Savage 99 Headspace problem?

landphil

landphil

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I have a Savage 99 in .300 Sav manufactured 1953 from what I could figure out. It was inherited from a relative some years ago, and I've fired roughly 35 factory Federal rounds through it over the years. The odd thing with the spent casings is, all the primers are pushed out of the pocket and protruding .010-.015". I picked up some dies recently and was thinking to load up a few rounds with better bullets, but then remembered this issue, and want it resolved before continuing, if I even can. Is it a headspace problem? The action seems tight, and while there are what appears to be a few file marks on the bolt face (possibly from deburring??), the machining marks are still present on the bolt face as well. What do you experts say?


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You will need to try a couple of different makes of ammo before you can determine that it might be a headspacing problem, as the problem may be the ammo..
 
Usually popped primers is saying something about the ammo, excessive headspace will streatch the case, low pressures push the primer back, and high pressure like 40,000 psi or so brings the case head back to the face after, my semi auto likes to do the same thing cause low psi, there is also a bit of unburnt powder residue
 
Well - If you're going to reload, then you don't have to concern yourself - you can size the case to fit the chamber. FWIW - I doubt you have a serious headspace problem - it could just be the ammo your using.
 
You can not measure headspace using a cartridge case. You are measuring case head clearance. If you reload you simply need to create a small shoulder and then only size enough so you can just feel the action close on this case. The small shoulder is usually done by an over size expander ball expanding the neck so it contacts the chamber and then sizing it back short of the present shoulder.
 
Thanks for the comments guys. The factory rounds I fired were Federal 180gr. powerpoints from several years apart, same ammo, different lot.

guntech said:
You can not measure headspace using a cartridge case. You are measuring case head clearance.
Click to expand...

Forgive my ingnorance on the topic Dennis, you've lost me. I realize there are proper go/no go gauges needed to measure headspace, I'm not thinking I have any way to measure the chamber myself. The measurements I gave were of how much the primers were protruding, which makes me think the chamber is longer than the case.

I'm off to read what looks to be a good article explaining the difference. I'll update when I get a clue.
 
OK, I think I understand the case head space vs. headspace thing now. Headspace being the actual measurement of the chamber, the case head space is the axial play the case has in the chamber. Excessive headspace (compared to spec)being only one possible cause of excessive case head space, as is a "short "case.


maynard said:
Federal cases are the problem.
Click to expand...
Can you explain? Are federal .300 Sav. cases known to be shorter than spec, or what? I've never had issues with federal brass in other rifles, and don't have an issue with trying some winchester brass, just would like to know why first. Thanks.

What is best thing to do now?
Resizing the brass with a second shoulder to effectively make the brass longer (at least I think thats what Guntech means) worries me a bit as I'm just beginning with reloading and I don't have any dies larger than .30 cal to be able to pull that off.

See if the local smith has go/no go headspace gauges for .300Sav to check it out?

Try some winchester factory ammo?

Or leave the rifle in the cabinet as a family heirloom? I wasn't planning on using it much anyway.
 
landphil said:
Thanks for the comments guys. The factory rounds I fired were Federal 180gr. powerpoints from several years apart, same ammo, different lot.



Forgive my ingnorance on the topic Dennis, you've lost me. I realize there are proper go/no go gauges needed to measure headspace, I'm not thinking I have any way to measure the chamber myself. The measurements I gave were of how much the primers were protruding, which makes me think the chamber is longer than the case.

I'm off to read what looks to be a good article explaining the difference. I'll update when I get a clue.
Click to expand...

Don't feel bad it took a number of years before I got the terminology right...

The protruding primers indicate how much case head clearance that particular brass had.

Basically you refer to headspace when talking about the assembled barrel and action. It is set when the gunsmith assemblies it. The headspace is measured using steel gauges. It does not change after assembly. Ideally a go gauge just touches the shoulder and the closed bolt face at the same time, that would have minimum headspace.If it does not close on a no go gauge but you can not feel it on the go gauge the headspace is perfectly acceptable. These tolerance may vary 4 to 6 thou.

Cartridge head clearance is the term when you are discussing the fit of the brass case in a particular chamber. It is the space between the case head and the bolt face when the case is as far forward in the chamber as it will go. With the .300 Savage the should of the case is what stops forward movement of the case.

If you have a maximum headspace chamber and a cartridge that is made to minimum specifications, you get the effect you have right now...

Until the actual headspace is measured using steel gauges you won't know exactly what or why... but regardless if you hand load you can make shells fit correctly for maximum life.
 
Thanks, that does make sense. As I understand it then, this rifle is pretty safe to shoot, but for good brass life I want less case head clearance which could be achieved by modifying my brass or possibly trying other brass. Correct?
 
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