That's some awesome shooting. The blueing on yours looks much more even, I should have sprang the extra $50 for the $300 guns..
Schultz & Larsons .22 Rimfire
- Thread starter parksb2
- Start date
That's some awesome shooting. The blueing on yours looks much more even, I should have sprang the extra $50 for the $300 guns..
I think Flobert actions as used on some entry level Anschutz rifles (e.g. Model 1400, CIL Anschutz 125) #### on closing, as do the actions on Cooey 60/600 models.
Rod B
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I'm not familiar with the entry level Anschutz but you are correct about the Cooey. This getting old & not remembering is not good.
Right, with CF designs, that along with the Pattern 1913 Enfield and the widely used M1917 Enfield (sometimes called the "American Enfield"). Most custom sporters made with the 1917 action had this feature changed over to ####-on-opening.
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The Swedish M96/M38 Mausers are also #### on closing, as well as being really sweet shooting milsurps in a great calibre.
Mark
Now that I think about it, the early Schultz & Larsen centerfire hunting-rifle actions were ####-on-closing--the M54J, and the M60, which appeared in 1957. When I got into S&L rifles, it was with the M65 and M68 actions that had been changed over to ####-on-opening to meet the US-market inclination.
The general preference seems to be ####-on-opening.
The general preference seems to be ####-on-opening.
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Out of the 8 I picked up over the years from Tradex, this late M77 (one of the last 80 they made before stopping production) is the nicest condition metal and wood (walnut), it's also the best shooter. Added an adapter for a diopter, it usually comes out with me. Still have 3 or 4 I haven't shot yet. For $300 there is nothing new you can buy that is this well made.
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#### on closing mag feed rifles are quicker to operate in rapid fire, they also provide less effort during extraction.
Either type are not hard to master. Even in WWII there were only a few countries that were using COO rifles, most bolt guns were COC.
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I don't think that's quite true. If we consider the main bolt-action battle rifles in WW2, only the British (and Commonwealth countries) Lee-Enfield, the Americanized Enfield 1917, and the Japanese Arisaka were ####-on-closing. On the other hand, the US M1903 Springfield (and the Krag that preceded it, although the Krag wasn't used in WW2 to any extent), the German (and other countries') Mauser 98, the French MAS-36, the Italian Carcano, the 1903 Mannlicher–Schönauer used by the Greek military, and the Russian Mosin-Nagant (the most-used rifle in WW2, serving the largest mobilized army in history) were all ####-on-opening. When you add up the huge number of troops using either the Mauser or Mosin-Nagant, along with the others mentioned, I believe that the ####-on-opening rifles would have easily outnumbered the ####-on-closing.
In his excellent book, The Bolt Action: A Design Analysis (Vol. 1), Stuart Otteson has the following to say about ####-on-opening:
"It [####-on-opening] thus avoids the tendency to push the rifle off the shoulder when closing. Also it can be cocked by simply raising and lowering the bolt handle, without having also to cycle the bolt back."
It is these features, I think--along with the advances made to the extraction cams in rifles like the Wiinchester M70 and others that reduce the cocking effort--that have made ####-on-opening the universal preference in bolt actions.
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South Pender....The trigger is so nice it made me look good! First time I've shot diopter sights and plan on keeping it that way so not interested in scoping it.
There's no ejector just an extractor.
That's some awesome shooting. The blueing on yours looks much more even, I should have sprang the extra $50 for the $300 guns..
parksb2...my S&L seems to group other bulk ammo almost as good as the CCI SVs. The great trigger made me look better than I really am. The Caldwell sandbag rest helped also
.My rifle was actually restored by the previous G'Nutter. He re-blued and re-finished/oiled the stock and added the bolt knob and an Anshutz rail. I paid a bit more than $300....but was happy to do so.
These are great rifles! Enjoy your S&L's folks....
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I'll give you the German and Russian rifles....but French, Italian, and Greek....meh, not really significant but hey, my opinion only.
I'll see if I can find some old "mad minute" vids of the Brits putting the LE through it's paces. Otteson might be off a bit. Also not sure about this "cocking simple by raising and lowering the handle"....for what purpose? Dry firing? Not like you can do that with a round in the chamber.
This guy has the sort of correct form when shooting, hand on the bolt, middle finger firing, his stripper reloads need some work. Butt stays on his shoulder the whole time, and his hits were decent. I personally find #### on open to slip the rifle up your shoulder when firing rapidly.
https://www.youtube.com/shared?ci=STmqqFg476w
Keep in mind this is all way off topic for the single shot target rifle this thread is about. It could be rope cocking for all that matters....
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Out of the 8 I picked up over the years from Tradex, this late M77 (one of the last 80 they made before stopping production) is the nicest condition metal and wood (walnut), it's also the best shooter. Added an adapter for a diopter, it usually comes out with me. Still have 3 or 4 I haven't shot yet. For $300 there is nothing new you can buy that is this well made.
That's a fancy looking rear sight. How do you like it and where can I find more info/source one?
The adapter needed to fit standard diopters like that is 6mmx.75 thread on the S&L sight side, and 3/8x24 on the diopter side. Diopter threads are really 9.5x1mm but a tap in that is impossible to find so 3/8x24 is close enough to work. My gunsmith had 1 in a parts bin I got lucky to find, 1 rifle I bought came with one setup already, and one a member was going to try and do a batch for us for sale here, but he found it was much to time consuming and put it on hold for now.
This is one from Tradex that came with a Gehmann diopter and adapter already set up.
And yes, I still have the cut down D&T rifle, it was parts gun complete except for a bolt, and had a ringed bore about 6" from the muzzle. Didn't feel bad about having it cut down and tapped. It shoots fine, but no better really then the diopter sighted rifles, so it's just a bag of spare parts now.
The 6.5x55 S&L target rifles built on left over '98 receivers are also a really good deal, running between $350-$500. The early M52 version has a modified K98 stock and Dane designed Garand type sights, heavy S&L barrel, action is smoothed out very nicely, excellent shooters with some interesting history. This one is built on a 1917 Kornbusch receiver.
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As the design evolved, they started looking more like the .22 M70's. Aperture sights, complete Dane fully adjustable trigger, new stocks, and again very good shooters.
This was the first M69 I picked up from Tradex, and the first 5 handloads I put through it at 100m. Ultra smooth action on this one too.
This is one from Tradex that came with a Gehmann diopter and adapter already set up.
And yes, I still have the cut down D&T rifle, it was parts gun complete except for a bolt, and had a ringed bore about 6" from the muzzle. Didn't feel bad about having it cut down and tapped. It shoots fine, but no better really then the diopter sighted rifles, so it's just a bag of spare parts now.
The 6.5x55 S&L target rifles built on left over '98 receivers are also a really good deal, running between $350-$500. The early M52 version has a modified K98 stock and Dane designed Garand type sights, heavy S&L barrel, action is smoothed out very nicely, excellent shooters with some interesting history. This one is built on a 1917 Kornbusch receiver.
As the design evolved, they started looking more like the .22 M70's. Aperture sights, complete Dane fully adjustable trigger, new stocks, and again very good shooters.
This was the first M69 I picked up from Tradex, and the first 5 handloads I put through it at 100m. Ultra smooth action on this one too.
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Thanks for this, much cheaper than paying on the lathe.
Still looking for info on the rear diopter please. Does it help with sight alignment as the rear is slight different ID? I am at the point in life where bifocals are a necessity, hence my use of a non standard target as the black spot fits near perfect with a light white halo for sight alignment. When the black spot appears centered and the breathing is in the right point of cycle squeeze.
- Location
- pallisers triangle
maybe off topic a tiny bit, I have one that was a "needs work" gun. it needs a shime in the bolt to fix the over headspace. anyone found shims the right size? I made one but it isn't the best, just wondered if anone else has gone through this
