Hey guys, just wondering how reliable a medium sized case with a small rifle primer would be in a Canadian winter. I'm in the brainstorming stage of a 6.5 build and am wondering if the small primer in 6.5x47 would be a downside in these conditions. I'm debating 6.5 lapua vs. .260 rem, but want to set all other aspects of the two aside for now. I will likely need advice on other merits/downfalls of each in the near future, but let's talk ignition first.
Small rifle primer in a "medium sized" case-cold weather
- Thread starter Jmiverson
- Start date
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
I have found problems with 223 using standard SR primers in the winter.
I use CCI450. Not sure how that will translate to almost twice as much powder???
YMMV.
Jerry
I use CCI450. Not sure how that will translate to almost twice as much powder???
YMMV.
Jerry
Thx Jerry. I have heard enough reports of small rifle primer fails in winter, but I have not had this issue in my .223s. Nevertheless, if a magnum primer CAN fail with 24-27 grs of powder, you have a very valid point. So far, I'm thinking the reliability of a .260 outweighs the 6.5L "cool factor".
I had a 6x47 Lapua which had small primers. With 38 grains of Reloader 15 and 115s it was like shooting a muzzle loader in the cold. Click 1, 2 Bang. My solution was to use 6XC cases for the large primers - problem solved - in all weather.
There is a recent marketing effort by some brass manufacturers to convince guys to try up to a 308 Win with small primers. Funny thing is some guys seem to swear by them - in the summer time. I've never heard of anyone puling it off in the cold. Not to say that it couldn't be done. You would just have to use light bullets and fast powder and dial the load down accordingly. You wont get optimal velocity but you wouldn't get a hang fire either. It's either that or just use large primers.
There is a recent marketing effort by some brass manufacturers to convince guys to try up to a 308 Win with small primers. Funny thing is some guys seem to swear by them - in the summer time. I've never heard of anyone puling it off in the cold. Not to say that it couldn't be done. You would just have to use light bullets and fast powder and dial the load down accordingly. You wont get optimal velocity but you wouldn't get a hang fire either. It's either that or just use large primers.
Last edited:
- Location
- Niagara Region, Ontario. For now
Never had a Primer fail and I shoot off a bench most in the winter.
Bigger issue is powder consistency between warm and cold weather.
Most accurate loads I have come up with in .223 came from H335 but I find myself choosing Varget more and more to save myself having to work up 2 different loads.
Same principle applies to my .270 deer rifle, and I chose H4831 for a little more consistency between summer practice, and winter hunting conditions.
Bigger issue is powder consistency between warm and cold weather.
Most accurate loads I have come up with in .223 came from H335 but I find myself choosing Varget more and more to save myself having to work up 2 different loads.
Same principle applies to my .270 deer rifle, and I chose H4831 for a little more consistency between summer practice, and winter hunting conditions.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
I use MAGNUM primers in the winter NO problems.
NOT reg. primers.
Colder needs more spark.
Jerry
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
There are a number of shooters pushing SR 308 cases to very elevated pressures during summer shooting. I don't recommend it due to risk of action failures but some shooters are ok with that risk.
The SR 308 concept was tried decades ago and it didn't work so well then either.
I would be surprised if the SR primer 308 brass gave 100% ignition in the cold but not about to test as my results using LR primers have been satisfactory to date.
In fact, I am moving to Magnum LR primers in my FTR loading. Limited chronie testing has shown very small velocity spreads. Groups at 250yds have been flat like pancake so all very promising stuff.
Jerry
The SR 308 concept was tried decades ago and it didn't work so well then either.
I would be surprised if the SR primer 308 brass gave 100% ignition in the cold but not about to test as my results using LR primers have been satisfactory to date.
In fact, I am moving to Magnum LR primers in my FTR loading. Limited chronie testing has shown very small velocity spreads. Groups at 250yds have been flat like pancake so all very promising stuff.
Jerry
paperslayer
Regular
- Location
- Chilliwack
Been shooting nearly every BR case variant since the case came out in winter club shoots and I have never once had a failed ignition with a BR4. Done lots with the 6.5X47 Lapua case and the 222 Remington magnum cases and never once had a problem in winter. Lots of lore about ball powders on the internet.
Oh ok, I thought cci 450s were a magnum primer. I understand the plus of a SR primer in cases like the PPC line, but it sounds a bit finicky with more powder. The powder I choose will likely be a Hodgon extreme or imr 8208, to avoid any temp. inconsistency there.
BadAsMo, are you saying you formed 6.5x47 out of 6xc brass? I would hate to have a firing pin "bushed" for a SR primer then undo to run LR primers. I think I would be better off staring out with a LR primed case? Or did you just run a LR firing pin for both?
Thanks for the advice so far guys, keep it coming!
Correct, CCI 450 are magnum primers.
Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
If you are going to 1000yds, the 260Rem is the better choice regardless as the extra case volume is a very positive thing with the 139/142 family.
the 6.5x47L thrives with a 130gr. of course, you can go heavier but you will loose speed vs the larger case.
If going 260R and feel like experimenting, get some Lapua Palma and compare to standard brass.
Let us know how it works for you. H4831SC is ideal for the 260Rem and this bullet weight.
throat long and enjoy
Jerry
the 6.5x47L thrives with a 130gr. of course, you can go heavier but you will loose speed vs the larger case.
If going 260R and feel like experimenting, get some Lapua Palma and compare to standard brass.
Let us know how it works for you. H4831SC is ideal for the 260Rem and this bullet weight.
throat long and enjoy
Jerry
I did not modify my firing pin at all. It started when I tried to develop a load for a 6x47 with 115s and I could notice the ignition delay. After a while I got an idea to try forming 22-250 cases so I did. The side walls collapsed a bit but blew out the first time I shot them. My load testing with these cases from 22-250 worked great. Real low SDs and accuracy was awesome. Since I did not like the collapsed side wall problem with 22-250 case I decided to use 6xc brass because it is closer to my 6x47 case. It worked out great and shot extremely well.
No BS the rifle would often shoot .125" groups of 5 shots at 100 yards. 1/4 moa was a bad group and usually during heavy mirage. The barrel was toast after only about 900 rounds though.
I would expect much better barrel life from the 6.5x47 that you are considering. Just don't rule out the option to try large primers.
