Semi-Auto + Detachable Mag Shotguns in Canada
- Thread starter PECHENEG
- Start date
- Location
- East of Home, West of the Rest
Nothing I said even comes close to that idea.
A Mosin is a bolt action. The ten round mag you mention is designed for a bolt action. Thus no limits.
If you used an AR15 rifle mag in a bolt action, then the ar15 rifle mag would still be limited to 5 rounds as it was designed originally as a semi auto rifle mag.
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IF ANYONE HAS MORE LINKS To DETACHABLE MAG and, at the same time, SEMI-AUTO SHOTGUNS, available in CANADA, please POST
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IF ANYONE HAS MORE LINKS To DETACHABLE MAG and, at the same time, SEMI-AUTO SHOTGUNS, available in CANADA, please POST
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Here is another one: detachable tubular mag
semi-auto
not sure if available in CANADA
HUGE CAPACITY MAG, likely will be pinned in here
extreme price 2000+
SRM 1216 12g shotgun
was here on CGN in 2012: http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...gun-SRM-1216?p=7726771&viewfull=1#post7726771
semi-auto
not sure if available in CANADA
HUGE CAPACITY MAG, likely will be pinned in here
extreme price 2000+
SRM 1216 12g shotgun
was here on CGN in 2012: http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...gun-SRM-1216?p=7726771&viewfull=1#post7726771
PECHENEG, you need to read this:
Q: How many rounds can I have in my gun?
A: This is a never ending source of confusion. Pay attention, I'll try to sort it out.
SHORT ANSWER:
Rimfire rifle magazines - no limits
Magazines designed for centerfire or rimfire pistols - 10 rounds
Magazines designed for centerfire bolt/pump/lever firearms - no limit.
Magazines designed for centerfire semi-automatic rifles - 5 rounds
LONG ANSWER:
First thing to understand is that there is FEDERAL FIREARMS LAW, there is FEDERAL HUNTING LAW (Migratory game birds, ducks and geese), and there are different PROVINCIAL HUNTING LAWS.
First up, the federal firearms laws. This is the one we all have to follow, whether we hunt or not.
-For rifles with any type of action other than semi-auto, there is no limit! NONE, ZERO, ZILTCH, NADA.
Same for .22 rimfire, even if it is semi-auto. No Limit. A 50 round mag for a R***r 10-22 is fine.
-For semi-auto centrefire rifles, the limit is 5 rounds.
Note that this is 5 rounds in the mag, and does not include the one in the chamber. 6 rounds total, if the design permits it.
The one exception is for the M1 Garand, as it uses 8 round clips.
Also, any belt/link designed for belt fed machine guns designed before 1945 is exempted from the 5 rounds rule. A .223 belt would not qualify, based on age.
-For handguns, the mag limit is 10 rounds. Again, 10 plus one in the tube, 11 total.
Strangely enough, the wording is such, that the limits are on what the mag was designed for, rather than what it is used in at the moment. So if a rifle and a handgun use the SAME mag, and you switch them around, the mag that came out of the rifle would still be limited to 5, even if used in a handgun, while the 10 round handgun mag would in this case be OK in a rifle.
I don't make the rules, I just report them.
A good part of the confusion rests with the Fed FA laws getting confused with hunting laws, both Federal and provincial.
Migratory bird hunting is subject to federal rules. These laws state that the gun (a shotgun, obviously) be limited to 3 rounds total. That is a total of three, as in one in the chamber and two in the magazine. Most semi-auto shotguns have a removeable plug that allows you have 5 rounds when you are not hunting migratory birds. If you want to hunt crows, starlings, etc. or if you want to do a Tactical shoot, the Migratory rules do not apply. However the Federal Firearms Laws still do, so 5 rounds max for a semi. (No limit for a pump shotty!)
Provincial hunting rules differ across the country. Check in your area.
As with the full metal jacket ammo issue above, some Firearm instructors started by teaching hunting courses, so have the habit of mixing hunting and firearms law together, incorrectly.
Another source of confusion is the bizarre legal language the federal laws use. An example of this is the case of the Lee-Enfield magazine. It is a 10 rounder. As it is used in a bolt action, there are NO size limits. However, during WW2, there was a training gun made from old Lee-Enfields converted to Full-Auto fire (it can be done, but it was a pig-ugly contraption).
http://ww w.guncity.co.nz/303-charlt...idp129426.html
Consequently, the laws make a specific exemption for the L-E mag, even though it is not neccesary to do so, as the mag was designed for the bolt action L-E rifle.
Not easy to follow, and I may well be corrected myself. (Twice, so far!)
This is from the Newbie FAQ Section.
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...-START-HERE-Newbie-Frequently-Asked-Questions
Pecheneg, do you have a PAL yet?
Either your instructor did a piss-poor job of explaining it, or you didnt close enough attention.
Q: How many rounds can I have in my gun?
A: This is a never ending source of confusion. Pay attention, I'll try to sort it out.
SHORT ANSWER:
Rimfire rifle magazines - no limits
Magazines designed for centerfire or rimfire pistols - 10 rounds
Magazines designed for centerfire bolt/pump/lever firearms - no limit.
Magazines designed for centerfire semi-automatic rifles - 5 rounds
LONG ANSWER:
First thing to understand is that there is FEDERAL FIREARMS LAW, there is FEDERAL HUNTING LAW (Migratory game birds, ducks and geese), and there are different PROVINCIAL HUNTING LAWS.
First up, the federal firearms laws. This is the one we all have to follow, whether we hunt or not.
-For rifles with any type of action other than semi-auto, there is no limit! NONE, ZERO, ZILTCH, NADA.
Same for .22 rimfire, even if it is semi-auto. No Limit. A 50 round mag for a R***r 10-22 is fine.
-For semi-auto centrefire rifles, the limit is 5 rounds.
Note that this is 5 rounds in the mag, and does not include the one in the chamber. 6 rounds total, if the design permits it.
The one exception is for the M1 Garand, as it uses 8 round clips.
Also, any belt/link designed for belt fed machine guns designed before 1945 is exempted from the 5 rounds rule. A .223 belt would not qualify, based on age.
-For handguns, the mag limit is 10 rounds. Again, 10 plus one in the tube, 11 total.
Strangely enough, the wording is such, that the limits are on what the mag was designed for, rather than what it is used in at the moment. So if a rifle and a handgun use the SAME mag, and you switch them around, the mag that came out of the rifle would still be limited to 5, even if used in a handgun, while the 10 round handgun mag would in this case be OK in a rifle.
I don't make the rules, I just report them.
A good part of the confusion rests with the Fed FA laws getting confused with hunting laws, both Federal and provincial.
Migratory bird hunting is subject to federal rules. These laws state that the gun (a shotgun, obviously) be limited to 3 rounds total. That is a total of three, as in one in the chamber and two in the magazine. Most semi-auto shotguns have a removeable plug that allows you have 5 rounds when you are not hunting migratory birds. If you want to hunt crows, starlings, etc. or if you want to do a Tactical shoot, the Migratory rules do not apply. However the Federal Firearms Laws still do, so 5 rounds max for a semi. (No limit for a pump shotty!)
Provincial hunting rules differ across the country. Check in your area.
As with the full metal jacket ammo issue above, some Firearm instructors started by teaching hunting courses, so have the habit of mixing hunting and firearms law together, incorrectly.
Another source of confusion is the bizarre legal language the federal laws use. An example of this is the case of the Lee-Enfield magazine. It is a 10 rounder. As it is used in a bolt action, there are NO size limits. However, during WW2, there was a training gun made from old Lee-Enfields converted to Full-Auto fire (it can be done, but it was a pig-ugly contraption).
http://ww w.guncity.co.nz/303-charlt...idp129426.html
Consequently, the laws make a specific exemption for the L-E mag, even though it is not neccesary to do so, as the mag was designed for the bolt action L-E rifle.
Not easy to follow, and I may well be corrected myself. (Twice, so far!)
This is from the Newbie FAQ Section.
http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...-START-HERE-Newbie-Frequently-Asked-Questions
Pecheneg, do you have a PAL yet?
Either your instructor did a piss-poor job of explaining it, or you didnt close enough attention.
tootall & claybuster
I feel sometimes confused , especially by newer design systems, which try to overcome 5rnds thing, and when mags from pistols are used for semi-auto rifles
I know the limit is 5 for centerfire, but then it depends on the action and caliber, and because there are ways around it creates confusion.
I took a course a while ago and I always double check with the guns I own if it is legal and what are the pitfalls. And this is very critical, always checking if you are still in the legal field, rather than remembering all small details, I suppose.
You in your post admit it can be confusing, how this refers to my PAL and me paying attention?
Again, the most important thing is staying legal and safe, and if you can have 30 rounds instead of 5-sure, the PAL courses teach you not to have 30 rounds when it is illegal.
If you use mosin with 5 rounds or 30-nobody cares, but if you use 30 on SKS-there is a problem, that's why most PAL courses tell you the rule of 5 for center fire and then it is up to you to find if you can go higher and be legal.
So I am fine, but thanks for care about my PAL and reminding re: 5 rounds non semi-auto thing.
Anyways, let's go back to the topic.. semi-auto Shotguns with detachable mags, available in Canada
Thanks
I feel sometimes confused , especially by newer design systems, which try to overcome 5rnds thing, and when mags from pistols are used for semi-auto rifles
I know the limit is 5 for centerfire, but then it depends on the action and caliber, and because there are ways around it creates confusion.
I took a course a while ago and I always double check with the guns I own if it is legal and what are the pitfalls. And this is very critical, always checking if you are still in the legal field, rather than remembering all small details, I suppose.
You in your post admit it can be confusing, how this refers to my PAL and me paying attention?
Again, the most important thing is staying legal and safe, and if you can have 30 rounds instead of 5-sure, the PAL courses teach you not to have 30 rounds when it is illegal.
If you use mosin with 5 rounds or 30-nobody cares, but if you use 30 on SKS-there is a problem, that's why most PAL courses tell you the rule of 5 for center fire and then it is up to you to find if you can go higher and be legal.
So I am fine, but thanks for care about my PAL and reminding re: 5 rounds non semi-auto thing.
Anyways, let's go back to the topic.. semi-auto Shotguns with detachable mags, available in Canada
Thanks
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WRONG.
5 rounds for a mag DESIGNED for a centrefire SEMI AUTO RIFLE or SHOTGUN. You need to see the big picture.
There are THREE parts to the equation:
--Centrefire
--Semi auto
--Longarm (Rifle or Shotgun)
If the mag is for a bolt or pump, then NO limit.
If the mag is for a RIMFIRE RIFLE, then NO limit. (Even for a semi like the Ruger 10/22)
All PISTOL mags are 10 Max., even if for rimfire.
If a mag was DESIGNED FOR A PISTOL, and it happens to fit a RIFLE, it is still allowed to be 10.
Sorry for SHOUTING,but I am trying to get your attention here...
Getting back to the original topic, semi 12 gauges, I enjoy my K12 Puma a lot.
I wrote this review for Calibre magazine.
http://calibremag.ca/norinco-k12-puma-a-bullpup-shotgun/
(Somehow an error crept into the article. It is NOT a Norinco product. It is entirely Lever Arms. My words were correct, the error came after I submitted my piece...)
Pecheneg, are you in Greater Vancouver area? If so, want to try out mine?
I wrote this review for Calibre magazine.
http://calibremag.ca/norinco-k12-puma-a-bullpup-shotgun/
(Somehow an error crept into the article. It is NOT a Norinco product. It is entirely Lever Arms. My words were correct, the error came after I submitted my piece...)
Pecheneg, are you in Greater Vancouver area? If so, want to try out mine?
tootall,
my point is that PAL courses teach you about 5-just as an over-precaution, I guess
whatever is higher is variations, they want you to know 5 rounds for centrefire... and then if you are interested you may explore... or find people like you and ask for a free advice
I am trying to get my point too: I understand, that what you say is CORRECT, I will not even check that, but this is already kind of too detailed for the course.
I definitely appreciate your time and very useful detailed info (no sarcasm), unlike Win/64.
Unfortunately, not in BC( thanks for proposing though
I am thinking about PUMA, looks like a small little beast...except the gas you inhale I guess, is it that bad?
my point is that PAL courses teach you about 5-just as an over-precaution, I guess
whatever is higher is variations, they want you to know 5 rounds for centrefire... and then if you are interested you may explore... or find people like you and ask for a free advice
I am trying to get my point too: I understand, that what you say is CORRECT, I will not even check that, but this is already kind of too detailed for the course.
I definitely appreciate your time and very useful detailed info (no sarcasm), unlike Win/64
.Unfortunately, not in BC
( thanks for proposing thoughI am thinking about PUMA, looks like a small little beast...except the gas you inhale I guess, is it that bad?
tootall,
my point is that PAL courses teach you about 5-just as an over-precaution, I guess
whatever is higher is variations, they want you to know 5 rounds for centrefire... and then if you are interested you may explore... or find people like you and ask for a free advice
I am trying to get my point too: I understand, that what you say is CORRECT, I will not even check that, but this is already kind of too detailed for the course.
Unfortunately, not in BC
I am thinking about PUMA, looks like a small little beast...except the gas you inhale I guess, is it that bad?
You don't get it do you... This Shyte is posted in the wrong Forum. Can I Hear a Hell Ya??
If your pump uses an ar mag... ie remingtion 7610 ... you are still limited to a 5 shot mag... you can not be In possession of a 30 rd ar mag regardless if it is a bolt or pump. .. only time you could possess such a mag is if it was proprietary to that firearm
