired . When inserting a full mag the catch will release the slide every time. Now in the case of the M&P does the slide lock back when the last rnd is fired ???? I suspect not since I couldn't see anything connecting the mag follower to the slide catch. Just bcs you can get the slide to release by really slamming on the mag it only shows that the fit isn't that good and/or it's been worn out or the spring loosened thus making it drop on some occasions.
It's not reliable enough to be able to call it a feature of this pistol.
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Firearms with a bolt-hold-open(or slide-hold-open) on empty mag are operated by the follower of the mag pushing up against the bolt/slide stop. The majority of autoloader firearms have this and essentially function under the same principle.

The 92F is no more special in that inserting a mag causing release of the slide is also not a 'feature' of the pistol, or at least anymore than any other.

Whether one calls it a feature or not, it wouldn't be my default drill to rely on. If the slide releases upon insert, you just carry on.
 
While I have trouble believing that this is actually designed to operate this way by S&W, I really don't see why people are making such a big deal out of it. I fail to see it being a real detractor in any way, so you slam a mag home and the slide goes in to battery...great. Or you slam a mag home and the slide stays locked back and you have to rack it as is expected...again, great.

I just don't see this being an annoyance at all while shooting, will have to wait and see if I change my tune after having some trigger time on my M&P40 once it arrives.
 
You can tell the noobs from the pros at the range when they are rapid firing, gun locks open on empty, and they slam the mag in and the slide releases instantly.

Seriously, though, my Shadow usually does it if I do it right, and I try to do it right because its a cool way to unlock the slide.
 
Strangely enough even if the slide does close on its own, I find myself using the slide lock since it reliably repositions my thumb to the spot it needs to be at in order to get an accurate first shot after the reload. Done quickly it's hard to tell how the slide was released.
 
enefgee said:
Strangely enough even if the slide does close on its own, I find myself using the slide lock since it reliably repositions my thumb to the spot it needs to be at in order to get an accurate first shot after the reload. Done quickly it's hard to tell how the slide was released.
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Perfect. You are a smart man. Nothing worse than thinking something is going to happen and then it doesn't.

Take Care

Bob
 
adamg said:
You can tell the noobs from the pros at the range when they are rapid firing, gun locks open on empty, and they slam the mag in and the slide releases instantly.

Seriously, though, my Shadow usually does it if I do it right, and I try to do it right because its a cool way to unlock the slide.
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Lol. Real pros never shoot themselves dry in the first place ;)
 
Winz said:
No my original comment was not a put down. I actually asked 'wtf are you talking about?' is a sincere manner. You joked back that I don't understand english.

.
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Had you not used profanities when asking sincerely, you would have gotten a respectful answer. I was asking when i said "does it lock back" , as obviously don't have hands on experience with this actual firearm . I couldn't see from the video if the follower was in fact contacting the slide catch in any form, hence my question and following assumption based on a grainy video. I wasn't stating anywhere that I was an expert , just observing and judging from other posters I came to the conclusion that it was never meant as a feature, rather a random occurrence attributed to machining tolerances and wear and tear.:)
 
TERMINATOR101CA said:
I wasn't stating anywhere that I was an expert , just observing and judging from other posters I came to the conclusion that it was never meant as a feature, rather a random occurrence attributed to machining tolerances and wear and tear.:)
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Im not an M&P expert but I am a new owner AND it did this action even be4 Ive taken it to the range.

Ive loaded ONE dummy round in the mag and slammed it in... locked and loaded.

It is a repeatable and consistent action when I slam the mag in which I do on runs.

If done slowly it wont slam shut. And thats fine by me I have an option.


Here is a video of my son doing the same thing after he loaded a single dummy round in...



Here is a couple of stills of the M&P I had posted a few weeks back.
swmain.jpg

sw1-1.jpg
 
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I bought my M&P9 about 2 years ago.. when I first discovered this I was concerned.
I can consistently make it happen or consistently make it not happen and have really come to appreciate the flexibility.
I dig it
 
I've done this on pretty much every handgun I've carried or used, browings to sig to 1911 and m&p and glock. I always found a turning motion as you slam the mag home will cause the slide to release or more accurately as MAGPUL Dynamics now call it the 45 deg. In one form of practice we were taught this is a "malfunction" and you cannot be 100% sure that a round is chambered and to rack the weapon after to ensure a round is chambered. (I've never had a round not chamber on a slide drop, although "2 weeks ago I was told this happened with browning" either way, it all worked out and in my opinion I think was more of a mag issue in that case.

The most recent doctrine that I've been seeing is that this is an advantage to speed the emergency reload and some people are very good at this technique.

I use the "45 deg" everyday on admin loads and it works 100% of the time.
 
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