Scope mounts

bigHUN

bigHUN

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Aurora/ON
I am new to pb - F class firearms... coming here for education.
For my air rifles I have couple "two piece" adjustable elevation scope mounts I can preset the MOA angle for my games.
Let say the rear ring is elevated 1mm compared to front ring (I don't care for what MOA would that be), and I zeroed the scope at 50 meters (with a scope turret in middle of vertical travel), that gives me a comfortable turret up/down travel between 20 and 100 meters.
Talking about this one: https://eaglevisioncam.com/shop/scope-mount/infinity-elevation-ajustable-scope-mount-30mm-ring-picatinny-ips-30
Building now a custom 308 Match rifle, and I assume a single piece scope mount would be my best solution. Tinkering about ordering one of these, because so far that Brand fabrication quality was working pretty well for my other games...
https://eaglevisioncam.com/product-category/scope-mount

If I would zero the scope at 200 meters, what total MOA range (single piece scope mount) could cover me from 50 to 600? How much would be a vertical drop between 50 and 600 meters?
 
Most people just go with a 20-30 MOA base, as 308 has more recoil than airguns and chances are you'll notice that the recoil will allow your scope to drop, if you are using those moa height adjustable rings. I wouldnt trust them on anything but a rimfire. Welcome to PB forget anything that has to do with airguns.

You could get a 20-30 moa base and then burris signature scope rings that can do up to 30 moa extra adjustment if need be.

Vertical drop would depend on your ammunition, your barrel length and MV and your optic. Most people that shoot F class reload their own ammo and tuned for their gun.
 
OkayShooter said:
Most people just go with a 20-30 MOA base, as 308 has more recoil than airguns and chances are you'll notice that the recoil will allow your scope to drop, if you are using those moa height adjustable rings. I wouldnt trust them on anything but a rimfire. Welcome to PB forget anything that has to do with airguns. ...You could get a 20-30 moa base and then burris signature scope rings that can do up to 30 moa extra adjustment if need be...Vertical drop would depend on your ammunition, your barrel length and MV and your optic. Most people that shoot F class reload their own ammo and tuned for their gun.
Click to expand...

I am taking over the 308 from an older fella who actually started the project years ago and never finish it.
I know for a amo will have 155 gn point and a heavy long barrel, aprox 2500 fps but that speed need to confirm with a Labradar when the gun is finalized. For now I only have the FX radar that reads max up to 1200.
For optic for now I can borrow a Falcon X50T from my 100 meters BR air rifle, just to start with, but eventually I will dedicate one other F-class scope for this project.
As a first step I need a single piece mount to make it range testing ready. The eaglevision mounts I know them as quality fabricated, but definitely open to suggestions.
The Question was mostly what minimum - fixed - MOA elevation need to cover the distance between 50 and 600. Ah forgot, my scope is 50 MOA range on turrets.
 
bigHUN said:
I am new to pb - F class firearms... coming here for education.
For my air rifles I have couple "two piece" adjustable elevation scope mounts I can preset the MOA angle for my games.
Let say the rear ring is elevated 1mm compared to front ring (I don't care for what MOA would that be), and I zeroed the scope at 50 meters (with a scope turret in middle of vertical travel), that gives me a comfortable turret up/down travel between 20 and 100 meters.
Talking about this one: ...
Building now a custom 308 Match rifle, and I assume a single piece scope mount would be my best solution. Tinkering about ordering one of these, because so far that Brand fabrication quality was working pretty well for my other games...
...

If I would zero the scope at 200 meters, what total MOA range (single piece scope mount) could cover me from 50 to 600? How much would be a vertical drop between 50 and 600 meters?
Click to expand...

Unless something has been changed, you will have same issues with a single piece base as with two piece bases. When the three or four screws are snugged down on the one piece base, it is simply going to bend or warp to align itself with the receiver surfaces. You can see old school is to snug down the two on front - do you have a gap under rear end? Then remove those front screws and snug down rear screws - do you have a gap under front end? Tells you whether the base fits to that receiver. Then need to use known straight edge or similar to check if top of base is actually a "plane" or not, when both front and rear screws snugged up. Likely comes from old days , before CNC machining, when it was most common to try to install a base onto a receiver that someone had filed off the military stripper clip ridge - not uncommon, back then, to have to use shims or bedding to get the scope base both snug to the receiver, when screws tightened, as well as that "flat plane" on top surface. The idea is that you want to top surfaces of your base to be a plane - dead "flat" to each other where the rings sit. With the "tipped" bases - often called 20 MOA or whatever - the rear of the base is taller than the front of the base - compared to the bore centre line. Final check for me is to lap the bottom half of the rings when snugged to that base - just lapped enough to see if those bottom ring saddles are in line (concentric) with each other or not - else need to start over regarding shimming / bedding / etc.
 
bigHUN said:
I am taking over the 308 from an older fella who actually started the project years ago and never finish it.
I know for a amo will have 155 gn point and a heavy long barrel, aprox 2500 fps but that speed need to confirm with a Labradar when the gun is finalized. For now I only have the FX radar that reads max up to 1200.
For optic for now I can borrow a Falcon X50T from my 100 meters BR air rifle, just to start with, but eventually I will dedicate one other F-class scope for this project.
As a first step I need a single piece mount to make it range testing ready. The eaglevision mounts I know them as quality fabricated, but definitely open to suggestions.
The Question was mostly what minimum - fixed - MOA elevation need to cover the distance between 50 and 600. Ah forgot, my scope is 50 MOA range on turrets.
Click to expand...

You don't need a single piece mount.

Why ask our suggestions if you already got the answers?
 
Thanks guys, this what I need an education.
My initial idea was - with a single piece mount - that I could swap my existing scope between guns, assuming the CNC machined part I may not need to lap the rings.
Sight in the 308 whatever number of shots needed for Strelok calculations for Matches and put that pb gun in a locker, and still able to swap that scope back to my airgun for practice and training with mass shooting @ 100 BR. Until I get a new scope for this 308.
I don't know yet how this can work, but the idea was tickling my interest.

For example like this one:
https://www.burrisoptics.com/mounting-systems/ar-pepr-scope-mount
 
If you have a Mil Standard Pic rail on both rifles, you can easily swap the scope back and forth as the rail spacing is the same.
I would throw those adjustable rings out and get something decent, a one piece like you posted will work on Pic rails, but it's going to sit very high, I'd look for some decent pic rings instead of proper height.
 
Seeing that you are in Aurora I would suggest that you take in one of the Ontario Rifle Association’s Intro Days before spending too much money on scopes and mounts. If the rifle that you have has a 28”-30” barrel shooting 155 gr bullets your muzzle velocity will be around 2900-3000 fps. Not sure what the drop is from 50 yards to 300 yards, but the drop from 300 yards to 600 yards is about 11 minutes.
 
I got to my first roadblock and need your help.
Started taking apart this Rem 700 gun, as a start to replace the top (scope) rail to picatinny so I can reuse my existing scope and mounts.
This existing rail on the gun doesn't accepts my pic/nato scope mounts, the spacing is not the same.... I am loosing the interchangeability.
Fine I will replace that rail, I picked up today one AO rail from the store (they had also MDT), and when I got home noticing a difference again.
The mounting holes spacing is different and the (anarchy outdoors) rail base is much narrower.
The existing rail that I removed have an engraving A&N also the rings A&N ULTRA MI. The front of the base is a radius and the rear is more flatter in the middle. No bueno.
Searching the web for similar but looks like I am not using the right keywords.
 
So you are trying to use a scope and mount setup for your airgun? Unfortunately you are going to have to move the rings for the new base. As I'm sure the ring spacing you originally setup wasn't true.

Just because it's picitinny doesn't mean it's Nato standard. Some cross slot are wider than others.

Best to buy another set of rings and ditch the whole dual purpose. Also you might run into the same issues with your idea of using a 1 piece, and yet to see a F class rifle with anything but 2 piece scope rings.
 
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OkayShooter said:
So you are trying to use a scope and mount setup for your airgun? Unfortunately you are going to have to move the rings for the base. As I'm sure the ring spacing you originally setup wasn't true.
Click to expand...

Yes Sir, partially this what I am trying to do.
I am trying to reuse my Tier 1 scope on both guns, with in mind that the 308 Match gun will be sitting in my locker 90% of time and I will use it for competition events only.
Training and practicing with airgun along the year and matches with 308, with a same scope... My airguns have a NATO/picatinny spec rails also my existing scope rings.
I can and most likely I will drop my money on new-decent scope mount rings, be that a single piece or two piece mount, with a quick release.
The goal is to mount a picatinny on the R700 action, just matter of time to locate the parts. This what I dig out so far, the drawing dimensions are correct to what I have measured.
https://www.riflescopewarehouse.com/the-best-picatinny-rails-for-remington-700-style-actions
 
In the store, just a quick looking by eye both the MDT and the AO picatinny rail bases were the same width (15.5 mm), but the Mil spec base at home (A&N) what I removed is 25.5 mm width. The marks on the rail bottom clearly shows the two different radiuses.
Unlucky me I didn't had it with me when I visited a store in my way back from the gunclub. Lessons learned.
I have couple more stores in reasonable driving distance, but trying my education first online.
 
bigHUN said:
In the store, just a quick looking by eye both the MDT and the AO picatinny rail bases were the same width (15.5 mm), but the Mil spec base at home (A&N) what I removed is 25.5 mm width. The marks on the rail bottom clearly shows the two different radiuses.
Unlucky me I didn't had it with me when I visited a store in my way back from the gunclub. Lessons learned.
I have couple more stores in reasonable driving distance, but trying my education first online.
Click to expand...

I thought your issue is the spacing, not the width. A mount for a Rem 700 isn't gonna be 100% flat as it cutout around the port to help load and eject. So only where it sits on the receiver should it be curved.

Plus the mount will be higher in the back than the front.

Honestly sounds like you should goto the local club and ask is there is any F class shooters or even precision. As hard to visualize when sorry we don't got the parts in front of us.

All I can understand is the way you got the rings space out on your scope, don't line up with the spacing on the mounts. So not sure how width plays in or the radius?
 
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Yes we talking about a same but my language must have been hard to interpret. Me better start using pictures.

This is some sort of standard drawing for REM 700 action block - mounting holes location:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/8j58...ey=rog91xe8t4wjlevavxjm8sj2n&st=vyha0hnf&dl=0

This is the rail that I removed from R700 action, would that be the old-old MIL spec I don't know never use these before...:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/p2kq...ey=dcnqqccnjvo5us1t2ybig0cpw&st=5e221e61&dl=0

I never saw this wide rail before, all what I could find in stores is some standard 15mm wide:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fp8m...ey=soa9jsokv9m20k2yoo2ejy0uq&st=6uwy1q0m&dl=0

The wider rail left the wider footprint:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/lwgm...ey=nhyruons76dj5uw4q58jduz6j&st=0p34mho6&dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/txet...ey=5e47csoaoklrla80k5ue1cdw6&st=ocaob8xz&dl=0

Anything new - picatinny rail I have seen online all would be much narrower. I don't really care but if I could find about the same width footprint maybe more side stability...
 
bigHUN said:
Edit:

All what I could find is, that no others making these wide base picatinny, but NightForce only, so far all other Brand making these narrow.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fp8m...ey=soa9jsokv9m20k2yoo2ejy0uq&st=dyfmucjo&dl=0

Still the pitch is a mystery.
Click to expand...

What you are measuring isnt part of the rail. But believe you are buying the wrong mount. Why there is difference in width.

There are 2 Rem 700 actions. Short action and long action. Most 308 are short action. Long action are for bigger calibers.

Unless it's not actually a Remington 700. But one of many f class custom actions as im sure a rem 700 is more rounded receiver.

Best to take it to a gunsmith.. or find a precsion or f class person local. As just getting confused more.
 
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Google Picatinny rail dimensions vs. Weaver Rail dimensions. Looks like you have a Weaver rail on your rifle and are trying to match it up with a Picatinny rail slots for your Remington.
 
I can find a lot of Brand picatinny rails (or to call them picatinny bases) that are meant for the Rem 700 short action.
I was just hoping to find the same - wider base - that I removed. Looks like Nightforce made these some sort of MIL specs rails long back in time, a wide base but the "teethes" pitch shorter... must be some genuine part production that was outdated when picatinny got popular. They even selling the same today if anybody interested.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/ytid...ey=lctfjtsee48w3gd80valgmb3d&st=6yh4gakn&dl=0

No biggy Monday I am returning to the store, I need more stuff anyway.
 
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