Scope focus question

alberta guy

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I have a Nikon Prostaff scope 4-12x zoom on my savage gun, shooting .17hmr at 50 yards. I bought it a couple of seasons back and had it on a cheap Mossberg 817. I bought this scope because at the time it had over 40 reviews on the cabelas website and a rating of 4.6 out of 5. But now that its on a quality rifle I noticed I can never get it to totally focus. Either the target is fuzzy and the reticle is clear or else the reticle is clear and the target is fuzzy. I cannot seem to get both perfectly sharp. So is it me? My shooting setup with how and where my face sits and stuff? The scope? Or some sort of combo of all three? I do wear strong perscription glasses too if that matters.

Any help with be appreciated.

Thanks
 
The focus on the eyepiece is meant to adjust the reticle only. If the scope has a parallax adjustment, use that to focus the target. If it doesn't have adjustable parallax, then use less magnification at closer distances.
 
Also, although manufacturers claim that their standard parallax is set 100 y, any given scope may display a substantially larger parallax zero. it becomes a problem at 50 y.
 
After shooting yesterday unless I spend money on something like a gun vice. I am just as accurate with my ruger .22 with my cheap tasco scope as my savage .17hmr. But buying something like a gun vice or stand takes all the fun out of shooting. So once I run outta ammo I think I'm just gonna sell that gun and scope. No point shooting a more exspensive round if I don't have too.

Thanks for the replies.
 
I have a Nikon Prostaff scope 4-12x zoom on my savage gun, shooting .17hmr at 50 yards. I bought it a couple of seasons back and had it on a cheap Mossberg 817. I bought this scope because at the time it had over 40 reviews on the cabelas website and a rating of 4.6 out of 5. But now that its on a quality rifle I noticed I can never get it to totally focus. Either the target is fuzzy and the reticle is clear or else the reticle is clear and the target is fuzzy. I cannot seem to get both perfectly sharp. So is it me? My shooting setup with how and where my face sits and stuff? The scope? Or some sort of combo of all three? I do wear strong perscription glasses too if that matters.

Any help with be appreciated.

Thanks

Typically, the parallax on a rifle scope is set for 100 yards. If you are shooting at full power at 50 yards, you likely won't get perfect focus without some sort of parallax adjustment. I have a 3-9 rifle scope on my 10/22 and when I'm shooting at 50 yards, I'll just go to 6 power and the focus is usually good. Just shoot at the highest power you can with the reticle still in focus with your target.

Best Regards,
Anthony Haines
Inside Sales Specialist
 
A few years back I purchased a Nikon Prostaff 4-12x40, for the same reasons OP did. And as OP, I was initially flustered about the "unsharp" view at 50m distance, when set at 12 power. As I "zoomed out," the image got sharper. By the way, the reticle remained in focus. What gives?

Then the light bulb went on: This was much like optics in photography - we are talking about depth of field (the distance between the nearest and farthest object in front that are in acceptable sharp focus) which diminishes as the magnification increases. Conversely, the depth of field increases as the magnification decreases. Ok, so there's nothing wrong with my scope (Nikon Prostaff is, by the way, it's nice glass for the money.) As it turns out, anything beyond 100m (to infinity) is in acceptable sharp focus at the full power range.

In other words, this was never intended to be a short-distance target scope. It works as designed.

Now, time to don Nomex: I think there is a lot of confusion and misinformation about parallax (the difference in the apparent position of an object when viewed along two different lines of sight - with rifle scopes, this refers to any movement of eye position away from the optical center of the scope) and focus (converging the light rays in a manner that brings clarity and definition to the object(s) we are looking at.) These are two different things: Sharp focus requires movement of specific lens elements towards or away from the viewer; Eliminating parallax error requires the reticle (crosshairs) to be placed precisely at either the first OR the second focal plane inside the scope (the two separate points where light rays "cross" each other inside the scope tube.) So the two are related, but not the same.

With lower magnification scopes we generally never worry about parallax, as the potential error is always minimal. The reticle is positioned at the factory to the "best" setting for the intended use of the optic. When hunting, the bullet placement variance of 1/4" at 200 yards makes no difference.

With higher magnification scopes and precision shooting, the ability of the user to adjust reticle placement is important. This is achieved either by moving the front lens group (adjustable objective, or AO scope) OR by moving the reticle back and forth (side focus, or SF scope.) In other words, AO scope works much like a camera lens focus by rotating the objective lens (the lens elements further away from the eye) on threads so they move back and forth, while the SF style moves an inner lens group containing the reticle back and forth. Different processes, same results.

Finally, what about the ocular (the lens elements closest to the eye) diopter adjustment? That is simply there to bring an image that we know is sharp in focus to fit your eye. With scopes, this is easiest done by pointing the scope to any "blank" area, closing your eyes for a moment to rest them, then looking through the scope. If the reticle is in focus, the diopter adjustment is good. Lock it in place and forget it.

Please bear in mind I'm not an expert, so do your own research to verify (or disprove) my statements. I won't cry if I'm off-base.

Having said that, if someone had explained the above to me years ago, I would have saved a lot of frustration - and money as well... .

Let the games begin!
 
A few years back I purchased a Nikon Prostaff 4-12x40, for the same reasons OP did. And as OP, I was initially flustered about the "unsharp" view at 50m distance, when set at 12 power. As I "zoomed out," the image got sharper. By the way, the reticle remained in focus. What gives?

Then the light bulb went on: This was much like optics in photography - we are talking about depth of field (the distance between the nearest and farthest object in front that are in acceptable sharp focus) which diminishes as the magnification increases. Conversely, the depth of field increases as the magnification decreases. Ok, so there's nothing wrong with my scope (Nikon Prostaff is, by the way, it's nice glass for the money.) As it turns out, anything beyond 100m (to infinity) is in acceptable sharp focus at the full power range.

In other words, this was never intended to be a short-distance target scope. It works as designed.

Now, time to don Nomex: I think there is a lot of confusion and misinformation about parallax (the difference in the apparent position of an object when viewed along two different lines of sight - with rifle scopes, this refers to any movement of eye position away from the optical center of the scope) and focus (converging the light rays in a manner that brings clarity and definition to the object(s) we are looking at.) These are two different things: Sharp focus requires movement of specific lens elements towards or away from the viewer; Eliminating parallax error requires the reticle (crosshairs) to be placed precisely at either the first OR the second focal plane inside the scope (the two separate points where light rays "cross" each other inside the scope tube.) So the two are related, but not the same.

With lower magnification scopes we generally never worry about parallax, as the potential error is always minimal. The reticle is positioned at the factory to the "best" setting for the intended use of the optic. When hunting, the bullet placement variance of 1/4" at 200 yards makes no difference.

With higher magnification scopes and precision shooting, the ability of the user to adjust reticle placement is important. This is achieved either by moving the front lens group (adjustable objective, or AO scope) OR by moving the reticle back and forth (side focus, or SF scope.) In other words, AO scope works much like a camera lens focus by rotating the objective lens (the lens elements further away from the eye) on threads so they move back and forth, while the SF style moves an inner lens group containing the reticle back and forth. Different processes, same results.

Finally, what about the ocular (the lens elements closest to the eye) diopter adjustment? That is simply there to bring an image that we know is sharp in focus to fit your eye. With scopes, this is easiest done by pointing the scope to any "blank" area, closing your eyes for a moment to rest them, then looking through the scope. If the reticle is in focus, the diopter adjustment is good. Lock it in place and forget it.

Please bear in mind I'm not an expert, so do your own research to verify (or disprove) my statements. I won't cry if I'm off-base.

Having said that, if someone had explained the above to me years ago, I would have saved a lot of frustration - and money as well... .

Let the games begin!

Could have fooled me on the not being an expert part, your explanation is fantastic.
 
Pretty much nailed it... center fire rifle scope on a rimfire shooting at 50m is not ideal. There is a reason they make rimfire scopes which are designed for shooting at shorter distances. For any target shooting I like to have adjustable parallax, for hunting fixed is fine but match up rimfire rifles with a rimfire scope.
 
A few years back I purchased a Nikon Prostaff 4-12x40, for the same reasons OP did. And as OP, I was initially flustered about the "unsharp" view at 50m distance, when set at 12 power. As I "zoomed out," the image got sharper. By the way, the reticle remained in focus. What gives?

Then the light bulb went on: This was much like optics in photography - we are talking about depth of field (the distance between the nearest and farthest object in front that are in acceptable sharp focus) which diminishes as the magnification increases. Conversely, the depth of field increases as the magnification decreases. Ok, so there's nothing wrong with my scope (Nikon Prostaff is, by the way, it's nice glass for the money.) As it turns out, anything beyond 100m (to infinity) is in acceptable sharp focus at the full power range.

In other words, this was never intended to be a short-distance target scope. It works as designed.

Now, time to don Nomex: I think there is a lot of confusion and misinformation about parallax (the difference in the apparent position of an object when viewed along two different lines of sight - with rifle scopes, this refers to any movement of eye position away from the optical center of the scope) and focus (converging the light rays in a manner that brings clarity and definition to the object(s) we are looking at.) These are two different things: Sharp focus requires movement of specific lens elements towards or away from the viewer; Eliminating parallax error requires the reticle (crosshairs) to be placed precisely at either the first OR the second focal plane inside the scope (the two separate points where light rays "cross" each other inside the scope tube.) So the two are related, but not the same.

With lower magnification scopes we generally never worry about parallax, as the potential error is always minimal. The reticle is positioned at the factory to the "best" setting for the intended use of the optic. When hunting, the bullet placement variance of 1/4" at 200 yards makes no difference.

With higher magnification scopes and precision shooting, the ability of the user to adjust reticle placement is important. This is achieved either by moving the front lens group (adjustable objective, or AO scope) OR by moving the reticle back and forth (side focus, or SF scope.) In other words, AO scope works much like a camera lens focus by rotating the objective lens (the lens elements further away from the eye) on threads so they move back and forth, while the SF style moves an inner lens group containing the reticle back and forth. Different processes, same results.

Finally, what about the ocular (the lens elements closest to the eye) diopter adjustment? That is simply there to bring an image that we know is sharp in focus to fit your eye. With scopes, this is easiest done by pointing the scope to any "blank" area, closing your eyes for a moment to rest them, then looking through the scope. If the reticle is in focus, the diopter adjustment is good. Lock it in place and forget it.

Please bear in mind I'm not an expert, so do your own research to verify (or disprove) my statements. I won't cry if I'm off-base.

Having said that, if someone had explained the above to me years ago, I would have saved a lot of frustration - and money as well... .

Let the games begin!

Holy fudge... there's a science to this stuff after all.

Probably the most detailed answer that I've seen so far, definitely makes some good points. I was searching Adjustable Objective and was really confused by it but it seems rather straightforward now.
 
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