Same Gun Two Calibres 375 H&H or 458 W.M.

For a do "everything rifle" that might meet a buffalo someday a .375 is hard to beat. I've shot animals ranging from steinbuck on the small end to giraffe as the heaviest. In between there's a pile of deer and elk sized game and 10 buffalo. In a pinch you could do it all with a single bullet choice, then add a solid load and take elephant too. With recoil that is approximately double that of a 30-06 and a similar trajectory it is quite do-able.

Now to switch gears a bit, if you wanted a "buffalo gun" that can take care of most everything else I wouldn't completely rule out the .458. You have to make some allowances, recoil that can be close to double that of the .375 is hard to ignore and handloading is necessary. My 450 grain loads have accounted for 9 buffalo so far. Sighted in 2 inches high at 100 they print 3 inches low at 200 yards, while still only being 1 inch high at 50 and dead on at 25. The darn elephant gun is a little more versatile than you might think. You can easily sight a little higher for general purpose hunting and stretch things out a bit. Handloaded 300 and 350 grain Barnes TSXs change things even more. A 300 grain chunk of copper at 2800 fps is a completely different critter than a 500 grain factory load that may not even break 2000.
 
Dogleg said:
For a do "everything rifle" that might meet a buffalo someday a .375 is hard to beat. I've shot animals ranging from steinbuck on the small end to giraffe as the heaviest. In between there's a pile of deer and elk sized game and 10 buffalo. In a pinch you could do it all with a single bullet choice, then add a solid load and take elephant too. With recoil that is approximately double that of a 30-06 and a similar trajectory it is quite do-able.

Now to switch gears a bit, if you wanted a "buffalo gun" that can take care of most everything else I wouldn't completely rule out the .458. You have to make some allowances, recoil that can be close to double that of the .375 is hard to ignore and handloading is necessary. My 450 grain loads have accounted for 9 buffalo so far. Sighted in 2 inches high at 100 they print 3 inches low at 200 yards, while still only being 1 inch high at 50 and dead on at 25. The darn elephant gun is a little more versatile than you might think. You can easily sight a little higher for general purpose hunting and stretch things out a bit. Handloaded 300 and 350 grain Barnes TSXs change things even more. A 300 grain chunk of copper at 2800 fps is a completely different critter than a 500 grain factory load that may not even break 2000.
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Do you mean you've shot 19 cape buffalo? Or just your rifles have been used to shoot that many?
 
I guess I'm an exception to some of the opinions regarding the 458.
First I must say I've owned 375s and 458s since the late 1960's and early '70s.... and wouldn't be without either as for me they are awesome.
Concerning the 458, I like it because I can load any bullet used in a 45-70 be it cast or jacketed and also shot loads.
My 458 has taken Deer with cast loads and with less meat loss than my 270.
One day over 20 years ago I filled Griz tag with a 600 gr. Barnes and that same afternoon bagged Grouse with shot loads from the same rifle , hows that for versatile... doesn't get much better...
My 458 with a 3X Leupold is over a pound lighter than my pre-64s making it enjoyable to pack...
 
cam1936 said:
Do you mean you've shot 19 cape buffalo? Or just your rifles have been used to shoot that many?
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21 buffalo spread across 3 continents, so Cape buffalo and two different kinds of water buffalo. The other two were shot with a .416 Rigby and a .450 Nitro Express if you're interested.

With a bit of luck I'll add a couple capes in Mozambique in October, to go with whatever I get in Australia in August. Buffalo are a lot of fun.
 
I think more than 20 buffalo is an obssetion, have you sought help.......you know, of the professional sort? I'm sure there are support groups and therapists for this unhealthy NEED to kill every buffalo on the planet. GEEZZZZ Dogleg, by the time I get to Oz there won't be any left..............give a guy a break would ya !!!
 
c-fbmi said:
I think more than 20 buffalo is an obssetion, have you sought help.......you know, of the professional sort? I'm sure there are support groups and therapists for this unhealthy NEED to kill every buffalo on the planet. GEEZZZZ Dogleg, by the time I get to Oz there won't be any left..............give a guy a break would ya !!!
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My case was declared hopeless. All I can do now is treat the symptoms, fight off the urge for .50+" double rifles, and wait for the end. It would be tragic is it weren't so darn much fun.
 
Ya........something like "Buffalo Hog".......I'll bet your passport says "BANNED" for Cambodia, Thailand, Viet Nam, Philipines etc........



PSSSSTTT....Dogleg, don't tell them you did in all them buffs with a pushfeed Remington..........there'll be dicks dropping off from Victoria to St. Johns.....SSSSHHHHH......You and I would be the only dangerous game hunters left on CGN with dicks if this got out, you know that, right?
 
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c-fbmi said:
Ya........something like "Buffalo Hog".......I'll bet your passport says "BANNED" for Cambodia, Thailand, Viet Nam, Philipines etc........



PSSSSTTT....Dogleg, don't tell them you did in all them buffs with a pushfeed Remington..........there'll be dicks dropping off from Victoria to St. Johns.....SSSSHHHHH......You and I would be the only dangerous game hunters left on CGN with dicks if this got out, you know that, right?
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Half of them got shot with a pushfeed, the rest with CRFs. Even a double rifle is a pushfeed when you think about it.
 
sunray said:
Guy came into the shop I worked in long ago. He was going to Africa and just had to have his own .458(you can rent 'em there). Bought a Win M70 African and 20 rounds of ammo. Picks the rifle up on a Friday evening. Saturday afternoon he comes in with the rifle, 18 loaded cartridges and two empties, asking us to sell it. The felt recoil is astounding. You should rethink the whole idea.
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I concur. IMO the .375 H&H is manageable but the .458 will take some serious work to get used to. It's a whole new world of punishment.

Did I mention I really like the .375 H&H?
 
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sunray said:
"...put the bullet right behind the ear..." Actually into the slight depression on Dumbo's forehead with a .257 Rigby.
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275 Rigby.

To the OP, neither of those is a great idea. Go buy a 30-06 and then if you decide later that you need more power then you can trade up and a 30-06 will always be sellable. 375 H&H and 458 WM are probably more fun than you will want to have on a regular basis. They're ones where, if you have to ask if you should buy one, then you shouldn't buy one.
 
philthygeezer said:
I concur. IMO the .375 H&H is manageable but the .458 will take some serious work to get used to. It's a whole new world of punishment.

Did I mention I really like the .375 H&H?
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.375 H&H loaded hot with 300gr I actually find more unpleasant that .458 500gr. I've shot both side by side within a minute of each other in identical weight rifles, and my .375 was sharper than the .458. A 270gr .375 is mild, 300gr starts to move your shoulder a bit but still manageable, and max H4350 loads (80grs and a hair more) get your attention. The .458 was just a big shove without the sharpness of fast, heavy .375 loads.

As for Dogleg, perhaps Bovid Blaster or "The Bovid Hammer", no big girl pun.
 
To my way of thinking a .375 is a general purpose cartridge, whereas the .458 is a niche cartridge. Should the day come that you can afford an elephant hunt, the .458, or even better a .577 NE is the correct choice. Elephant hunting today is more dangerous then in Bell's day for two reasons. First is that the style of hunting today is to confront the elephant, as most hunters believe they want the experience of making a frontal brain shot. This is far more dangerous than Bell's technique of shooting from behind, or even then making a broadside shot. The second reason that today's elephant hunting is more dangerous is due to the various cropping programs carried out across Africa. Done correctly, no member of a family group escapes, but the reality is that occasionally one does. They say an elephant never forgets for a reason . . . they never do, and an elephant that survives a cull is a sworn enemy of man for the rest of his life. Anyway, so much for elephants, the point is that the .458 is at its best as a close range thumper. Another component of the general purpose rifle is one's ability to shoot from all field positions, supported and unsupported. This can become a real challenge once you are dealing with .458 class recoil, where many never attempt to shoot other than offhand.

Don't dismiss the 9.3X62 out of hand, particularly if finances are tight. Tradex is a fine source of affordable Husqvarna rifles, and 9.3X62 brass is easily made from .30/06. Bullets in 9.3 are more affordable than either .375 or.458, particularly the Serbian made stuff, marketed under the Previ name. Interestingly, the Previ 286 gr bullets look very similar to the Lapua 286, but they sure don't cost the same. In order to get good you have to shoot a lot, but you can't shoot a lot if your components are too expensive.

My friend Doug tells me I'm too long winded, so I'll stop now.
 
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