Shooting grouse while big-game hunting - experience of noise on big game?

wasa

wasa

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My group was successful in getting a moose tag (Ontario) so this fall will be my first moose hunt (yay!). We will also have deer and bear tags. I've been deer and bear hunting in the past (successful) and I feel that while big game hunting I don't want to make excessive noise, so no small game hunting (grouse, rabbit, etc) anywhere near the areas where I big game hunt. Bringing a pellet pistol or 2 firearms (big game gun plus a 22LR for example) is, AFAIK, not permitted in Ontario while hunting big game. But I don't want to focus on small game vs big game hunting - I'm interested in making (or not making) noise. Moose/deer/bears have good hearing.

A couple of guys in my group feel I'm wrong - that shooting grouse will not affect seeing large game. One guy is planning on bringing a 22LR, another guy a 410 shotgun. They claim that they'd be hunting small game around camp, but not while actually moose hunting "away" from camp. I'm not going to convince them to not shoot grouse (it's not "my" hunt so I'm not rocking the boat) and, to be fair, I'd love to shoot a few grouse to eat for supper.

So, I'm asking about other people's experience. Has your group shot a lot of small game and also seen big game? Or have you shot a lot of small game and subsequently seen no big game at all?

I'm more interested in actual real world experiences vs "everyone knows you don't shoot a shotgun for grouse while on a moose hunt"

We're going north of Thunder Bay if that makes a difference.

Thanks
 
Carrying any firearm of a class not permitted for hunting big game is an offense,a list of which may be found in The Summary. If your partners carry an unpermitted small game firearm at the same time they're hunting big game,they could be in for some major problems. We may do one or the other,but,not both at the same time.
 
wasa said:
My group was successful in getting a moose tag (Ontario) so this fall will be my first moose hunt (yay!). We will also have deer and bear tags. I've been deer and bear hunting in the past (successful) and I feel that while big game hunting I don't want to make excessive noise, so no small game hunting (grouse, rabbit, etc) anywhere near the areas where I big game hunt. Bringing a pellet pistol or 2 firearms (big game gun plus a 22LR for example) is, AFAIK, not permitted in Ontario while hunting big game. But I don't want to focus on small game vs big game hunting - I'm interested in making (or not making) noise. Moose/deer/bears have good hearing.

A couple of guys in my group feel I'm wrong - that shooting grouse will not affect seeing large game. One guy is planning on bringing a 22LR, another guy a 410 shotgun. They claim that they'd be hunting small game around camp, but not while actually moose hunting "away" from camp. I'm not going to convince them to not shoot grouse (it's not "my" hunt so I'm not rocking the boat) and, to be fair, I'd love to shoot a few grouse to eat for supper.

So, I'm asking about other people's experience. Has your group shot a lot of small game and also seen big game? Or have you shot a lot of small game and subsequently seen no big game at all?

I'm more interested in actual real world experiences vs "everyone knows you don't shoot a shotgun for grouse while on a moose hunt"

We're going north of Thunder Bay if that makes a difference.

Thanks
Click to expand...

i ve shots ducks, grouse, ptarmigan in area where there is no that much hunting pressure and moose and caribou did not care ... bears will not stay around for sure and if you re in more populated areas with humans well in that case moose learnt and will not stay around ... at least my experience while hunting moose in quebec ...
 
Not sure about the noise thing - was a VERY BIG DEAL with my Dad - not ever going to be firing at a coyote when he was pushing bush for deer!! However, some years ago, our son spotted a group of whitetail crossing an opening - I made very large circle down wind and shot the buck at about 25 yards - at that time, our son was perhaps 100 yards into that bush, leaning against a tree with his scope on the rest of that herd as they passed by on a trail - he says there was absolutely no reaction among those deer to the sound of my shot.

My brother in Grande Cache, Alberta and his hunting partner, both told me of experiences that a shot at game - elk, usually - would bring a grizzly from next valley - as if they had learned that sound of a shot often meant a gut pile. His partner also had a grizzly take a white tail that he shot - before he got to it - but clearly saw that bear come out of the bush and grab that deer. So, I suspect is about what the animals have been "trained" about - I notice coyotes around here are on the run, away from you, on sight, whether you are carrying a rifle or not. When I was a kid at my Uncle's farm, could leave the barn carrying a pitch fork - magpies seemed to ignore us, but tried that with a .22 or a pellet gun and they would go - without giving us a chance for a shot.
 
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I can't speak to moose or bear .... but whitetails seem to not care much about gun shots in my area.

I own 150 acres in Ontario east of Ottawa. The area is mostly agricultural and small villages with smaller pockets of forests.
I have a trail camera set up around 100 meters from camp and my camp is also the place where I pattern test my shotguns or sight in my rifles.
On several occasions now, and after a shooting session at camp (normally between 10 and 50 shots center-fire or shotgun rounds) my trail camera has taken pictures of deer and within half an hour of me finishing shooting. On those picts the deer acted "normal" and not stressed .... licking the salt block .... grazing ... etc.

It would seem that whitetails don't care much about shooting ... or they get used to it ...
 
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Looking good for chickens this fall in NWO, lots of successful broods seeing quite a few on my highway and back road travels

Don’t go chicken hunting without a bow, rifle whatever if you have a tag.
Have your group learn the difference between ruffed, spruce and sharptail, (some people will intentionally avoid spruce and sharptails)

The moose won’t care. But if your pressed for time, I’d concentrate on filling your tag
 
I think your confusing small game hunting only and having a large caliber rifle with you or something weird like a drillings or combo gun(in regards to the regs)
 
Trimmer 905 said:
Carrying any firearm of a class not permitted for hunting big game is an offense,a list of which may be found in The Summary. If your partners carry an unpermitted small game firearm at the same time they're hunting big game,they could be in for some major problems. We may do one or the other,but,not both at the same time.
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Trimmer 905, what province are you talking about?
 
Trimmer 905 said:
Carrying any firearm of a class not permitted for hunting big game is an offense,a list of which may be found in The Summary. If your partners carry an unpermitted small game firearm at the same time they're hunting big game,they could be in for some major problems. We may do one or the other,but,not both at the same time.
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What about drillings? Have they joined the ranks of prohibs?
 
Use a pellet gun under 500 fps as they’re not considered firearms for hunting purposes.

Or, get a Hammond Game Getter that allows you to shoot low powered loads out of your big game rifle. I have one for my 22-250 and it shoots groups at 40 yards that are the same as your average 22lr.



As for gunfire scaring off game? Most critters run a short distance and carry on with their day, unless being followed.
 
Trimmer 905 said:
Carrying any firearm of a class not permitted for hunting big game is an offense,a list of which may be found in The Summary. If your partners carry an unpermitted small game firearm at the same time they're hunting big game,they could be in for some major problems. We may do one or the other,but,not both at the same time.
Click to expand...



Ontario Hunting Regulations:

https://www.ontario.ca/files/2023-05/mnrf-2023-hunting-regulations-summary-en-2023-05-03.pdf


Page 91:

"If you are hunting small game in an area where
there is an open season for deer, moose, elk or
black bear, you may not possess or use a centre-fire
rifle or shells loaded with ball or with shot larger
than No. 2 shot (non-toxic equivalents include
steel shot larger than triple BBB, or bismuth larger
than double BB), unless you possess a valid licence
to hunt big game (deer, moose, elk or black bear)
during the relevant open season."
 
canadian hunter312 said:
Use a pellet gun under 500 fps as they’re not considered firearms for hunting purposes.

Or, get a Hammond Game Getter that allows you to shoot low powered loads out of your big game rifle. I have one for my 22-250 and it shoots groups at 40 yards that are the same as your average 22lr.
...
Click to expand...

All of this is a non issue .... OP is in Ontario and I assume he will be hunting in Ontario.

Ontario hunting regs are clear .... as long as you have a license for small game and moose/deer/bear ..... you are allowed to carry firearms and ammunition for small game and large game ....


Can we get this thread back on track to answer OP's question?
 
Ok, trying to get back on track..... I am asking about noise and scaring away game.

I am actually talking about small game hunting, and ONLY small game hunting around the camp. So, no one is planning on carrying multiple firearms. Example - while Buddy A is boiling water for coffee or making supper/lunch, Buddy B takes his 22LR or 410 and starts walking around looking for grouse. I suspect we will be big-game hunting within a couple km of camp but it's possible that it will be further away.

One guy is saying he comes back to camp for lunch. He plans on walking around with his 410 during his "lunch hour" (not carrying his centerfire rifle).

No one is planning or is anticipated to break any rules or regulations.

Since Ontario allows deer/moose/bear to be taken with a slug from any shotgun (including 410) (see Summary of firearms restrictions for hunting in Ontario for verification) I suspect that the guy bringing his 410 will have some slugs with him.


I personally am not a fan, and all of the deer/bear hunting I have done with my dad & friends I've always said no shooting/hunting small game. I know it is legal to shoot a grouse with a 303 British or 7mm Mag, but I have no intention of doing so. I am debating on bringing up a 22LR or a shotgun to hunt at times I'm in camp.

This website https://earinc.com/gunfire-noise-level-reference-chart/ indicates that a 410 is comparable to a 20g and a 12g for noise.
 
0faustus0 said:
Trimmer 905, what province are you talking about?
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Ontario.

0faustus0 said:

Ontario Hunting Regulations:

https://www.ontario.ca/files/2023-05/mnrf-2023-hunting-regulations-summary-en-2023-05-03.pdf


Page 91:

"If you are hunting small game in an area where
there is an open season for deer, moose, elk or
black bear, you may not possess or use a centre-fire
rifle or shells loaded with ball or with shot larger
than No. 2 shot (non-toxic equivalents include
steel shot larger than triple BBB, or bismuth larger
than double BB), unless you possess a valid licence
to hunt big game (deer, moose, elk or black bear)
during the relevant open season."
Click to expand...

Please see the restrictions beginning on page 28 of The Summary which defines firearms. Then,go to page 85 and read the first paragraph in the Black Bear section. As for the OP's question of using a pellet gun to take small game at the same time as hunting big game,it appears that section of The FWCA has been removed. I would be checking with the local OMNRF office enforcement for clarification. Amendments are listed as of June 2023. It always pays to leave nothing to chance.
 
The noise won’t scare potential moose and it’s dumb to chicken hunt without a suitable rifle for your tag. Moose walking through or near camp is nothing new.

Some people need better reading comprehension on the regs
 
0faustus0 said:
Ok, who has first hand experience about gun shots on moose or bear behavior?

The legality of hunting small game at the same time as hunting moose or bear in Ontario is settled!!
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I have shot moose, bear and deer after shooting partridge, and in one case shooting a coyote about 5 minutes beforehand.
I have also witnessed moose not flinching at all when a hunter shot an animal about 100 yards away from it.
Cat
 
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