So i have decided

Goozyman

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After some lengthy forum reading, I have decided on an M1 Garand as my "retro Deer Gun".
I will NOT be Bubbacizing it.
Iron sights all the way.

Now heres the kicker..
I want something that is NOT collector grade. Safe Queens need not apply.
MAtching numbers are not as important as a well functioning, sturdy rifle that is in good mechanical working order.
A few dings on the stock are irrelevant to me, as i anticipate probably a few additional dings from the gun actually being used.

How much should i expect to pay for a used but not dead, GArand?
What should i look for when purchasing such a beast?
and finally, are there any Reputable online retailers, [preferably a site sponsor] that could give an HONEST condition statement of a gun i would potentially buy?

thanks in advance
 
The firing pin broke on my Garand. I understand from former military users and collectors and shooters of the Garand that they have never experienced that kind of failure, or known about if anyone else ever had a broken firing pin.

Therefore, I would change the firing pin with a new one, before going hunting with a Garand.

Also, if you handload, install a gas bleed plug from MaCCain Industries, in order to avoid a bend gas piston rod from "hotter" handloads.
 
I have bought 4 of the PS Garands and each one required some degree of parts replacement and adjustment to achieve correct fit and function.Among the 4 I needed to replace all op rod springs(normal on a used Garand),2 broken safties,a cracked hammer spring housing,a cracked stock,2 rear sight covers,a gas cylinder which was excessively worn and a cracked gas cyl lock screw.All handguards were cracked or split requiring repair or replacement.All of the stocks needed shimming of the rear leg bearing surfaces and/or trigger housing seats to achieve an acceptably tight stock fit.There were also a number of other minor tweaks such as replacing/installing lower band pins to get a tight fit,and re-seating the stock ferrule,peening barrel splines for proper gas cyl fit,and swapping out gas cyl locks for a better fit.Cosmetics are another issue. All wood required steaming,gouge filling and re-finishing. Most exterior finish was well worn to the extent that re-parkerizing was desirable.

On the plus side all barrels were sound and un-pitted with acceptable wear indicated at throats and muzzles,altho all muzzles needed a clean-up to remove puckers and nicks.Headspace was within specs on all rifles and none exhibited any significant pitting.Based on my experiences and expectations, none of these were in a clean and shoot condition as received,although all have proven to be sound and attractive rifles after considerable restoration and adjustment.From a collectors aspect,all rifles retained a considerable percentage of original manufacturer's components.I have the tools, guages,and knowledge necessary to inspect and repair/re-build a Garand from buttplate to muzzle,so these have all been a worthwhile investment and an enjoyable project.I would even contemplate buying another as a project rifle.

On the ammunition side if one handloads and uses compatible MILSPEC propellants (IMR 4895/IMR 4064) and sticks to 150 or 165gr bullets there will be no problems with functionality or safely and no need of aftermarket gas relief devices.Proven loads for me in several dozen Garands incl a 150gr bullet with 47gr IMR 4895 or 48gr IMR 4064 and a 165/168gr bullet with 45gr IMR 4895 or 46gr IMR 4064.The gas relief devices may have a place if one uses commercial ammo which is loaded with a non-MILSPEC propellant.Most commercial .30-06 ammo is loaded with propellants slower than MILSPEC burning rate in order to achieve a higher muzzle velocity and appeal to those who believe that top velocity is essential.The good news is that the handloads that I have described yield excellent accuracy and functionality in a Garand.

A few caveats on safe reloading for a Garand in addition to correct propellants and bullet weights;always FL re-size your brass,make sure that primers are seated below flush with the casehead,keep the brass trimmed to spec,and don't try for more than 4 reloads beyond initial firing.

Final comment.If you are patient you should still be able to locate a Garand in sound shooting condition and acceptable cosmetic appearance for $800.If you wish to pursue matching collectors pieces,then the sky is the limit.
 
I have bought 4 of the PS Garands and each one required some degree of parts replacement and adjustment to achieve correct fit and function.Among the 4 I needed to replace all op rod springs(normal on a used Garand),2 broken safties,a cracked hammer spring housing,a cracked stock,2 rear sight covers,a gas cylinder which was excessively worn and a cracked gas cyl lock screw.All handguards were cracked or split requiring repair or replacement.All of the stocks needed shimming of the rear leg bearing surfaces and/or trigger housing seats to achieve an acceptably tight stock fit.There were also a number of other minor tweaks such as replacing/installing lower band pins to get a tight fit,and re-seating the stock ferrule,peening barrel splines for proper gas cyl fit,and swapping out gas cyl locks for a better fit.Cosmetics are another issue. All wood required steaming,gouge filling and re-finishing. Most exterior finish was well worn to the extent that re-parkerizing was desirable.

On the plus side all barrels were sound and un-pitted with acceptable wear indicated at throats and muzzles,altho all muzzles needed a clean-up to remove puckers and nicks.Headspace was within specs on all rifles and none exhibited any significant pitting.Based on my experiences and expectations, none of these were in a clean and shoot condition as received,although all have proven to be sound and attractive rifles after considerable restoration and adjustment.From a collectors aspect,all rifles retained a considerable percentage of original manufacturer's components.I have the tools, guages,and knowledge necessary to inspect and repair/re-build a Garand from buttplate to muzzle,so these have all been a worthwhile investment and an enjoyable project.I would even contemplate buying another as a project rifle.

On the ammunition side if one handloads and uses compatible MILSPEC propellants (IMR 4895/IMR 4064) and sticks to 150 or 165gr bullets there will be no problems with functionality or safely and no need of aftermarket gas relief devices.Proven loads for me in several dozen Garands incl a 150gr bullet with 47gr IMR 4895 or 48gr IMR 4064 and a 165/168gr bullet with 45gr IMR 4895 or 46gr IMR 4064.The gas relief devices may have a place if one uses commercial ammo which is loaded with a non-MILSPEC propellant.Most commercial .30-06 ammo is loaded with propellants slower than MILSPEC burning rate in order to achieve a higher muzzle velocity and appeal to those who believe that top velocity is essential.The good news is that the handloads that I have described yield excellent accuracy and functionality in a Garand.

A few caveats on safe reloading for a Garand in addition to correct propellants and bullet weights;always FL re-size your brass,make sure that primers are seated below flush with the casehead,keep the brass trimmed to spec,and don't try for more than 4 reloads beyond initial firing.

Final comment.If you are patient you should still be able to locate a Garand in sound shooting condition and acceptable cosmetic appearance for $800.If you wish to pursue matching collectors pieces,then the sky is the limit.


Thanks for the informative reply.
I think you just scared me away from buying used as i was looking for a "buy and fire" type Rifle.
Thats actually a GOOD thing, because you saved me some problems that certainly would have arisen in the very near future.
 
I am glad that purple included some reloads, which are at par with mil specs, and thus avoid the use of after marked gas bleed plugs.

I can also recommend a full fiberglass stock for your Garand.
 
I would also like to add, that during firing, the whole trigger/hammer module came off.

Eventually, I find out the hard way, that the Garand trigger guard also functions as a spring, that keeps the whole trigger/hammer module together in place by hooking to a hook, just behind the trigger.

With rubber mallet, I softly hammered the trigger guard, until it bend back enough into shape as a very tight leaf spring, and now it funtions very well, and the trigger guard/spring is very firmly locked into the small hook behing the trigger, and it never came off again during firing.
 
Thanks for the informative reply.
I think you just scared me away from buying used as i was looking for a "buy and fire" type Rifle.
Thats actually a GOOD thing, because you saved me some problems that certainly would have arisen in the very near future.

An M305/14 with the flush 5 rd. mag would be a good buy and fire rifle. Less money up front, Garand type action and .308 calibre. A lot of guys hunt with them. I know I do.
 
An M305/14 with the flush 5 rd. mag would be a good buy and fire rifle. Less money up front, Garand type action and .308 calibre. A lot of guys hunt with them. I know I do.

Thanks 300s, i will look into that, may also consider an Enfield.

Is Mosin Nagant ammo hard to come by? I see wuite a few of them for sale looking reasonably well kept.
 
Enfield # 4 is one of the most simple, inexpensive and reliable hunting guns around, and enough gun for all your hunting needs in Canada :)
 
Enfield # 4 is one of the most simple, inexpensive and reliable hunting guns around, and enough gun for all your hunting needs in Canada :)

Can't argue with logic like that. I agree, too.

Ones like this (not mine, no affiliation):

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=339177

come up in the EE all the time for around $150 and are definitely ready to shoot out of the box. Plus, it is a piece of Canadian history that was used in two world wars.

A second choice would be one of the Russian capture K98 Mausers that are all over the place. Less than $400, in a decent hunting caliber (8x57) and they have their own history. I have an unissued Yugo M-48 Mauser that I love and will eventually use to take a deer or two.

Mark
 
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Can't argue with logic like that. I agree, too.

Ones like this (not mine, no affiliation):

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=339177

come up in the EE all the time for around $150 and are definitely ready to shoot out of the box. Plus, it is a piece of Canadian history that was used in two world wars.

A second choice would be one of the Russian capture K98 Mausers that are all over the place. Less than $400, in a decent hunting caliber (8x57) and they have their own history. I have an unissued Yugo M-48 Mauser that I love and will eventually use to take a deer or two.

Mark

wow i didnt know enfields were sub 200.00 range
i would prefer something captured german or US army for nostalgia sake but a sub 200.00 gun that was brit/canadian would be fine with me..
now i just have to learn what to look for
 
wow i didnt know enfields were sub 200.00 range
i would prefer something captured german or US army for nostalgia sake but a sub 200.00 gun that was brit/canadian would be fine with me..
now i just have to learn what to look for

That is a sportered one. The full wood un-bubba'd ones are more like $350-$400 depending on condition.

From my limited experience, I would say that the No.4 Mk.1 or Mk.1* would be the best choices for use as a hunting rifle. It has a super slick action, great iron sights and is a nicely balanced piece.

I just inherited a bubba'd No.4 Mk.1 from my ex-FIL and it is a nice handling gun. I am itching to get out and see what it will do. I plan on taking my first deer with it this fall if everything goes according to plan.

Mark
 
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